XM2 Audio Input at DVinfo.net

Fraser McGillivray · February 13th, 2006, 03:59 PM

We have a rock concert in church coming up soon which I will attempt to video with a CANON XM2 camera , I will be positioned on a platform towards the back of the building at the last concert i used the DM-50 microphone with the attenuator on which worked ok. It has been suggested that I should get the audio input from the mixer desk as I don’t have the MA- 300 microphone adapter can I do this.

Andrew Khalil · February 13th, 2006, 04:12 PM

yes, you should be able to run the output from the mixer into the camera - just use the 3.5mm microphone input. You'll probably need to switch the attenuation on depending on where on the mixer you're plugged in.

Chris Simpson · February 13th, 2006, 06:38 PM

As far as I know, the GL2 (the NA version of the XM2) only has mic-level input and you cannot feed line-level input into it. Doing so will leave your audio severely distorted and it may damage the microphone amplifier on the camera.

If I'm wrong about this, please correct me and tell me how it can be done.

David Ennis · February 13th, 2006, 08:31 PM

It's true that line level is too hot for the GL2's input. But if the mixer output you're given has its own fader you can probably crank it down enough at the board end to use with MIC ATT ON in the GL2. Make sure you get acceptable level meter indications on the GL2 without turning its level controls down below about 1/3. If you turn them down too far you can get acceptable readings even though the signal is overloading the input and getting mangled.

That being said, you may be disappointed with a signal from the board. Although it will be very clean, it will also tend to sound a bit lifeless without the room ambience. You're probably better off with the DM-50. From my own experience with my GL2 and a DM-50, the GL2's on board stereo mic will probably sound better than the DM-50 for a room that is filled with musical sound.

Ultimatly what you probably want to do is to get an XLR adapter and take a board feed into one channel and a room ambience mic into the other. But please DON'T get an MA300. For the same price you can get a Beachtek DXA-4p which is MUCH more feature rich and capable.

Another good move would be to sell the DM-50 on ebay for about $100 US and buy a Rode VideoMic. That's exactly what I did. You'll get a much more full-bodied sound. But again, don't rule out the GL2's built in mic. Like all built-in camcorder mics it sucks for dialog, yes. But recording a sound experience that fills the space and comes to the mic is different, and for that the GL2's mic is not bad.

Don Palomaki · February 14th, 2006, 05:58 AM

Many mixers have a tape out which is consumer line level and would be an OK feed to a camcorder that can take consumer line level audio input. If the camcorder does not accept line level audio input, use an attenuator.

You can sweeten the audio in post production to add reverberation. The disadvantage of the camcorder mic, especially if in the audience, is that the audience noise may be too loud relative to the music.

David Ennis · February 14th, 2006, 06:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Don Palomaki

...You can sweeten the [mixer's otherwise sterile sounding] audio inpost production to add reverberation...

Good point, Don. I haven't tried that but I willl.

Graham Bernard · February 15th, 2006, 01:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fred Retread

Good point, Don. I haven't tried that but I willl.

What I do in Vegas is "copy" the audio and then play with this copy:

1/- Reverb on the Copy - Vegas/Sound Forge has an immense arsenal of LARGE space Audio Fxs.

2/- I've even created distant sounding LEFT and RIGHT - stereo - FXs and then used the PAN envelope to become even more lively!

3/- Sound Forge's Noise redux is excellent at "focusing" the attention on a central audio component.

Basically, in experimenting I can almost recreate the big sound and use Envelopes to emphasise certain aspects of the audio.

I'd support Don's comment that the on-board mic, with MIC ATTN on, is quite stunning! And yes it is a rich sound.

Just got me a Rode Vid Mic. I'm looking forward to experimenting with this babe!

Grazie

Nathaniel McInnes · February 15th, 2006, 02:55 PM

i have just filmed a concert basicly 3 days ago for my school. my audio came from the mixing desk. ask if you can have low audio coming in. if you have it like this you can then edit the audio and also you shouldn'y get any distortion. thats what i found on the first night of filming. i got to much distortion. on the second i asked the sound guy if he could give a low audio in and then it would fine.

Leigh Hanlon · February 15th, 2006, 03:23 PM

I faced a similar challenge last week while recording a band at a small venue. Even though the soundguy was able to give me a signal compatible with the GL2, it simply wasn't as clean as the sound he recorded onto a CD.

So, I copied the music from the CD and synched it with the visual. This was the first time I had done this and it was a lot easier than I expected.

Leo Pepingco · February 16th, 2006, 08:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Leigh Hanlon

So, I copied the music from the CD and synched it with the visual. This was the first time I had done this and it was a lot easier than I expected.

I preffer this approach if you find yourself with an audio problem and you dont have XLR capabilities.

If the mixer (or someone) can be used to record sound that is either independantly recorded or recorded through the mixer, almost all the audio problems and money spent trying to fix it dissapears.

Otherwise, a Rhode Video Mic will always be the best no-brainer band-aid fix. But like all band-aids, they tend to peel off when you need them most.

Leo Pepingco · February 16th, 2006, 08:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fred Retread

...please DON'T get an MA300. For the same price you can get a Beachtek DXA-4p which is MUCH more feature rich and capable...

G'day Fred. i'd like to know how much of a noticeable difference can be disserened from these two adaptors you mentioned. I'm curious because I was about to buy the MA300 because its VERY functional, as it sits out of the way and allows a mic holder and uses the hotshoe. The DXA-4p you mentioned is quite large and adds bulk to the bottom of the camera.

If you can give me a really good reason why the DVX is better than the MA, I'll go for it. I plan on doing interviews and also some short films later on. If the DVX can (very much) outmatch the MA is this area of audio, I'd be very interested indeed.

Darko Flajpan · February 16th, 2006, 10:11 AM

Leo, I have MA300A and a Beachtek. MA300 looks fabulous on camera, has a good mic holder...BUT...shoe mount is made from plastic and is very fragile. If someone pull audio cable, be sure the MA will be broken. On the other hand I found Beachtek DXA8 much safer adapter for the camera. And it's got audio level control, line-in and +48V phantom which is must for some better mics.

Fraser McGillivray · February 19th, 2006, 10:13 AM

Thanks to you all for taking the time to reply with solutions for audio input to my XM2, Reading through some of the replies about the onboard mike has left me wondering should i consider this before the DM50

February 13th, 2006, 03:59 PM	#1
Fraser McGillivray Tourist Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Aberdeen Scotland Posts: 2	XM2 Audio Input We have a rock concert in church coming up soon which I will attempt to video with a CANON XM2 camera , I will be positioned on a platform towards the back of the building at the last concert i used the DM-50 microphone with the attenuator on which worked ok. It has been suggested that I should get the audio input from the mixer desk as I don’t have the MA- 300 microphone adapter can I do this.

February 13th, 2006, 08:31 PM	#4
David Ennis Fred Retread Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Hartford, CT Posts: 1,227	It's true that line level is too hot for the GL2's input. But if the mixer output you're given has its own fader you can probably crank it down enough at the board end to use with MIC ATT ON in the GL2. Make sure you get acceptable level meter indications on the GL2 without turning its level controls down below about 1/3. If you turn them down too far you can get acceptable readings even though the signal is overloading the input and getting mangled. That being said, you may be disappointed with a signal from the board. Although it will be very clean, it will also tend to sound a bit lifeless without the room ambience. You're probably better off with the DM-50. From my own experience with my GL2 and a DM-50, the GL2's on board stereo mic will probably sound better than the DM-50 for a room that is filled with musical sound. Ultimatly what you probably want to do is to get an XLR adapter and take a board feed into one channel and a room ambience mic into the other. But please DON'T get an MA300. For the same price you can get a Beachtek DXA-4p which is MUCH more feature rich and capable. Another good move would be to sell the DM-50 on ebay for about $100 US and buy a Rode VideoMic. That's exactly what I did. You'll get a much more full-bodied sound. But again, don't rule out the GL2's built in mic. Like all built-in camcorder mics it sucks for dialog, yes. But recording a sound experience that fills the space and comes to the mic is different, and for that the GL2's mic is not bad. __________________ "Nothing in the world can take the place of persistence..." - Calvin Coolidge "My brain is wired to want to know how other things are wired." - Me Last edited by David Ennis; February 14th, 2006 at 06:12 PM.

February 14th, 2006, 05:58 AM	#5
Don Palomaki Wrangler Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Northern VA Posts: 4,489	Many mixers have a tape out which is consumer line level and would be an OK feed to a camcorder that can take consumer line level audio input. If the camcorder does not accept line level audio input, use an attenuator. You can sweeten the audio in post production to add reverberation. The disadvantage of the camcorder mic, especially if in the audience, is that the audience noise may be too loud relative to the music. __________________ dpalomaki@dspalomaki.com

February 15th, 2006, 03:23 PM	#9
Leigh Hanlon Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Chicago, USA Posts: 64	I faced a similar challenge last week while recording a band at a small venue. Even though the soundguy was able to give me a signal compatible with the GL2, it simply wasn't as clean as the sound he recorded onto a CD. So, I copied the music from the CD and synched it with the visual. This was the first time I had done this and it was a lot easier than I expected. __________________ Leigh Hanlon \| Chicago, USA GL2 - Final Cut Studio

February 16th, 2006, 10:11 AM	#12
Darko Flajpan Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Bjelovar, Croatia Posts: 153	Leo, I have MA300A and a Beachtek. MA300 looks fabulous on camera, has a good mic holder...BUT...shoe mount is made from plastic and is very fragile. If someone pull audio cable, be sure the MA will be broken. On the other hand I found Beachtek DXA8 much safer adapter for the camera. And it's got audio level control, line-in and +48V phantom which is must for some better mics. __________________ XM2 Sony DXC637P BetaSP

February 13th, 2006, 04:12 PM	#2
Andrew Khalil Major Player Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 424	yes, you should be able to run the output from the mixer into the camera - just use the 3.5mm microphone input. You'll probably need to switch the attenuation on depending on where on the mixer you're plugged in.

February 13th, 2006, 06:38 PM	#3
Chris Simpson New Boot Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Colorado Springs, CO Posts: 22	As far as I know, the GL2 (the NA version of the XM2) only has mic-level input and you cannot feed line-level input into it. Doing so will leave your audio severely distorted and it may damage the microphone amplifier on the camera. If I'm wrong about this, please correct me and tell me how it can be done.

February 15th, 2006, 02:55 PM	#8
Nathaniel McInnes Regular Crew Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Taffs well, Wales Posts: 190	i have just filmed a concert basicly 3 days ago for my school. my audio came from the mixing desk. ask if you can have low audio coming in. if you have it like this you can then edit the audio and also you shouldn'y get any distortion. thats what i found on the first night of filming. i got to much distortion. on the second i asked the sound guy if he could give a low audio in and then it would fine.

February 19th, 2006, 10:13 AM	#13
Fraser McGillivray Tourist Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Aberdeen Scotland Posts: 2	XM2 Audio Input Thanks to you all for taking the time to reply with solutions for audio input to my XM2, Reading through some of the replies about the onboard mike has left me wondering should i consider this before the DM50