GL / XM assorted posts, 2003

Ken Tanaka · January 21st, 2003, 10:36 AM

Ted,
Sounds like a very enjoyable endeavor, made all that much more enjoyable by the involvement and appreciation of your wife!

This topic has come up in the past. I seem to recall that the main issues at hand were (a) setting your exposure and (b) white balance.

I am absolutely not and expert on this topic but, fwiw, here is how I might approach the task.

Re: exposure I'd set my shutter to 60 and try to get a decent average exposure with the iris. The zebras, in this case, might not be very useful during the shoot since the lighting will probably change in hue and intensity with each scene. I might see if the white stage lights could be turned on beforehand while someone in a white shirt stood on stage. Set your zebras to 90 and tweak your iris to that person. Then, using Manal mode, leave the camera set as is.

Re: white balance, with all of the color changes common to theatrical lighting I wonder if it isn't best to use an "indoor" preset?

As I say, these remarks may be poor guidance. But that's how I might approach the task knwing little else.

Good luck, and let us know how you ultimately tackled this and the results.

Barry Goyette · January 21st, 2003, 12:01 PM

Ted,

I've shot a fair number of theater,dance, and music concerts and the biggest issue you will have is contrast, and dealing with changing lighting. For white balancing, use the incandescant setting. This will allow your camera to capture the changing color with relative accuracy. I would also consider bumping the "setup" upwards a few notches to open up the shadows and lower the overall contrast.

Regarding the spotlight setting: Try it during a dress rehearsal, but I've found that in many situations it still leads to overexposed faces. Perhaps using it in concert with an AE shift adjustment will give you a good result, as well as an automatic response to changing lighting.

I usually set the camera on Manual exposure, and adjust the aperture when necessary. This can lead to a few seconds of camera induced exposure change "bumps", but for me it's preferable to know my overall exposure is correct.

Ditto what ken said about shutter speed and zebras.

Good luck.

Barry

Jim Yang · January 22nd, 2003, 12:26 PM

I'm waiting on a GL2 I ordered from Zotz Digital (great place to order from by the way)....and I was wondering what kids of test I should put it though to check to make sure nothing is wrong with it?

Anything I should tape, like light and dark backgrounds to check for hot spots or dead pixels? Anything mechanical, like tape transport? Is there a checklist I should go over?

Erwin Kolman · January 22nd, 2003, 01:31 PM

Hello, i`m reading all these things about mics and what i want to know is the differents between a zoom mic and a shotgun.

I make footage from rallycars an if i`ll zoom in to the car then i want to zoom also i with the sound, how can i do this??

(sorry for my bad typing)
greetzzzz

Patrick Mollins · January 22nd, 2003, 03:30 PM

Well,

I'm no expert but I beleive that you can't zoom with sound. A zoom mic may be a misconception. There are shotgun mics which can either be cardioid or hyper-cardioid. These types depend directly to the shape of the pick up pattern which affects them. Most of the conversation involved around mics and video are about the shotgun style of mic ( long thin with a narrow pick up pattern ). These mics are traditionally used in two ways - camera mounted, and on a boom. The boom is a long pole operated by a boom person. The boom allows for the mic to be placed at an optimal location to pick up sound. Usually close to the action or the talent. Camera mounted is *alright* but it will pick up sounds that are in front of the mic which may not be the talent/action solely.

For your purposes, you may want to have a mic closer to the action, which would go to an external recording device ( ex. MD ). Then mix those sounds in during post preduction ( editing )

I'm not sure how much of this you knew so I added all I could think of. I may not be entirely correct. If anyone can add to this please do.

Patrick

Don Palomaki · January 23rd, 2003, 05:58 AM

The "zoom microphone" typically has multiple pickup elements. The zoom effect amounts to varying the mix of sound from the several elements to electronically change the net pickup pattern to make it more focused on things in front of the mic and to increase rejection of sounds from the sides and back.

I believe that they are mainly seen in the consumer market. However, I can't say how well they work, but probably not as well as the corresponding fixed pattern mic for any given 'zoom' setting.

A shotgun mic has a pickup pattern that is focused to the front and provides a greater rejection of sound from the sides and back - perhaps by a factor of 10 or more depedning on the frequency of the sound. Shotgun mics usually do this by having long pickup tubes (a bit like a shotgun barrel) with slots that provide acoustic cancellation of the sound waves from the side and back.

Rob Lohman · January 23rd, 2003, 02:15 PM

I don't think there is any list, at least not to my knowledge. Just
USE the camera. Put tape in it, record varying things. I did that
at least because I was curious to see what it would and would
not do.

Just do the things that makes the most sense to you and can
satisfy you!

Ken Tanaka · January 23rd, 2003, 02:31 PM

Congratulations Jim! You're in for a real treat. It's a fine camera.

There is one anomaly, documented first in this thread, then more recently in this thread which you should check for. Please read through the first thread completely. I know it's long but it's worth the read.

Have fun, Jim!

Marc Martin · January 25th, 2003, 11:53 PM

Hi, I've heard that Pentax filters are thes best. I want to buy a polarizer and a UV filter. I 've found these 2:

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bh1.sph/FrameWork.class?FNC=ProductActivator__Aproductlist_html___41637___PEUV58___REG___CatID=0___SID=F32F2 70CEC0

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bh1.sph/FrameWork.class?FNC=ProductActivator__Aproductlist_html___40964___PECP58___REG___CatID=0___SID=F32F2 70CEC0

(I haven't found how to enable HTML: sorry)

Do I need an adaptator for these 2 filters? (if you have a link...)

Is there any others filters that does the same good job and cheaper?

Thank in advance.

Michael Buendia · January 26th, 2003, 12:19 AM

filters are a subjective thing: some say b+w, some heliopan and others swear by hoya. i went for pentax baby!!!!

i'm planning on gettng a pentax polarizer in the future. the hoya shmc filters are very good option also (cheaper). i've been told that pentax filters are made with hoya glass and rings and they apply their own patented coating. the heliopan multiple coating (uv) filters are hard to get (special order) but they have the best of both worlds: schott glass/brass rings and a pentax formula based multicoating.

in europe you might a better deal on these filters than we can. good luck in your choice.

p.s. - no filter adaptor is needed if the xm2 has the same 58mm thread as the gl2. all in all the hoya shmc is the best bang for the buck (at least here in the us)!

Scott Silverman · January 26th, 2003, 12:48 AM

I have a B+W filter on my GL2. Very very nice, and pretty cheap. Great filter! You won't be disappointed.

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bh5.sph/...ID=F2B75AC2CA0

Alex Naumoff · January 27th, 2003, 01:06 AM

Hi, I'm pretty new to this forum. I've been reading messages for a couple of months and find it very helpful.
I bought xm2 about a week ago and started noticing a strange thing. It's hard to see through a viewfinder or lcd but on a tv screen I can clearly see how images are distorted at the edges. It's like a slight fish-eye effect. I tried filming in frame and normal modes and also with and without a UV filter. The distortions are very noticeable especially when I pan accross something vertical like buldings. I tried viewing some still shots on my pc and I get the same problem. So I think it might be something with the lense.

Did anybody have anything like this? Any advice? Should I just take it back?

Thanks for your help.

Frank Granovski · January 27th, 2003, 01:30 AM

That's strange. There must be something wrong with the cam. See if you can have it replaced or repaired, since it is a new cam.

Rob Lohman · January 27th, 2003, 08:03 AM

A picture would help. If you have the lense at its widest setting
some distortion will occur as well (naturally).

Bart Saerens · January 27th, 2003, 08:32 AM

I was doing some tests last week and one of them was zooming and focussing to a grey carpet in my room while lights were rather low.
What I saw was some red, green, blue "flickering" in the pixels ...
Could this have something to do with my UV filter? (Prinz UV filter - I'm going to update it to a B+W soon)
Or is this typical for low light conditions ... ?

January 21st, 2003, 10:36 AM	#76
Ken Tanaka Retired DV Info Net Almunus Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 6,943	Ted, Sounds like a very enjoyable endeavor, made all that much more enjoyable by the involvement and appreciation of your wife! This topic has come up in the past. I seem to recall that the main issues at hand were (a) setting your exposure and (b) white balance. I am absolutely not and expert on this topic but, fwiw, here is how I might approach the task. Re: exposure I'd set my shutter to 60 and try to get a decent average exposure with the iris. The zebras, in this case, might not be very useful during the shoot since the lighting will probably change in hue and intensity with each scene. I might see if the white stage lights could be turned on beforehand while someone in a white shirt stood on stage. Set your zebras to 90 and tweak your iris to that person. Then, using Manal mode, leave the camera set as is. Re: white balance, with all of the color changes common to theatrical lighting I wonder if it isn't best to use an "indoor" preset? As I say, these remarks may be poor guidance. But that's how I might approach the task knwing little else. Good luck, and let us know how you ultimately tackled this and the results. __________________ Lady X Films: A lady with a boring wardrobe...and a global mission. Hey, you don't have enough stuff! Buy with confidence from our sponsors. Hand-picked as the best in the business...Really! See some of my work one frame at a time: www.KenTanaka.com

January 22nd, 2003, 12:26 PM	#78
Jim Yang Regular Crew Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Cape Girardeau, MO Posts: 38	Checklist for new camera? I'm waiting on a GL2 I ordered from Zotz Digital (great place to order from by the way)....and I was wondering what kids of test I should put it though to check to make sure nothing is wrong with it? Anything I should tape, like light and dark backgrounds to check for hot spots or dead pixels? Anything mechanical, like tape transport? Is there a checklist I should go over?

January 22nd, 2003, 01:31 PM	#79
Erwin Kolman New Boot Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Vriezenveen Holland Posts: 14	Mic questions Hello, i`m reading all these things about mics and what i want to know is the differents between a zoom mic and a shotgun. I make footage from rallycars an if i`ll zoom in to the car then i want to zoom also i with the sound, how can i do this?? (sorry for my bad typing) greetzzzz __________________ Erwin

January 23rd, 2003, 02:15 PM	#82
Rob Lohman RED Code Chef Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Holland Posts: 12,514	I don't think there is any list, at least not to my knowledge. Just USE the camera. Put tape in it, record varying things. I did that at least because I was curious to see what it would and would not do. Just do the things that makes the most sense to you and can satisfy you! __________________ Rob Lohman, visuar@iname.com DV Info Wrangler & RED Code Chef Join the DV Challenge \| Lady X Search DVinfo.net for quick answers \| Buy from the best: DVinfo.net sponsors

January 23rd, 2003, 02:31 PM	#83
Ken Tanaka Retired DV Info Net Almunus Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 6,943	Congratulations Jim! You're in for a real treat. It's a fine camera. There is one anomaly, documented first in this thread, then more recently in this thread which you should check for. Please read through the first thread completely. I know it's long but it's worth the read. Have fun, Jim! __________________ Lady X Films: A lady with a boring wardrobe...and a global mission. Hey, you don't have enough stuff! Buy with confidence from our sponsors. Hand-picked as the best in the business...Really! See some of my work one frame at a time: www.KenTanaka.com

January 21st, 2003, 12:01 PM	#77
Barry Goyette Trustee Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: San Luis Obispo CA Posts: 1,195	Ted, I've shot a fair number of theater,dance, and music concerts and the biggest issue you will have is contrast, and dealing with changing lighting. For white balancing, use the incandescant setting. This will allow your camera to capture the changing color with relative accuracy. I would also consider bumping the "setup" upwards a few notches to open up the shadows and lower the overall contrast. Regarding the spotlight setting: Try it during a dress rehearsal, but I've found that in many situations it still leads to overexposed faces. Perhaps using it in concert with an AE shift adjustment will give you a good result, as well as an automatic response to changing lighting. I usually set the camera on Manual exposure, and adjust the aperture when necessary. This can lead to a few seconds of camera induced exposure change "bumps", but for me it's preferable to know my overall exposure is correct. Ditto what ken said about shutter speed and zebras. Good luck. Barry

January 22nd, 2003, 03:30 PM	#80
Patrick Mollins New Boot Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Ottawa Ontario Canada Posts: 15	Well, I'm no expert but I beleive that you can't zoom with sound. A zoom mic may be a misconception. There are shotgun mics which can either be cardioid or hyper-cardioid. These types depend directly to the shape of the pick up pattern which affects them. Most of the conversation involved around mics and video are about the shotgun style of mic ( long thin with a narrow pick up pattern ). These mics are traditionally used in two ways - camera mounted, and on a boom. The boom is a long pole operated by a boom person. The boom allows for the mic to be placed at an optimal location to pick up sound. Usually close to the action or the talent. Camera mounted is alright but it will pick up sounds that are in front of the mic which may not be the talent/action solely. For your purposes, you may want to have a mic closer to the action, which would go to an external recording device ( ex. MD ). Then mix those sounds in during post preduction ( editing ) I'm not sure how much of this you knew so I added all I could think of. I may not be entirely correct. If anyone can add to this please do. Patrick

January 23rd, 2003, 05:58 AM	#81
Don Palomaki Wrangler Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Northern VA Posts: 4,488	The "zoom microphone" typically has multiple pickup elements. The zoom effect amounts to varying the mix of sound from the several elements to electronically change the net pickup pattern to make it more focused on things in front of the mic and to increase rejection of sounds from the sides and back. I believe that they are mainly seen in the consumer market. However, I can't say how well they work, but probably not as well as the corresponding fixed pattern mic for any given 'zoom' setting. A shotgun mic has a pickup pattern that is focused to the front and provides a greater rejection of sound from the sides and back - perhaps by a factor of 10 or more depedning on the frequency of the sound. Shotgun mics usually do this by having long pickup tubes (a bit like a shotgun barrel) with slots that provide acoustic cancellation of the sound waves from the side and back.

January 25th, 2003, 11:53 PM	#84
Marc Martin Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Paris, France Posts: 80	Pentax: best filters for my XM2 (GL2) ? Hi, I've heard that Pentax filters are thes best. I want to buy a polarizer and a UV filter. I 've found these 2: http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bh1.sph/FrameWork.class?FNC=ProductActivator__Aproductlist_html___41637___PEUV58___REG___CatID=0___SID=F32F2 70CEC0 http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bh1.sph/FrameWork.class?FNC=ProductActivator__Aproductlist_html___40964___PECP58___REG___CatID=0___SID=F32F2 70CEC0 (I haven't found how to enable HTML: sorry) Do I need an adaptator for these 2 filters? (if you have a link...) Is there any others filters that does the same good job and cheaper? Thank in advance.

January 26th, 2003, 12:19 AM	#85
Michael Buendia Regular Crew Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: los angeles, california Posts: 71	filters are a subjective thing: some say b+w, some heliopan and others swear by hoya. i went for pentax baby!!!! i'm planning on gettng a pentax polarizer in the future. the hoya shmc filters are very good option also (cheaper). i've been told that pentax filters are made with hoya glass and rings and they apply their own patented coating. the heliopan multiple coating (uv) filters are hard to get (special order) but they have the best of both worlds: schott glass/brass rings and a pentax formula based multicoating. in europe you might a better deal on these filters than we can. good luck in your choice. p.s. - no filter adaptor is needed if the xm2 has the same 58mm thread as the gl2. all in all the hoya shmc is the best bang for the buck (at least here in the us)!

January 26th, 2003, 12:48 AM	#86
Scott Silverman Major Player Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Cupertino, California, USA Posts: 301	I have a B+W filter on my GL2. Very very nice, and pretty cheap. Great filter! You won't be disappointed. http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bh5.sph/...ID=F2B75AC2CA0 __________________ Scott Silverman Shining Star Digital Video Productions Bay Area, CA

January 27th, 2003, 01:06 AM	#87
Alex Naumoff Tourist Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Sydney, Australia Posts: 1	problems with xm2 Hi, I'm pretty new to this forum. I've been reading messages for a couple of months and find it very helpful. I bought xm2 about a week ago and started noticing a strange thing. It's hard to see through a viewfinder or lcd but on a tv screen I can clearly see how images are distorted at the edges. It's like a slight fish-eye effect. I tried filming in frame and normal modes and also with and without a UV filter. The distortions are very noticeable especially when I pan accross something vertical like buldings. I tried viewing some still shots on my pc and I get the same problem. So I think it might be something with the lense. Did anybody have anything like this? Any advice? Should I just take it back? Thanks for your help.

January 27th, 2003, 01:30 AM	#88
Frank Granovski Outer Circle Join Date: May 2002 Location: Hope, BC Posts: 7,524	That's strange. There must be something wrong with the cam. See if you can have it replaced or repaired, since it is a new cam.

January 27th, 2003, 08:03 AM	#89
Rob Lohman RED Code Chef Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Holland Posts: 12,514	A picture would help. If you have the lense at its widest setting some distortion will occur as well (naturally). __________________ Rob Lohman, visuar@iname.com DV Info Wrangler & RED Code Chef Join the DV Challenge \| Lady X Search DVinfo.net for quick answers \| Buy from the best: DVinfo.net sponsors

January 27th, 2003, 08:32 AM	#90
Bart Saerens New Boot Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Belgium Posts: 24	RGB flickering in low light I was doing some tests last week and one of them was zooming and focussing to a grey carpet in my room while lights were rather low. What I saw was some red, green, blue "flickering" in the pixels ... Could this have something to do with my UV filter? (Prinz UV filter - I'm going to update it to a B+W soon) Or is this typical for low light conditions ... ?