I'm New to This Camera, Need Some Help at DVinfo.net

Connor McKenzie · October 28th, 2007, 01:36 AM

Hey guys, I just signed up for this forum a while ago. I received my HV20 in the mail a week or so ago, and I'm really happy with the quality. I'm really excited to get some good projects on the go. After I get my new harddrive installed I'll be set.

I have a number of problems though, with editing, capturing, exporting etc. with the HV20 in relation to FCP 5. I don't understand much with Final Cut beyond the basics of editing, effects, capturing and exporting. I am completely lost as far as the technical stuff is involved. When it comes to 24p, pulldown removal, deinterlacing, telecine, cadence, etc. I am hopeless. I've been to a couple forums before this one asking for help, but people tend not to want to help me. I am looking for someone who could help me through these things step by step, maybe over msn, in ways that I can actually understand.

If anyone wouldn't mind setting aside some time to go through things with me every now and then on msn or in PMs I would be extremely greatful!

Eugenia Loli-Queru · October 28th, 2007, 02:03 AM

Why don't you just use everything in auto mode at 60i and use iMovie instead of FCP? Everything will be simpler that way, and you will work your way through to more knowledge as time goes.

Ben Britt · October 28th, 2007, 09:55 AM

http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?artnum=306389

Final Cut Pro 6: 1080p24 workflow for Canon HV20 camcorder
This advanced article discusses workflow ideas for incorporating 1080p24 HDV material from a Canon HV20 camcorder into Final Cut Pro 6.

Final Cut Pro 6 and Canon HV20 camcorders are both capable of working with 1080p24 material, but due to differing characteristics in the ways that the media is handled, special care is required so that interlacing artifacts and pulldown cadence issues are not introduced in your work.

The steps below are meant to impart general workflow overviews. For details on performing any of the steps provided, refer to the User Manuals (available from the Help menu in each respective Final Cut Studio application).

HDV native capture, Compressor workflow

Note: ProRes is used as an example in this workflow; other codecs can also be used. An advantage to this workflow is that Compressor is able to perform Reverse Telecine on temporally-compressed media, while Cinema Tools cannot.

In Final Cut Pro, Log and Capture your clips shot as 1080p24 from the HV20 using the Easy Setup named "HDV, 29.97, HDV - 1080i60 FireWire Basic".
In Compressor, choose Add File and navigate to the capture scratch folder for the clips you captured and open them all.
Select the first clip in the batch.
Choose the setting named "Apple ProRes 422 for Progressive material" (found in Settings tab > Apple > Other Workflows > Advanced Format Conversions > Apple Codecs), and drag it onto the first clip.
Double-click the setting on the first clip to highlight the Inspector window.
In Inspector > Encoder Settings > Video Settings, change the framerate to Custom, and enter 23.976.
In Inspector > Frame Controls, enable Frame Controls and make the following settings:
Set Frame Controls to On
Set Deinterlace to Reverse Telecine
Click Save As to save this setting with a name such as "HV20 HDV 24p to ProRes 24p".
Add this new Custom setting to all your clips and submit the batch.
The resulting clips will be 24p and can be edited in a 24p sequence in Final Cut Pro with no interlacing or cadence issues.

HDV-Apple Intermediate Codec capture, Cinema Tools workflow

Note: This method requires that you determine the cadence pattern for each clip.

In Final Cut Pro, choose the Easy Setup named "Apple Intermediate Codec, 29.97, HDV-Apple Intermediate Codec 1080i60".
Capture your clips.
Open each clip in Cinema Tools and manually reverse telecine each clip.

Joseph H. Moore · October 28th, 2007, 07:27 PM

You don't have to EDIT in 24P just because you SHOOT in 24P. You can edit HDV24P just fine in FCP 5 as a 60i project and retain the 24P look and feel. For many uses, this simpler workflow is just fine.

Connor McKenzie · October 29th, 2007, 05:08 AM

Allright Joseph, sounds good. Although I'd like to try to get the best of the camera.. But how do you do the 60i thing?

Joseph H. Moore · October 29th, 2007, 06:40 AM

It's not a matter of quality, actually. The look and feel of the motion won't change as long as you CAPTURE/RECORD in 24P. The whole telecine process is a bit more than I can get into here (there are some great tutorials on the interwebs, though if you dig a bit) but I will say that EVERY HDV camera records 24P as a 60i stream. It HAS to in order to meet the HDV standard.

So, set your HV20 to HDV24 and record away. Ingest the footage as a normal HDTV 1080/60i project. Edit as normal. That's it!

SOME REASONS TO EDIT IN 24P:
- You save a small amount of disk space, it's slightly easier on your computer's processor to keep up with 24 frames instead of 60 fields.
- You are delivering the file on the web. (Again, you'll end-up with a slightly smaller file and/or better compression.)
- You are outputing your project to film. (Rare!)

SOME REASONS TO EDIT IN 60i:
- You don't have to take any extra steps to convert your footage.
- You are delivering files as a DVD, or for broadcast.
- You need to mix your 24P footage with 60i footage.

October 28th, 2007, 01:36 AM	#1
Connor McKenzie New Boot Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Canada Posts: 20	I'm New to This Camera, Need Some Help Hey guys, I just signed up for this forum a while ago. I received my HV20 in the mail a week or so ago, and I'm really happy with the quality. I'm really excited to get some good projects on the go. After I get my new harddrive installed I'll be set. I have a number of problems though, with editing, capturing, exporting etc. with the HV20 in relation to FCP 5. I don't understand much with Final Cut beyond the basics of editing, effects, capturing and exporting. I am completely lost as far as the technical stuff is involved. When it comes to 24p, pulldown removal, deinterlacing, telecine, cadence, etc. I am hopeless. I've been to a couple forums before this one asking for help, but people tend not to want to help me. I am looking for someone who could help me through these things step by step, maybe over msn, in ways that I can actually understand. If anyone wouldn't mind setting aside some time to go through things with me every now and then on msn or in PMs I would be extremely greatful!

October 28th, 2007, 09:55 AM	#3
Ben Britt New Boot Join Date: May 2007 Location: Dallas Posts: 6	24 p workflow for HV20 & Final Cut Pro http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?artnum=306389 Final Cut Pro 6: 1080p24 workflow for Canon HV20 camcorder This advanced article discusses workflow ideas for incorporating 1080p24 HDV material from a Canon HV20 camcorder into Final Cut Pro 6. Final Cut Pro 6 and Canon HV20 camcorders are both capable of working with 1080p24 material, but due to differing characteristics in the ways that the media is handled, special care is required so that interlacing artifacts and pulldown cadence issues are not introduced in your work. The steps below are meant to impart general workflow overviews. For details on performing any of the steps provided, refer to the User Manuals (available from the Help menu in each respective Final Cut Studio application). HDV native capture, Compressor workflow Note: ProRes is used as an example in this workflow; other codecs can also be used. An advantage to this workflow is that Compressor is able to perform Reverse Telecine on temporally-compressed media, while Cinema Tools cannot. In Final Cut Pro, Log and Capture your clips shot as 1080p24 from the HV20 using the Easy Setup named "HDV, 29.97, HDV - 1080i60 FireWire Basic". In Compressor, choose Add File and navigate to the capture scratch folder for the clips you captured and open them all. Select the first clip in the batch. Choose the setting named "Apple ProRes 422 for Progressive material" (found in Settings tab > Apple > Other Workflows > Advanced Format Conversions > Apple Codecs), and drag it onto the first clip. Double-click the setting on the first clip to highlight the Inspector window. In Inspector > Encoder Settings > Video Settings, change the framerate to Custom, and enter 23.976. In Inspector > Frame Controls, enable Frame Controls and make the following settings: Set Frame Controls to On Set Deinterlace to Reverse Telecine Click Save As to save this setting with a name such as "HV20 HDV 24p to ProRes 24p". Add this new Custom setting to all your clips and submit the batch. The resulting clips will be 24p and can be edited in a 24p sequence in Final Cut Pro with no interlacing or cadence issues. HDV-Apple Intermediate Codec capture, Cinema Tools workflow Note: This method requires that you determine the cadence pattern for each clip. In Final Cut Pro, choose the Easy Setup named "Apple Intermediate Codec, 29.97, HDV-Apple Intermediate Codec 1080i60". Capture your clips. Open each clip in Cinema Tools and manually reverse telecine each clip.

October 28th, 2007, 02:03 AM	#2
Eugenia Loli-Queru Major Player Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Bay Area, CA, USA Posts: 348	Why don't you just use everything in auto mode at 60i and use iMovie instead of FCP? Everything will be simpler that way, and you will work your way through to more knowledge as time goes.

October 28th, 2007, 07:27 PM	#4
Joseph H. Moore Major Player Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 362	You don't have to EDIT in 24P just because you SHOOT in 24P. You can edit HDV24P just fine in FCP 5 as a 60i project and retain the 24P look and feel. For many uses, this simpler workflow is just fine.

October 29th, 2007, 05:08 AM	#5
Connor McKenzie New Boot Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Canada Posts: 20	Allright Joseph, sounds good. Although I'd like to try to get the best of the camera.. But how do you do the 60i thing?

October 29th, 2007, 06:40 AM	#6
Joseph H. Moore Major Player Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 362	It's not a matter of quality, actually. The look and feel of the motion won't change as long as you CAPTURE/RECORD in 24P. The whole telecine process is a bit more than I can get into here (there are some great tutorials on the interwebs, though if you dig a bit) but I will say that EVERY HDV camera records 24P as a 60i stream. It HAS to in order to meet the HDV standard. So, set your HV20 to HDV24 and record away. Ingest the footage as a normal HDTV 1080/60i project. Edit as normal. That's it! SOME REASONS TO EDIT IN 24P: - You save a small amount of disk space, it's slightly easier on your computer's processor to keep up with 24 frames instead of 60 fields. - You are delivering the file on the web. (Again, you'll end-up with a slightly smaller file and/or better compression.) - You are outputing your project to film. (Rare!) SOME REASONS TO EDIT IN 60i: - You don't have to take any extra steps to convert your footage. - You are delivering files as a DVD, or for broadcast. - You need to mix your 24P footage with 60i footage.