GL2 Halos at DVinfo.net

Howard Meyer · February 3rd, 2004, 08:27 AM

I offered to record a senior citizens exercise class on my new GL2 so that a DVD could be made for each member. When I looked at the tape, I noticed a small tight band (or fringe or halo) of white light around the instructor. She was dressed in black and the background was a light gray. Since I have only had the camera since December, I don't have a lot of footage but this is the only place I have seen this effect. I called Canon and they refused to look at the tape saying I would have to send the entire camera back.
Has anyone else seen the condition?
Its something I can live with but hardly what I expected to see from the GL2 after reading all the good reviews.

Ken Tanaka · February 3rd, 2004, 12:46 PM

What, if anything, did you have on the lens? A filter? An accessory of any kind? Where are you observing this "halo"? While playing the tape on the camera? On a television? On the final DVD?

Your description suggests that you might have your "Sharpness" set too high. But without at least a still image it's impossible to diagnose simply from your description.

Howard Meyer · February 3rd, 2004, 05:55 PM

The only thing in front of the lens was a UV filter. The sharpness was set just on the soft side of the midpoint. It was played from the GL2 into a 19" TV using the provided cable and the AV terminal. A Maxell DVM60SE tape was used and initally recorded in the LP mode. After seeing the fringe it was re-recorded in the SP mode. The results (and quality) were identical.
The camera was tripod mounted; manual focus was used; image stabilizer was turned off; white balance was made on an 18% gray card and a -1 exposure adjustment was made.
To further define the problem, the fringe/halo does not appear everywhere. I did not notice it until I happened to capture a black object against a light gray or biege wall. The average viewer might not even notice the problem but now that I have seen it, its as bad as a paper cut.

Ken Tanaka · February 3rd, 2004, 08:19 PM

This is a mystery to me, Howard. I don't anything unusual with your technique whatsoever. I have never observed such a phenomenon with my GL2. Nor do I recall anyone ever mentioning such an issue here.

If it's really distracting it might be worth sending the camera to Canon for a check-out (along with a sample tape). It certainly does not sound normal.

Joel Ruggiero · February 3rd, 2004, 10:06 PM

was there a lighr behind the person ?? cause i seen some thing a little simalr with a 1ccd cam with a light behind the subject or maybe it is haunted or something!

Howard Meyer · February 4th, 2004, 12:47 PM

There was no light behind the person-just a light colored wall about 15' away. This was in a meeting room with a very high ceiling- maybe 20'- and the only lights were the florescents in the ceiling.
After rerunning the tape again, I can make these additional comments. This halo appears at the interface of a light and dark object but is always lighter than either. It is only a few pixels wide. When viewing the picture on a TV screen, the blue shirt on the instructor exhibited a subtle smearing -towards the right only-across the exposed skin of the arm.
If these effects sound foreign to other users of the GL2, it may be time for a trip to the repair shop.

Andrew Hogan · February 4th, 2004, 03:46 PM

Have you tried it on another TV?

Howard Meyer · February 4th, 2004, 06:07 PM

This phenomena has been observed on a 19" CRT TV as well as a 50" rear projection TV.

Frank Granovski · February 4th, 2004, 06:34 PM

Howard, shoot some test footage here and there to see if you get more of these "halos." These halos could have happened because of poor videography techniques, poor cam setup/positioning, or worse, something indeed is not right with your cam. So do some test shots and then get back to us.

Howard Meyer · February 7th, 2004, 10:46 AM

I did shoot some additional footage with the same results. The problem was most vividly portrayed when I shot a lattice in the garden with the snow as a backdrop. Picture the dark lattice- a series of 2" wide criss-crossing wood strips against a bright ( hazy sun) snow background forming dozens of square holes with the snow visible through the holes. As I slowly zoomed in, the halo problem became visible. To eleminate any influence of my setting preferences, I shot- for the first time- in the Easy Recording mode.
What I recorded was a series of light (lighter than the snow) halos to the left of each wood strip and superimposed on the snow. To the right of the wood strips were halos with a yellow tint. There was no other yellow in the scene.
Reviewing the 4-5 other tapes I shot with this camera shows the same halos when a dark object overlays a lighter background.
Finally, the quality of the picture is better than those from my old Sony High 8 but certainly not the broadcast quality I had expected from all the GL2 reviews I read.

Geff Hinds · July 13th, 2004, 03:02 PM

good news: i also have a new GL2 and have expienced the exact same effect - most prominent on bright objects overlaying dark - OR VICE VERSA. eg: point your lens at a black bird silhouetted against a bright sky and you'll see that white "outline" around the bird. lettering on books or posters is (more subtly) the same.

bad news: i have also seen this "artifacting" -- to one degree or another - in every like piece of video taken by ANY camcorder. the new 3ccd Panasonic GS70 and it's big brother are both particularly guilty of this as well. it's no mystery -- in fact, it can easily be replicated even in a still photo using Photoshop to filter the image with "unsharp mask" (it's in the Filter/Sharpen pull-donw menu), Just watch - viola!

my only surprise here is the the surprise itself registered among other shooters - at least if they understand what (i think) you're describing.

this - i believe -- is a common (if not ubiquitous) result of the sharpening software usually "built-in" to camcorders imaging systems. fortunately, in the case of the GL2 and other like-featured units, the sharpness can be "dialed-back" to a largely acceptable (or nearly acceptable) degree. the "with/without" effect is easily observed even in the viewfinder: set your Custom Presets to include a minus- sharpen (all the way down) adjust and then click the CP button on and off again - there's obvious snapping with sharpness.

does this make sense? ring any more bells??

unless i'm wrong on this -- and i could be -- other than the "sharpness" adjust, i know of no other remedy......

February 3rd, 2004, 08:27 AM	#1
Howard Meyer New Boot Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Plymouth, MI Posts: 22	GL2 Halos I offered to record a senior citizens exercise class on my new GL2 so that a DVD could be made for each member. When I looked at the tape, I noticed a small tight band (or fringe or halo) of white light around the instructor. She was dressed in black and the background was a light gray. Since I have only had the camera since December, I don't have a lot of footage but this is the only place I have seen this effect. I called Canon and they refused to look at the tape saying I would have to send the entire camera back. Has anyone else seen the condition? Its something I can live with but hardly what I expected to see from the GL2 after reading all the good reviews.

February 3rd, 2004, 12:46 PM	#2
Ken Tanaka Retired DV Info Net Almunus Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 6,943	What, if anything, did you have on the lens? A filter? An accessory of any kind? Where are you observing this "halo"? While playing the tape on the camera? On a television? On the final DVD? Your description suggests that you might have your "Sharpness" set too high. But without at least a still image it's impossible to diagnose simply from your description. __________________ Lady X Films: A lady with a boring wardrobe...and a global mission. Hey, you don't have enough stuff! Buy with confidence from our sponsors. Hand-picked as the best in the business...Really! See some of my work one frame at a time: www.KenTanaka.com

February 3rd, 2004, 08:19 PM	#4
Ken Tanaka Retired DV Info Net Almunus Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 6,943	This is a mystery to me, Howard. I don't anything unusual with your technique whatsoever. I have never observed such a phenomenon with my GL2. Nor do I recall anyone ever mentioning such an issue here. If it's really distracting it might be worth sending the camera to Canon for a check-out (along with a sample tape). It certainly does not sound normal. __________________ Lady X Films: A lady with a boring wardrobe...and a global mission. Hey, you don't have enough stuff! Buy with confidence from our sponsors. Hand-picked as the best in the business...Really! See some of my work one frame at a time: www.KenTanaka.com

July 13th, 2004, 03:02 PM	#11
Geff Hinds Tourist Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: kent, wa Posts: 2	halo - over-sharpening ( i believe) good news: i also have a new GL2 and have expienced the exact same effect - most prominent on bright objects overlaying dark - OR VICE VERSA. eg: point your lens at a black bird silhouetted against a bright sky and you'll see that white "outline" around the bird. lettering on books or posters is (more subtly) the same. bad news: i have also seen this "artifacting" -- to one degree or another - in every like piece of video taken by ANY camcorder. the new 3ccd Panasonic GS70 and it's big brother are both particularly guilty of this as well. it's no mystery -- in fact, it can easily be replicated even in a still photo using Photoshop to filter the image with "unsharp mask" (it's in the Filter/Sharpen pull-donw menu), Just watch - viola! my only surprise here is the the surprise itself registered among other shooters - at least if they understand what (i think) you're describing. this - i believe -- is a common (if not ubiquitous) result of the sharpening software usually "built-in" to camcorders imaging systems. fortunately, in the case of the GL2 and other like-featured units, the sharpness can be "dialed-back" to a largely acceptable (or nearly acceptable) degree. the "with/without" effect is easily observed even in the viewfinder: set your Custom Presets to include a minus- sharpen (all the way down) adjust and then click the CP button on and off again - there's obvious snapping with sharpness. does this make sense? ring any more bells?? unless i'm wrong on this -- and i could be -- other than the "sharpness" adjust, i know of no other remedy......

February 3rd, 2004, 05:55 PM	#3
Howard Meyer New Boot Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Plymouth, MI Posts: 22	The only thing in front of the lens was a UV filter. The sharpness was set just on the soft side of the midpoint. It was played from the GL2 into a 19" TV using the provided cable and the AV terminal. A Maxell DVM60SE tape was used and initally recorded in the LP mode. After seeing the fringe it was re-recorded in the SP mode. The results (and quality) were identical. The camera was tripod mounted; manual focus was used; image stabilizer was turned off; white balance was made on an 18% gray card and a -1 exposure adjustment was made. To further define the problem, the fringe/halo does not appear everywhere. I did not notice it until I happened to capture a black object against a light gray or biege wall. The average viewer might not even notice the problem but now that I have seen it, its as bad as a paper cut.

February 3rd, 2004, 10:06 PM	#5
Joel Ruggiero Regular Crew Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Buffalo,NY Posts: 167	was there a lighr behind the person ?? cause i seen some thing a little simalr with a 1ccd cam with a light behind the subject or maybe it is haunted or something!

February 4th, 2004, 12:47 PM	#6
Howard Meyer New Boot Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Plymouth, MI Posts: 22	There was no light behind the person-just a light colored wall about 15' away. This was in a meeting room with a very high ceiling- maybe 20'- and the only lights were the florescents in the ceiling. After rerunning the tape again, I can make these additional comments. This halo appears at the interface of a light and dark object but is always lighter than either. It is only a few pixels wide. When viewing the picture on a TV screen, the blue shirt on the instructor exhibited a subtle smearing -towards the right only-across the exposed skin of the arm. If these effects sound foreign to other users of the GL2, it may be time for a trip to the repair shop.

February 4th, 2004, 03:46 PM	#7
Andrew Hogan Regular Crew Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Canberra AUSTRALIA Posts: 169	Have you tried it on another TV?

February 4th, 2004, 06:07 PM	#8
Howard Meyer New Boot Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Plymouth, MI Posts: 22	This phenomena has been observed on a 19" CRT TV as well as a 50" rear projection TV.

February 4th, 2004, 06:34 PM	#9
Frank Granovski Outer Circle Join Date: May 2002 Location: Hope, BC Posts: 7,524	Howard, shoot some test footage here and there to see if you get more of these "halos." These halos could have happened because of poor videography techniques, poor cam setup/positioning, or worse, something indeed is not right with your cam. So do some test shots and then get back to us.

February 7th, 2004, 10:46 AM	#10
Howard Meyer New Boot Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Plymouth, MI Posts: 22	I did shoot some additional footage with the same results. The problem was most vividly portrayed when I shot a lattice in the garden with the snow as a backdrop. Picture the dark lattice- a series of 2" wide criss-crossing wood strips against a bright ( hazy sun) snow background forming dozens of square holes with the snow visible through the holes. As I slowly zoomed in, the halo problem became visible. To eleminate any influence of my setting preferences, I shot- for the first time- in the Easy Recording mode. What I recorded was a series of light (lighter than the snow) halos to the left of each wood strip and superimposed on the snow. To the right of the wood strips were halos with a yellow tint. There was no other yellow in the scene. Reviewing the 4-5 other tapes I shot with this camera shows the same halos when a dark object overlays a lighter background. Finally, the quality of the picture is better than those from my old Sony High 8 but certainly not the broadcast quality I had expected from all the GL2 reviews I read.