hfs11 sticky ois at DVinfo.net

Olivier Jezequel · September 29th, 2009, 07:02 AM

Hi,
Is is me or all the video i see on vimeo testing the the hfs11 new optical stab are strobing when they pan ? i would rather say jumpy
is due to the ois trying to stick on the area you are leaving ? or is it just a vimeo compression issue.
(i am not even talking a fast pan, just normal ones)

I thinking about buying a s11 but if the ois create more problems than it solves, it would maybe be better to get a s10.
there is always some way to smooth your way of shooting but a sticky pan cannot be fixed

is someone had a closer look on that ?

thanks
Olivier

Kevin Bjorke · September 29th, 2009, 10:58 AM

It can be sticky with D-OIS.

Switch to Std IS, or turn it off.

If you're on a tripod you should have it turned off anyway.

Stuart Robinson · September 29th, 2009, 12:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Olivier Jezequel

Hi, Is is me or all the video i see on vimeo testing the the hfs11 new optical stab are strobing when they pan ?

Can you provide a specific example (URL)?

Olivier Jezequel · September 29th, 2009, 03:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stuart Robinson

Can you provide a specific example (URL)?

sure, have a look at these :
Canon Legria iVIS Vixia HF S11 test on Vimeo
HF S11's Stabilizer: Total Recall on Vimeo

cheers

Olivier Jezequel · September 29th, 2009, 03:38 PM

so there is a way to select the normal ois instesd of the the new one as an alternativ to switch it off ?

except the sticky bit and the higher capacity card, is there really some other difference between the s10 and s11 ?
i have to make my choice in the few weeks coming

cheers

Stuart Robinson · September 29th, 2009, 05:08 PM

Olivier, thanks for those links. I downloaded the original files and both show horrible artefacts, even on slow pans (and the shot of the flowers looks jerky to me too). I'd rather have the optical stabilisation in the S10/100 and run particularly wobbly shots through DeShaker.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Olivier Jezequel

so there is a way to select the normal ois instesd of the the new one as an alternativ to switch it off ?

The manual is here: http://gdlp01.c-wss.com/gds/1/030000...f11nim2-en.pdf ...and it isn't clear. Perhaps someone with an S11 can tell us whether there are different levels of IS.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Olivier Jezequel

except the sticky bit and the higher capacity card, is there really some other difference between the s10 and s11 ?

Not as far as I'm aware. And remember the HF S100 is also the same camera, only without the internal memory.

Kevin Bjorke · September 29th, 2009, 05:19 PM

I have one and you can set D-IS, Std IS, or no IS.

Sticky or not, the D-IS is actually pretty darned sweet if you don't move too fast side-to-side. Moving front-to-back is fantastic. Steady holds, fantastic.

The features of S11 over the others are disk space; Dynamic IS; the (accessory) LANC port; and the addition of a night mode (which I think just adds AGC limits to "fireworks" mode, but I could be wrong on that)

Robin Davies-Rollinson · September 30th, 2009, 01:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kevin Bjorke

The features of S11 over the others are: the (accessory) LANC port;

I think it's been proved that the LANC controller will also work on the HF S10/100 - Canon just haven't mentioned it...

Olivier Jezequel · September 30th, 2009, 03:01 AM

so does it really worse buying a s11 ? is the night mode is really an improvement compare to the s10 ? the lanc, i have no need for it and buying sd card is cheaper

i was excited about the s11 but now i am wondering....

thanks

Robin Davies-Rollinson · September 30th, 2009, 07:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Olivier Jezequel

i was excited about the s11 but now i am wondering....

thanks

Exactly - I was very keen to upgrade from the HF10 to the HF S100, and very glad I am that I did so, but the HF S11? I'm not convinced, especially as I rarely shoot anything off the tripod.

Kevin Bjorke · September 30th, 2009, 08:57 AM

We'll see about the LANC, Robin. My guess is that it DOES work on other cameras, but it's not "certified" to work by Canon.

I'm still waiting on mine, though -- B&H got the cameras, but not the LANC connectors.

Kevin Bjorke · September 30th, 2009, 11:49 AM

I tried uploading another sample to YT: YouTube - Canon HFS11 modes + Encoder Freakout?

I tried the Vimeo Preset too, which had even worse encoding artifacts

The D-IS is not jerky like that. If you watch the video, you'll see plenty of (.5 Hz?) jerkiness throughout, even on the STATIC shots :/

Olivier Jezequel · September 30th, 2009, 12:52 PM

some tests looks pretty convincing, even i see some look retimed... ????

but i guess, i am weak, i will buy s11 anyway :)

thanks

Kevin Bjorke · September 30th, 2009, 02:07 PM

Nothing retimed, it's just the $^&^!!! compression.

You can see some classic "CMOS rolling shutter slant" on the train footage, too. Comes with the territory.

-- and just this second: I got an email from B&H saying the RA-V1 is in stock

Kevin Bjorke · October 1st, 2009, 01:23 AM

I Posted an SD version of the previous vid : Canon HF S11 Mode Tests (SD Version) on Vimeo

the smaller image is much smoother -- the compression artifacts are well gone and you can see that while there can be a "bounce" from dynamic IS (when it's trying to catch up) there is NOT the "jerkiness" or "stickiness" previously mentioned.

September 29th, 2009, 07:02 AM	#1
Olivier Jezequel Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: London Posts: 45	hfs11 sticky ois Hi, Is is me or all the video i see on vimeo testing the the hfs11 new optical stab are strobing when they pan ? i would rather say jumpy is due to the ois trying to stick on the area you are leaving ? or is it just a vimeo compression issue. (i am not even talking a fast pan, just normal ones) I thinking about buying a s11 but if the ois create more problems than it solves, it would maybe be better to get a s10. there is always some way to smooth your way of shooting but a sticky pan cannot be fixed is someone had a closer look on that ? thanks Olivier

September 30th, 2009, 11:49 AM	#12
Kevin Bjorke Regular Crew Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: San Francisco, California Posts: 43	$%^#%!!! web encoding I tried uploading another sample to YT: YouTube - Canon HFS11 modes + Encoder Freakout? I tried the Vimeo Preset too, which had even worse encoding artifacts The D-IS is not jerky like that. If you watch the video, you'll see plenty of (.5 Hz?) jerkiness throughout, even on the STATIC shots :/

September 29th, 2009, 10:58 AM	#2
Kevin Bjorke Regular Crew Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: San Francisco, California Posts: 43	It can be sticky with D-OIS. Switch to Std IS, or turn it off. If you're on a tripod you should have it turned off anyway.

September 29th, 2009, 03:38 PM	#5
Olivier Jezequel Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: London Posts: 45	so there is a way to select the normal ois instesd of the the new one as an alternativ to switch it off ? except the sticky bit and the higher capacity card, is there really some other difference between the s10 and s11 ? i have to make my choice in the few weeks coming cheers

September 29th, 2009, 05:19 PM	#7
Kevin Bjorke Regular Crew Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: San Francisco, California Posts: 43	I have one and you can set D-IS, Std IS, or no IS. Sticky or not, the D-IS is actually pretty darned sweet if you don't move too fast side-to-side. Moving front-to-back is fantastic. Steady holds, fantastic. The features of S11 over the others are disk space; Dynamic IS; the (accessory) LANC port; and the addition of a night mode (which I think just adds AGC limits to "fireworks" mode, but I could be wrong on that)

September 30th, 2009, 03:01 AM	#9
Olivier Jezequel Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: London Posts: 45	so does it really worse buying a s11 ? is the night mode is really an improvement compare to the s10 ? the lanc, i have no need for it and buying sd card is cheaper i was excited about the s11 but now i am wondering.... thanks

September 30th, 2009, 08:57 AM	#11
Kevin Bjorke Regular Crew Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: San Francisco, California Posts: 43	We'll see about the LANC, Robin. My guess is that it DOES work on other cameras, but it's not "certified" to work by Canon. I'm still waiting on mine, though -- B&H got the cameras, but not the LANC connectors.

September 30th, 2009, 12:52 PM	#13
Olivier Jezequel Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: London Posts: 45	some tests looks pretty convincing, even i see some look retimed... ???? but i guess, i am weak, i will buy s11 anyway :) thanks

September 30th, 2009, 02:07 PM	#14
Kevin Bjorke Regular Crew Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: San Francisco, California Posts: 43	Nothing retimed, it's just the $^&^!!! compression. You can see some classic "CMOS rolling shutter slant" on the train footage, too. Comes with the territory. -- and just this second: I got an email from B&H saying the RA-V1 is in stock

October 1st, 2009, 01:23 AM	#15
Kevin Bjorke Regular Crew Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: San Francisco, California Posts: 43	I Posted an SD version of the previous vid : Canon HF S11 Mode Tests (SD Version) on Vimeo the smaller image is much smoother -- the compression artifacts are well gone and you can see that while there can be a "bounce" from dynamic IS (when it's trying to catch up) there is NOT the "jerkiness" or "stickiness" previously mentioned.