Question on film-like shutter speeds

[Mike A. Jones]

So, I know that shutter speeds slower than 1/48 are considered off limits when attempting to achieve the elusive film-like look, but what about shutter speeds faster than 1/48? Does a shutter speed of, for example, 1/100 say "this feels like film" in equal proportion to a shutter speed of 1/48 (all other variables like lighting, DOF, etc. being equal), or is 1/48 inherently more "film-like" than any other value? I already realize directors sometimes employ ultra-fast shutter speeds for stylistic effect, so disregarding that, are there any reasons for or against considering shutter speeds faster than 1/48 as equal to 1/48 in their ability to feel like film? For example, if I try to compensate for the fact that I'm shooting in really bright light by switching from 1/48 to 1/100, do I also thereby compensate (however subtly) the film-like feel of my footage (again, all other variables being equal), or is there really no difference so long as I stay at 1/48 or faster?

[Austin Meyers]

1/48th gives you nice usable motion blur and that mixed with the "jitter" of 24p = film look, at least from what i've seen heard observed etc... when you crank up the shutter the "jitter" starts to become more pronounced, which some people like, and some people don't, the classic example is saving private ryan. i shoot a lot of 24p stuff over 1/48th, because i like having full progressive frames to pull screen shots from, and in general prefer a crisper image for most things... i typically shoot 1/48, or 1/24 when i'm specifically looking for that "film look" if i'm doing bands or other creative projects.

[Jay Cowley]

i actually find myself 1/24 is a little bit more smooth than 1/48 a bit less jerky. It does however motion blur a lot easy when objects are moving.

[Austin Meyers]

yeah 1/24 is nice in talking head and other low motion situations

[Pieter Jongerius]

Hi Mike,
I would say higher shutter speeds make the film look more pronounced. The individual frames will differ more clearly because of decreased motion blur.

My observation from a creative pov: fast shutters on slow frame rates tend to 'freeze' the world. Imagine shooting a fountain. You would capture individual drops, round balls of water, frozen in time, 24 times per second. Even when played at normal speeds, the illusion of motion can break in those situations.
Also, as a side effect, you are a bit more likely to capture motion interference such as car wheels appearing to rotate backwards.

regs
Pieter

[Mike A. Jones]

Thanks for the helpful input, guys! I think I've got a handle on this now, but just to be certain, can anyone speak to this question specifically:

If I try to compensate for the fact that I'm shooting in really bright light by switching from 1/48 to 1/100, do I also thereby compensate (however subtly) the film-like feel of my footage (again, all other variables being equal), or is there really no difference so long as I stay at 1/48 or faster?

In other words, in film, is 1/48 the overwhelming norm for shutter speeds, with other values basically being creative, somewhat rare deviations from this norm, or is there really no predominant shutter speed, with 1/48 simply being the minimum preferred speed, above which there are equally prevalent speeds commonly used by filmmakers?

[Adam Perry]

Originally Posted by Mike A. Jones

Thanks for the helpful input, guys! I think I've got a handle on this now, but just to be certain, can anyone speak to this question specifically:

If I try to compensate for the fact that I'm shooting in really bright light by switching from 1/48 to 1/100, do I also thereby compensate (however subtly) the film-like feel of my footage (again, all other variables being equal), or is there really no difference so long as I stay at 1/48 or faster?

In other words, in film, is 1/48 the overwhelming norm for shutter speeds, with other values basically being creative, somewhat rare deviations from this norm, or is there really no predominant shutter speed, with 1/48 simply being the minimum preferred speed, above which there are equally prevalent speeds commonly used by filmmakers?

No, its not an issue of staying at or above 1/48. you should stay at 1/48.

watch saving private ryan or 28 days later to see what a shutter of above 1/48 looks like...its rawer and more stacatto due to the lack of motion blur. you will definitely notice the difference.

film cameras use a 180 degree shutter and thats part of what gives that distinct look. if you are adjusting shutter above 1/48 (180 degrees) not for stylistic reasons but because of lighting, i would say a better bet would be ND filters.

[Joseph H. Moore]

Also, if you're shooting 60i with the intent of creating slo-mo 24P, then you should use a higher shutter speed in order to stop the action. Minimum of 100/sec.

[Adam Perry]

yep. if youre gonna shoot 60i for slo mo, go for 1/120

[Mike A. Jones]

Originally Posted by Adam Perry

No, its not an issue of staying at or above 1/48. you should stay at 1/48.

watch saving private ryan or 28 days later to see what a shutter of above 1/48 looks like...its rawer and more stacatto due to the lack of motion blur. you will definitely notice the difference.

film cameras use a 180 degree shutter and thats part of what gives that distinct look. if you are adjusting shutter above 1/48 (180 degrees) not for stylistic reasons but because of lighting, i would say a better bet would be ND filters.

Well, this is a bit overdue, but thank you!! That settles it.