Advice needed on camera choice at DVinfo.net

David Merrill · July 12th, 2009, 01:01 PM

In the next few days I'm going to buy either the HF-200 or the HF-S100. I've done plenty of reading on both. Here is my priority.

Image quality - I've looked at probably 60 Vimeo videos for both cameras and I can't discern a difference.

The photo ability is no concern.

On the HF200 side, there are more accessories available for the 37mm lens. (lens adapters built specifically for the HF200 (Canon, Century Optics).

I don't mind spending the extra cash if the image quality is better. Can anyone square me up on this?

EDIT: OK. I found a couple more reasons to get the HF-S100. The manual wheel near the lens for control of several programmed functions. And the Focus assist functions that not only provides Zebra in 100% or 70% but enlarged center of image with Peaking and B & W Peaking.

David Merrill · July 12th, 2009, 04:42 PM

Anybody??? The trouble is I've only seen it on Vimeo. Burned to Blu-Ray at 1080P there may be a noticeable difference between the 2 cameras.

Kevin Duffey · July 12th, 2009, 06:37 PM

Take a look at the XR500..I think it's cheaper than the HS100. However, the HS100 has an 8.59MP sensor.. that's pretty impressive. Not sure about the XR500.. but there was a thread regarding it on here that I found quite interesting and steered me towards it more than the HS100. Unless the HS100 is not the S-100 I am thinking of? lol. The Sony apparently has better low light performance and OIC. I honestly don't know which is best, but the low light performance to me says a lot.. either the lens or the sensor or both is better on the Sony. The bigger sensor on the canon I would have thought would provide better low light but a lot of reviews say its not so good low light.

David Merrill · July 12th, 2009, 07:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kevin Duffey

Take a look at the XR500..I think it's cheaper than the HS100. However, the HS100 has an 8.59MP sensor.. that's pretty impressive. Not sure about the XR500.. but there was a thread regarding it on here that I found quite interesting and steered me towards it more than the HS100. Unless the HS100 is not the S-100 I am thinking of? lol. The Sony apparently has better low light performance and OIC. I honestly don't know which is best, but the low light performance to me says a lot.. either the lens or the sensor or both is better on the Sony. The bigger sensor on the canon I would have thought would provide better low light but a lot of reviews say its not so good low light.

I looked it up and watched some Vimeo videos. Nice picture. It has a 120 GB Hard drive. It's going for $100 more than the HF-S100. And it only has manual control on focus.

Kevin Duffey · July 12th, 2009, 08:00 PM

Only manual control on focus? Odd..I thought I read it was the other way around. Well, honestly I'd rather have manual control than not. At least from everything I've read regarding shooting indi films, stock footage and weddings, manual seems to be the much preferred way of focusing.

David Merrill · July 12th, 2009, 08:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kevin Duffey

Only manual control on focus? Odd..I thought I read it was the other way around. Well, honestly I'd rather have manual control than not. At least from everything I've read regarding shooting indi films, stock footage and weddings, manual seems to be the much preferred way of focusing.

I mean, as far as the manual abilities of the camera go, you can only work with focus.

Kevin Duffey · July 12th, 2009, 08:44 PM

Ah..gotcha. Yah.. that's a bummer.. but from what I've read, depending on what you are using it for, it is the better choice. It is always a matter of speculation tho. If only they made it look more like a pro camera!

David Merrill · July 12th, 2009, 08:44 PM

I just got some info over at the HV20 Forum. The member said in regards to the HF-S100;

"It use the full size sensor for video, sampling the 8MP to achieve a 1920x1080 image, except in the 1.7X Digital Teleconverter mode, using exactly a 1920x1080 pixel subset of the entire sensor in its center."

And;

"The resolution and sharpness maybe are quite similar in both models. The quality difference is in the sensor size, significant bigger in the HF-S100 making possible a shallow depth of field and more artistic scenes in this model than in the HF20 - HF200, where some portrait scenes are a little more plain and home video style."

I've made up my mind. It's the HF-S100.

David Merrill · July 14th, 2009, 10:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David Merrill

I looked it up and watched some Vimeo videos. Nice picture. It has a 120 GB Hard drive. It's going for $100 more than the HF-S100. And it only has manual control on focus.

Correction: You can work with focus and exposure just like the HF-S100.

Kevin Duffey · July 14th, 2009, 09:28 PM

I've seen a bunch of videos too. One guy mounted the HFS-10, XR520 and the TM300. I am really interested in the TM-300. With 3CMOS chips instead of 1 (but each is 1/4" instead of one big 1/2.5" from canon and Sony), and a manual focus ring.. I thought it would be better. Overall lab tests show the canon slightly better in some areas, with the sony better in low light (less grain), but the tm-300 is pretty much on par with both. The one thing the canon has going is the 24mbps vs the 17mbps the sony/panny have, but apparently that is of little concern. I figured 24mps == less compression == better quality overall. I am still torn.. all 3 look so good it's tough to tell. But I've seen several post on the XR500 for wedding videography as well. I've seen the TM-300 for about 1150, the XR500 and HS100 for < 1000.

Steve Struthers · July 16th, 2009, 09:20 PM

I have the HF-S100 and like it quite a bit. One caveat, though. The 8.59 MP resolution specified for the sensor only applies to still photo mode. When shooting video, the camera doesn't use the full capacity of the sensor. Video resolution, if I recall correctly, is only about 2.9MP.

There's a good reason for this - if the camera used all 8.5MP of the sensor capability, file sizes (even compressed) would be pretty huge. If you think editing existing AVCHD is tough now, try AVCHD with files several gigs in size!!

Not even the much-dscussed RED ONE is capable of more than 4 or 5 MP right now.

July 12th, 2009, 01:01 PM	#1
David Merrill Regular Crew Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Los Angeles, Ca. Posts: 91	Advice needed on camera choice In the next few days I'm going to buy either the HF-200 or the HF-S100. I've done plenty of reading on both. Here is my priority. Image quality - I've looked at probably 60 Vimeo videos for both cameras and I can't discern a difference. The photo ability is no concern. On the HF200 side, there are more accessories available for the 37mm lens. (lens adapters built specifically for the HF200 (Canon, Century Optics). I don't mind spending the extra cash if the image quality is better. Can anyone square me up on this? EDIT: OK. I found a couple more reasons to get the HF-S100. The manual wheel near the lens for control of several programmed functions. And the Focus assist functions that not only provides Zebra in 100% or 70% but enlarged center of image with Peaking and B & W Peaking. Last edited by David Merrill; July 12th, 2009 at 03:46 PM.

July 12th, 2009, 04:42 PM	#2
David Merrill Regular Crew Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Los Angeles, Ca. Posts: 91	Anybody??? The trouble is I've only seen it on Vimeo. Burned to Blu-Ray at 1080P there may be a noticeable difference between the 2 cameras.

July 12th, 2009, 06:37 PM	#3
Kevin Duffey Major Player Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: California Posts: 206	Take a look at the XR500..I think it's cheaper than the HS100. However, the HS100 has an 8.59MP sensor.. that's pretty impressive. Not sure about the XR500.. but there was a thread regarding it on here that I found quite interesting and steered me towards it more than the HS100. Unless the HS100 is not the S-100 I am thinking of? lol. The Sony apparently has better low light performance and OIC. I honestly don't know which is best, but the low light performance to me says a lot.. either the lens or the sensor or both is better on the Sony. The bigger sensor on the canon I would have thought would provide better low light but a lot of reviews say its not so good low light.

July 12th, 2009, 08:00 PM	#5
Kevin Duffey Major Player Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: California Posts: 206	Only manual control on focus? Odd..I thought I read it was the other way around. Well, honestly I'd rather have manual control than not. At least from everything I've read regarding shooting indi films, stock footage and weddings, manual seems to be the much preferred way of focusing.

July 12th, 2009, 08:44 PM	#7
Kevin Duffey Major Player Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: California Posts: 206	Ah..gotcha. Yah.. that's a bummer.. but from what I've read, depending on what you are using it for, it is the better choice. It is always a matter of speculation tho. If only they made it look more like a pro camera!

July 14th, 2009, 09:28 PM	#10
Kevin Duffey Major Player Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: California Posts: 206	I've seen a bunch of videos too. One guy mounted the HFS-10, XR520 and the TM300. I am really interested in the TM-300. With 3CMOS chips instead of 1 (but each is 1/4" instead of one big 1/2.5" from canon and Sony), and a manual focus ring.. I thought it would be better. Overall lab tests show the canon slightly better in some areas, with the sony better in low light (less grain), but the tm-300 is pretty much on par with both. The one thing the canon has going is the 24mbps vs the 17mbps the sony/panny have, but apparently that is of little concern. I figured 24mps == less compression == better quality overall. I am still torn.. all 3 look so good it's tough to tell. But I've seen several post on the XR500 for wedding videography as well. I've seen the TM-300 for about 1150, the XR500 and HS100 for < 1000.

July 16th, 2009, 09:20 PM	#11
Steve Struthers Regular Crew Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Canada Posts: 170	I have the HF-S100 and like it quite a bit. One caveat, though. The 8.59 MP resolution specified for the sensor only applies to still photo mode. When shooting video, the camera doesn't use the full capacity of the sensor. Video resolution, if I recall correctly, is only about 2.9MP. There's a good reason for this - if the camera used all 8.5MP of the sensor capability, file sizes (even compressed) would be pretty huge. If you think editing existing AVCHD is tough now, try AVCHD with files several gigs in size!! Not even the much-dscussed RED ONE is capable of more than 4 or 5 MP right now.