Cannot FF/RW tapes in my GL2 at DVinfo.net

Diane Bogosian · October 21st, 2003, 10:47 PM

First off, thanks to all you pros who take the time to answer what must be simplistic questions from neophytes like me.

Lately, my GL2 has told me to eject the cassette everytime I try to rewind or fast forward a tape. This, of course, sucks. I want to shoot with the GL2, so I've resorted to using my Sony TRV17 to rewind/ff, and to transfer tapes shot on the GL2 to my NLE program. I haven't noticed any picture quality loss (perhaps I haven't started with any! :)) and have had no problem recording. I just cannot ff/rw.

I am using Maxell tapes and, after reading posts here, experimented with recorded panasonics. Same deal. I have RW/FF in my Sony to "tighten" the tape to see if that mattered but to no avail. I'll buy a different brand tomorrow but do not have high hopes.

I read in the manual that the camera will tell me to "eject the cassette" in the case of condensation but I have not been filming in the shower or anything.

Any thoughts?

I have checked GL2 Son of watchdog and have found useful info on use of particular brands, etc. but haven't found an answer to my particular problem so thanks for bearing with me.

Also, I had supposed that the quality of my images were captured on the tape and thus it did not matter if I used another camera to capture images to my NLE. Is this wrong?

I have an extended warranty from the place I got the camera and so, theoretically, can walk in and have the camera replaced (theoretically). But I'd rather 1)understand the problem and 2) keep my camera.

Thanks for your time in responding to this post

Diane

Graham Bernard · October 21st, 2003, 11:22 PM

Diane . . Nasty! Nasty! . . . Yup, I too get the Eject Tape warning. MiniDV is relatively delicate stuff compared to full DV formats. Smaller tape width, smaller rollers, guides and capstans. And all of this is in a "pop-up" caddie that emerges from the innards of the machine. I/we have to take great care in "feeding" and removing miniDV from these animals. Does the Eject tape warning persist on repeat attempts?

My thoughts are to EITHER unpack the tape first - ie FF and then REW - OR start with a piece of recorded black leader first THEN do the FF/REW shimmy . . . . try swapping around your propcess. I'm presuming you can actually capture action on film?

But yes, you've bought an expensive piece of kit, one should expect it to perform straight off and do so for many months OR large numbers of miniDV tapes - which ever comes first - without the hassles you are experienceing - yeah?

I'm not too happy with your range of tried tapes. I aint no tape engineer, but I'm sticking to Sony Premiums . . . . yes I get a hiccup . . . but wiuth the advice that has been given here of late, I've been able to get through it - yeah?

As to filimng in the shower - hah! - Okay condensation is a no no for this activity. But there again how moiste is moiste -yeah? Maybe the sensors are overly cautious - not a bad thing. My thoughts on this is that both the tape AND the cammie would need to be at the same sought of temperature and "dryness" to not set up any form of disparity allowing for condensation to form . . how little there maybe... and again miniDV is tiny tiny engineering, yeah? I don't know the tolerances of condensation values AGAINST the sensor tolerances. Maybe you're storing the tapes in a somewhat differnt environment to the cammie . . maybe a insignificant to you and me, but maybe enough to set of the sensor and give you the warning - yeah? OR after all this chat about dampness it maybe you've been unlucky and got with a doubtful, badly stored batch of minDV tapes . . . I can't say. . . . but I would really stay with one brand . . there's been masses talked about this here and other places . . .

Simplistic question? - nah! No worries and no need! It's the answers you/I/we need to this one . . . keep the faith . . others, myslef included have had this warning and have carried on filming. I had the sdame the other day, AND I had used all the stuff I said. Took the tape out. CAREFULLY replaced and gently pushed the caddie allowing the "lift" to descend back into the bowels of the cammie. Did it take it this time. YES! So what was all that about? - Dunno . . I filmed that night. Used 3 Sony Premiums. Uploaded to my pc and no worries . . .

Diane, pick what you want to out of my ramblings above . . . . but at the end of the day, it is you who will need to make that final decision to return the cammie or not . . . I bet the first thing they ask is if you've been mixing tape brands!

Regards,

Grazie

Barry Goyette · October 21st, 2003, 11:46 PM

Diane

This doesn't sound in anyway normal for the GL2, so my recommendation would be to get it into Canon service immediately. The gl2 does seem to have a more sensitive mechanism than other canon camcorders I own, but eject tape messages have only happened a few times in 18 months. Your case appears to be out of the ordinary, and I would send it in sooner rather than later.

Barry

Ken Tanaka · October 21st, 2003, 11:48 PM

Diane,
I am not a video technician, but I suspect that the camera's tape transport may have detected some sort of contamination. Since you've been switching brands a bit, clearing up the problem may be as simple as running a cleaning tape for the amount of time prescribed on the tape's instructions.

Failing that, you may have to become acquaited with Canon's service department. Simply switching brands of tape will not truly resolve the problem.

Graham Bernard · October 21st, 2003, 11:48 PM

Barry, I agree . . . .

Grazie

Diane Bogosian · October 22nd, 2003, 01:38 PM

Something must have happened, since I have used it without incident since October 02. But nothing I do has worked. I get "eject the cassette" EVERY TIME I try to either rewind or fast forward a tape (over the past several weeks). I'm not rough on the kit, nor have I had it in any remotely questionable environs/conditions. My only suspect are the tapes themselves, Maxells bought at a Sam's Club in a six pack. Perhaps despite their packaging they suffered some sort of abuse?

If I learn anything useful from all of this, I will post it here. Thanks for the advice.

Diane

Barry Goyette · October 22nd, 2003, 02:43 PM

Diane,

Hopefully you are still under warranty...if not I would definitely send a letter to canon indicating that the problem started while it was ...I just had a situation where my gl2 came unraveled right at the end of the warranty period, but I mistook the problem as something wrong with my sony editing deck...I sent a nice letter pleading with them to have mercy...and they did the repair for free...which entailed replacing alot... the entire transport chassis, and several other "chassis".

Barry

Diane Bogosian · October 22nd, 2003, 10:28 PM

I'm still under warranty (bought it 2/03), plus an extended warranty from the retailer (the one people say not to buy, but I've found extremely valuable). I just hope I can get it back before I leave for the Southwest in three weeks...I wonder how long these sort of repairs take?

Jim Hill · October 22nd, 2003, 11:33 PM

Check out this thread as well Diana.

http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthrea...threadid=15739

How do I make this a real link?

(Thanks Graham)

Graham Bernard · October 23rd, 2003, 12:34 AM

How do I make . . .

http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/misc.php?action=bbcode

Barry Goyette · October 23rd, 2003, 09:26 AM

Diane,

Typically canon repair takes 7-10 days to process plus shipping time. I had my gl2 repaired this year and it came back in a little over two weeks...I would include your situation in your letter, as well as marking the package "PRO-EXPEDITE PLEASE". I've found that canon service is pretty responsive...you can also call them once the camera is in their system to check status, and you may be able to change the mailing address over the phone to have the package meet up with you on your trip.

Barry

Diane Bogosian · October 23rd, 2003, 10:27 AM

Read the Wedding Horror thread (thanks for the tip Jim). I guess I'm luckier than Yow in that I didn't try to rw/ff after I got the EJECT message...I just took that sucker out! But my footage is always fine. And I continue to use the camera to shoot, just not to rw/ff. I'm sure I'm tempting fate and will get it in.

Actually, I put a Sony tape in after having all the MAxell tapes trigger the EJECT message after about 5 seconds of rr/ff, and it ran for a good 20 seconds without incident. I thought I had "fixed" the problem, but no. The GL2 demanded I eject the SONY as well.

I have a house full of adolescents and teenagers to deal with here. I don't need to add an overly-sensitive, uncooperative, self-centered CAMERA on top of it!

Reed Gidez · October 24th, 2003, 09:05 PM

Diane

I read somewhere that the various tape manufacturers use different formulations of lubricant on their tapes and that using different brands in the same machine is not a good idea. Has something to do with the different lubes mixing it up a bit.

Has anyone else heard of this?

From day one on my XL1, I have used Panasonic tapes. Just acquired a "previously owned" (ok, USED) GL2 and I am trying to find out from the seller what tape he used.

Reed

Diane Bogosian · October 27th, 2003, 10:09 AM

Reed:

I have certainly read a lot about this on the threads. However, I must tell you that I had used a variety of different tapes heavily in the first few months when I got the camera and never had this problem (ELECT CASSETTE). In fact, it was only after I bought a quantity of Maxell tapes and so used them exclusively that the trouble began...

The Canon website deals with this in FAQ. It says

If the message "REMOVE THE CASSETTE" or "EJECT" appears on the screen
The lit "REMOVE THE CASSETTE" message or flashing "EJECT" message indicates the camcorder's safety mechanism has been activated and has found an internal problem.
This means either the videocassette or the camcorder has developed a problem. Remove the videocassette and reinsert it or replace it with a different videocassette.
If "REMOVE THE CASSETTE" or "EJECT" persists, seek assistance from a Canon Service Facility.

The fact that this is in "Frequently Asked Questions" says something. And I also think whatever the internal problem is, I have a hard time believing it was caused by not sticking to one brand of tape...

One tech told me he thinks its the "IC" (a chip that monitors the cassette mechanism) that needs to be replaced, that it is "bad."

Diane

Graham Bernard · October 27th, 2003, 10:27 AM

Diane, this makes both sense and irritation. This is not a "cheap" cammie. It would be good if the IC protocal call out produced another Error message, suggestion that . . i don't know . . an Error 111 or 666 or whatever, THEN we coould all say ah that is what it is . .having a generic "Alert" to a tape is not acceptable in this day and age - yeah?

Look, Diane, well done, I really do appreciate for your time and reasearch . . . I just wished Mr Canon had been so thorough as you!

. . . hmmmm....

Grazie

October 21st, 2003, 10:47 PM	#1
Diane Bogosian Regular Crew Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: St. Louis, MO Posts: 55	Cannot FF/RW tapes in my GL2 First off, thanks to all you pros who take the time to answer what must be simplistic questions from neophytes like me. Lately, my GL2 has told me to eject the cassette everytime I try to rewind or fast forward a tape. This, of course, sucks. I want to shoot with the GL2, so I've resorted to using my Sony TRV17 to rewind/ff, and to transfer tapes shot on the GL2 to my NLE program. I haven't noticed any picture quality loss (perhaps I haven't started with any! :)) and have had no problem recording. I just cannot ff/rw. I am using Maxell tapes and, after reading posts here, experimented with recorded panasonics. Same deal. I have RW/FF in my Sony to "tighten" the tape to see if that mattered but to no avail. I'll buy a different brand tomorrow but do not have high hopes. I read in the manual that the camera will tell me to "eject the cassette" in the case of condensation but I have not been filming in the shower or anything. Any thoughts? I have checked GL2 Son of watchdog and have found useful info on use of particular brands, etc. but haven't found an answer to my particular problem so thanks for bearing with me. Also, I had supposed that the quality of my images were captured on the tape and thus it did not matter if I used another camera to capture images to my NLE. Is this wrong? I have an extended warranty from the place I got the camera and so, theoretically, can walk in and have the camera replaced (theoretically). But I'd rather 1)understand the problem and 2) keep my camera. Thanks for your time in responding to this post Diane

October 21st, 2003, 11:48 PM	#4
Ken Tanaka Retired DV Info Net Almunus Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 6,943	Diane, I am not a video technician, but I suspect that the camera's tape transport may have detected some sort of contamination. Since you've been switching brands a bit, clearing up the problem may be as simple as running a cleaning tape for the amount of time prescribed on the tape's instructions. Failing that, you may have to become acquaited with Canon's service department. Simply switching brands of tape will not truly resolve the problem. __________________ Lady X Films: A lady with a boring wardrobe...and a global mission. Hey, you don't have enough stuff! Buy with confidence from our sponsors. Hand-picked as the best in the business...Really! See some of my work one frame at a time: www.KenTanaka.com

October 22nd, 2003, 01:38 PM	#6
Diane Bogosian Regular Crew Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: St. Louis, MO Posts: 55	Sending it back Something must have happened, since I have used it without incident since October 02. But nothing I do has worked. I get "eject the cassette" EVERY TIME I try to either rewind or fast forward a tape (over the past several weeks). I'm not rough on the kit, nor have I had it in any remotely questionable environs/conditions. My only suspect are the tapes themselves, Maxells bought at a Sam's Club in a six pack. Perhaps despite their packaging they suffered some sort of abuse? If I learn anything useful from all of this, I will post it here. Thanks for the advice. Diane

October 21st, 2003, 11:22 PM	#2
Graham Bernard Old Boot Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: London UK Posts: 3,633	Diane . . Nasty! Nasty! . . . Yup, I too get the Eject Tape warning. MiniDV is relatively delicate stuff compared to full DV formats. Smaller tape width, smaller rollers, guides and capstans. And all of this is in a "pop-up" caddie that emerges from the innards of the machine. I/we have to take great care in "feeding" and removing miniDV from these animals. Does the Eject tape warning persist on repeat attempts? My thoughts are to EITHER unpack the tape first - ie FF and then REW - OR start with a piece of recorded black leader first THEN do the FF/REW shimmy . . . . try swapping around your propcess. I'm presuming you can actually capture action on film? But yes, you've bought an expensive piece of kit, one should expect it to perform straight off and do so for many months OR large numbers of miniDV tapes - which ever comes first - without the hassles you are experienceing - yeah? I'm not too happy with your range of tried tapes. I aint no tape engineer, but I'm sticking to Sony Premiums . . . . yes I get a hiccup . . . but wiuth the advice that has been given here of late, I've been able to get through it - yeah? As to filimng in the shower - hah! - Okay condensation is a no no for this activity. But there again how moiste is moiste -yeah? Maybe the sensors are overly cautious - not a bad thing. My thoughts on this is that both the tape AND the cammie would need to be at the same sought of temperature and "dryness" to not set up any form of disparity allowing for condensation to form . . how little there maybe... and again miniDV is tiny tiny engineering, yeah? I don't know the tolerances of condensation values AGAINST the sensor tolerances. Maybe you're storing the tapes in a somewhat differnt environment to the cammie . . maybe a insignificant to you and me, but maybe enough to set of the sensor and give you the warning - yeah? OR after all this chat about dampness it maybe you've been unlucky and got with a doubtful, badly stored batch of minDV tapes . . . I can't say. . . . but I would really stay with one brand . . there's been masses talked about this here and other places . . . Simplistic question? - nah! No worries and no need! It's the answers you/I/we need to this one . . . keep the faith . . others, myslef included have had this warning and have carried on filming. I had the sdame the other day, AND I had used all the stuff I said. Took the tape out. CAREFULLY replaced and gently pushed the caddie allowing the "lift" to descend back into the bowels of the cammie. Did it take it this time. YES! So what was all that about? - Dunno . . I filmed that night. Used 3 Sony Premiums. Uploaded to my pc and no worries . . . Diane, pick what you want to out of my ramblings above . . . . but at the end of the day, it is you who will need to make that final decision to return the cammie or not . . . I bet the first thing they ask is if you've been mixing tape brands! Regards, Grazie

October 21st, 2003, 11:46 PM	#3
Barry Goyette Trustee Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: San Luis Obispo CA Posts: 1,195	Diane This doesn't sound in anyway normal for the GL2, so my recommendation would be to get it into Canon service immediately. The gl2 does seem to have a more sensitive mechanism than other canon camcorders I own, but eject tape messages have only happened a few times in 18 months. Your case appears to be out of the ordinary, and I would send it in sooner rather than later. Barry

October 22nd, 2003, 02:43 PM	#7
Barry Goyette Trustee Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: San Luis Obispo CA Posts: 1,195	Diane, Hopefully you are still under warranty...if not I would definitely send a letter to canon indicating that the problem started while it was ...I just had a situation where my gl2 came unraveled right at the end of the warranty period, but I mistook the problem as something wrong with my sony editing deck...I sent a nice letter pleading with them to have mercy...and they did the repair for free...which entailed replacing alot... the entire transport chassis, and several other "chassis". Barry

October 22nd, 2003, 10:28 PM	#8
Diane Bogosian Regular Crew Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: St. Louis, MO Posts: 55	I'm still under warranty (bought it 2/03), plus an extended warranty from the retailer (the one people say not to buy, but I've found extremely valuable). I just hope I can get it back before I leave for the Southwest in three weeks...I wonder how long these sort of repairs take?

October 22nd, 2003, 11:33 PM	#9
Jim Hill New Boot Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Paris Posts: 15	Check out this thread as well Diana. http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthrea...threadid=15739 How do I make this a real link? (Thanks Graham)

October 23rd, 2003, 12:34 AM	#10
Graham Bernard Old Boot Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: London UK Posts: 3,633	How do I make . . . http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/misc.php?action=bbcode

October 23rd, 2003, 09:26 AM	#11
Barry Goyette Trustee Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: San Luis Obispo CA Posts: 1,195	Diane, Typically canon repair takes 7-10 days to process plus shipping time. I had my gl2 repaired this year and it came back in a little over two weeks...I would include your situation in your letter, as well as marking the package "PRO-EXPEDITE PLEASE". I've found that canon service is pretty responsive...you can also call them once the camera is in their system to check status, and you may be able to change the mailing address over the phone to have the package meet up with you on your trip. Barry

October 23rd, 2003, 10:27 AM	#12
Diane Bogosian Regular Crew Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: St. Louis, MO Posts: 55	Read the Wedding Horror thread (thanks for the tip Jim). I guess I'm luckier than Yow in that I didn't try to rw/ff after I got the EJECT message...I just took that sucker out! But my footage is always fine. And I continue to use the camera to shoot, just not to rw/ff. I'm sure I'm tempting fate and will get it in. Actually, I put a Sony tape in after having all the MAxell tapes trigger the EJECT message after about 5 seconds of rr/ff, and it ran for a good 20 seconds without incident. I thought I had "fixed" the problem, but no. The GL2 demanded I eject the SONY as well. I have a house full of adolescents and teenagers to deal with here. I don't need to add an overly-sensitive, uncooperative, self-centered CAMERA on top of it!

October 24th, 2003, 09:05 PM	#13
Reed Gidez Major Player Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Oradell, New Jersey Posts: 283	Diane I read somewhere that the various tape manufacturers use different formulations of lubricant on their tapes and that using different brands in the same machine is not a good idea. Has something to do with the different lubes mixing it up a bit. Has anyone else heard of this? From day one on my XL1, I have used Panasonic tapes. Just acquired a "previously owned" (ok, USED) GL2 and I am trying to find out from the seller what tape he used. Reed

October 27th, 2003, 10:09 AM	#14
Diane Bogosian Regular Crew Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: St. Louis, MO Posts: 55	Reed: I have certainly read a lot about this on the threads. However, I must tell you that I had used a variety of different tapes heavily in the first few months when I got the camera and never had this problem (ELECT CASSETTE). In fact, it was only after I bought a quantity of Maxell tapes and so used them exclusively that the trouble began... The Canon website deals with this in FAQ. It says If the message "REMOVE THE CASSETTE" or "EJECT" appears on the screen The lit "REMOVE THE CASSETTE" message or flashing "EJECT" message indicates the camcorder's safety mechanism has been activated and has found an internal problem. This means either the videocassette or the camcorder has developed a problem. Remove the videocassette and reinsert it or replace it with a different videocassette. If "REMOVE THE CASSETTE" or "EJECT" persists, seek assistance from a Canon Service Facility. The fact that this is in "Frequently Asked Questions" says something. And I also think whatever the internal problem is, I have a hard time believing it was caused by not sticking to one brand of tape... One tech told me he thinks its the "IC" (a chip that monitors the cassette mechanism) that needs to be replaced, that it is "bad." Diane

October 27th, 2003, 10:27 AM	#15
Graham Bernard Old Boot Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: London UK Posts: 3,633	Diane, this makes both sense and irritation. This is not a "cheap" cammie. It would be good if the IC protocal call out produced another Error message, suggestion that . . i don't know . . an Error 111 or 666 or whatever, THEN we coould all say ah that is what it is . .having a generic "Alert" to a tape is not acceptable in this day and age - yeah? Look, Diane, well done, I really do appreciate for your time and reasearch . . . I just wished Mr Canon had been so thorough as you! . . . hmmmm.... Grazie