More GL2 impressions at DVinfo.net

Bill Hardy · October 30th, 2002, 06:17 PM

I was just noticing how much better the footage looks on a SVHS input TV when the edited footage comes from the camera and not the computer signal...I must say it even rivals the computer 15" LCD display on my Powerbook 667 DVI. Colors are super vibrant and it has more contrast and just looks soooo much better than a computer output. And it is SO SHARP! Wonder why that is.

I just made a VHS copy and compared to the origional DV on the same monitor...boy is the image quality robbed! The sooner VHS becomes extinct the better.

Keith Luken · October 30th, 2002, 08:30 PM

Actually I find that the Analog out of the camera is not as good and can be misleading. If I outout form the camera to the tv/monitor it looks OK, but take it out digital to computer and render it on a DVD and it rivals broadcast satellite TV picture quality and/or professional DVDs.

Dennis Hull · October 30th, 2002, 08:38 PM

Buddy, as hobbyist I am in phase one/phase two of first trying to ensure camcorder in GL2, VX2000, PDX10 price range is not limiting factor in eventual phase two purchase of HDTV. So, have been reading about "quality" of composite (like VHS) signals; S-VHS next step up and component output (supposedly the best). No camcorder in my price range has component output but on Videoguys site I saw a device that converts DV Firewire output to component output-- input that to TV equipped with component input and you might see even better picture than with S VHS. This is just "book learning" so would like input from those experienced with these devices.

Bill Hardy · October 30th, 2002, 08:49 PM

Perhaps you are right, but I can't see how MPEG2 rendered from pure DV can be better quality even if transferred to DVD. I see pixelization even on DVD movies. The MPEG2 quality I get from rendering DV to 720x480 MPEG2 on a CD is great but not as good as a DV tape to a monitor. And to me it looks pretty evident. Not trying to argue, but it is what I am seeing; a major quality improvement on my setup. I see real broadcast quality here. Too bad it doesn't transfer to VHS tape.
Perhaps I am missing your point. But I have been so into watching from the LCD computer display and figured that was as good as it gets, but seeing DV tape footage of the same edited video impressed me much more. The camera is doing SOMETHING to improve the image but I don't know what. I was really pleasently surprised.

Bill Hardy · October 30th, 2002, 09:03 PM

Hmmm, it just hit me that I watch the edited footage on the computer after rendering it to a full size .mov file

Is Quicktime the reason for this decreased quality as compared to pure DV?

Craig Peer · November 4th, 2002, 03:46 PM

You are correct that mpeg 2 on DVD isn't better than the original. I edit on a Casablanca Kron in native dv and burn dvd's from that. It's ALMOST as good. Not quite as good, but the small loss is outweighed by having it on disk. I don't know anything about Quicktime though. But footage looks good on my Kron with a Toshiba 14" tv with s - video inputs!

Scott Silverman · November 4th, 2002, 06:36 PM

I was just wondering if MPEG-2 is 24 fps? Because when I put my regular 30 fps interlaced onto DVD and played it back on my TV, it looked a little laggy and sort of choppy. If this is the case in MPEG-2, does anybody know of any way to fix it? (I dont have frame mode on my camera.) Thanks!

November 4th, 2002, 06:58 PM

hey buddy,
i've actually noticed that the TiBook LCD is NOT all that great for screening footage, in terms of understanding what it will look like in most real world settings.
edit w/ a TV monitor attached at all times if you can.

John VVV · November 4th, 2002, 10:01 PM

I understand that S-Video is within 1% of the quality of component video -- What ever it is, my eyes can't tell the difference.

Regards, John V.

<<<-- Originally posted by Dennis Hull : Buddy, as hobbyist I am in phase one/phase two of first trying to ensure camcorder in GL2, VX2000, PDX10 price range is not limiting factor in eventual phase two purchase of HDTV. So, have been reading about "quality" of composite (like VHS) signals; S-VHS next step up and component output (supposedly the best). No camcorder in my price range has component output but on Videoguys site I saw a device that converts DV Firewire output to component output-- input that to TV equipped with component input and you might see even better picture than with S VHS. This is just "book learning" so would like input from those experienced with these devices. -->>>

Zac Stein · November 4th, 2002, 10:43 PM

John VVV

Umm not so true about the 1%, more like 5-10, but it is not the quality difference, it is how they represent the picture. One appears slightly softer and colours are displayed to look a little different. S-video seems colder and sharper, while component is slightly more vibrant and has a softened appearence.

kermie

October 30th, 2002, 06:17 PM	#1
Bill Hardy Major Player Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 205	More GL2 impressions I was just noticing how much better the footage looks on a SVHS input TV when the edited footage comes from the camera and not the computer signal...I must say it even rivals the computer 15" LCD display on my Powerbook 667 DVI. Colors are super vibrant and it has more contrast and just looks soooo much better than a computer output. And it is SO SHARP! Wonder why that is. I just made a VHS copy and compared to the origional DV on the same monitor...boy is the image quality robbed! The sooner VHS becomes extinct the better.

October 30th, 2002, 08:38 PM	#3
Dennis Hull Regular Crew Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: St. Paul, MN USA Posts: 151	S VHS Buddy, as hobbyist I am in phase one/phase two of first trying to ensure camcorder in GL2, VX2000, PDX10 price range is not limiting factor in eventual phase two purchase of HDTV. So, have been reading about "quality" of composite (like VHS) signals; S-VHS next step up and component output (supposedly the best). No camcorder in my price range has component output but on Videoguys site I saw a device that converts DV Firewire output to component output-- input that to TV equipped with component input and you might see even better picture than with S VHS. This is just "book learning" so would like input from those experienced with these devices.

November 4th, 2002, 03:46 PM	#6
Craig Peer Regular Crew Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Sacramento, CA Posts: 72	mpeg2 You are correct that mpeg 2 on DVD isn't better than the original. I edit on a Casablanca Kron in native dv and burn dvd's from that. It's ALMOST as good. Not quite as good, but the small loss is outweighed by having it on disk. I don't know anything about Quicktime though. But footage looks good on my Kron with a Toshiba 14" tv with s - video inputs!

November 4th, 2002, 06:36 PM	#7
Scott Silverman Major Player Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Cupertino, California, USA Posts: 301	I was just wondering if MPEG-2 is 24 fps? Because when I put my regular 30 fps interlaced onto DVD and played it back on my TV, it looked a little laggy and sort of choppy. If this is the case in MPEG-2, does anybody know of any way to fix it? (I dont have frame mode on my camera.) Thanks! __________________ Scott Silverman Shining Star Digital Video Productions Bay Area, CA

November 4th, 2002, 10:01 PM	#9
John VVV Regular Crew Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Southern California Posts: 32	Re: S VHS I understand that S-Video is within 1% of the quality of component video -- What ever it is, my eyes can't tell the difference. Regards, John V. <<<-- Originally posted by Dennis Hull : Buddy, as hobbyist I am in phase one/phase two of first trying to ensure camcorder in GL2, VX2000, PDX10 price range is not limiting factor in eventual phase two purchase of HDTV. So, have been reading about "quality" of composite (like VHS) signals; S-VHS next step up and component output (supposedly the best). No camcorder in my price range has component output but on Videoguys site I saw a device that converts DV Firewire output to component output-- input that to TV equipped with component input and you might see even better picture than with S VHS. This is just "book learning" so would like input from those experienced with these devices. -->>>

October 30th, 2002, 08:30 PM	#2
Keith Luken Major Player Join Date: Aug 2002 Posts: 200	Actually I find that the Analog out of the camera is not as good and can be misleading. If I outout form the camera to the tv/monitor it looks OK, but take it out digital to computer and render it on a DVD and it rivals broadcast satellite TV picture quality and/or professional DVDs.

October 30th, 2002, 08:49 PM	#4
Bill Hardy Major Player Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 205	Perhaps you are right, but I can't see how MPEG2 rendered from pure DV can be better quality even if transferred to DVD. I see pixelization even on DVD movies. The MPEG2 quality I get from rendering DV to 720x480 MPEG2 on a CD is great but not as good as a DV tape to a monitor. And to me it looks pretty evident. Not trying to argue, but it is what I am seeing; a major quality improvement on my setup. I see real broadcast quality here. Too bad it doesn't transfer to VHS tape. Perhaps I am missing your point. But I have been so into watching from the LCD computer display and figured that was as good as it gets, but seeing DV tape footage of the same edited video impressed me much more. The camera is doing SOMETHING to improve the image but I don't know what. I was really pleasently surprised.

October 30th, 2002, 09:03 PM	#5
Bill Hardy Major Player Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 205	Hmmm, it just hit me that I watch the edited footage on the computer after rendering it to a full size .mov file Is Quicktime the reason for this decreased quality as compared to pure DV?

November 4th, 2002, 06:58 PM	#8
doctorxex Posts: n/a	hey buddy, i've actually noticed that the TiBook LCD is NOT all that great for screening footage, in terms of understanding what it will look like in most real world settings. edit w/ a TV monitor attached at all times if you can.

November 4th, 2002, 10:43 PM	#10
Zac Stein Major Player Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Melbourne, Australia Posts: 730	John VVV Umm not so true about the 1%, more like 5-10, but it is not the quality difference, it is how they represent the picture. One appears slightly softer and colours are displayed to look a little different. S-video seems colder and sharper, while component is slightly more vibrant and has a softened appearence. kermie