Attached mic problem at DVinfo.net

Justin Morgan · July 9th, 2003, 01:59 PM

Hi

I've just attched a Sennheiser MKE 300 Directional Microphone to the accesory shoe (and plugged in the cable to the mic socket) of my XM-2. On the LCD display I am only seeing input on the 'L' side of the audio display - the 'R' side is dead (there is no signal).

Unfortunately, I suspect that this is a fault but just wanted to check before I take the mic back. And is the problem more likely to be the mic than the camera - the built-in mic works fine.

Thanks

Graham Bernard · July 9th, 2003, 02:09 PM

You've got the MA300 connected? Well this disables the ambient onboard mic and its 2-channel functions. Putting on the MA300, I guess, prepares the camera to recieve just one channel. As the MA300 is equiped to handle 2 distinct channels L or R, connecting a cable directly to the cammy - this I'd like to know how you've done this - will only produce ONE channel. Now, Ive got the self-same MA300. I've also got a Senni - but this has an XLR cable connected to the left ch. of the MA300.

What are you actually doing? - I'm confused. I doubt you've got a hardware problem.

Hel! SOmebody else take over here . . . please. . .

Grazie

Justin Morgan · July 9th, 2003, 02:18 PM

I have connected the MKE 300 to the accessory shoe on top of the camera (as it says to do in the instructions) and plugged the little cable that comes from the mic into the little mic socket on the side of the camera.

Bud Kuenzli · July 9th, 2003, 02:56 PM

could it be that the cable is only for mono?

Justin Morgan · July 9th, 2003, 03:08 PM

Don't know? I was hoping someone here could help...

Is there a way of telling whether the cable is only for mono - and is it supposed to be stereo?

Graham Bernard · July 9th, 2003, 03:17 PM

There is something really odd being done here Justin - I really can't put my finger on it. I still don't think it is a hardware issue.

Tell me what is the MKE Senni mic? I've got a shotgun ME66 with the K6 power module.

I've found this from another forum - "I bought a sennhieser MKE 300 for my GL1 and have used it to at two weddings. I highly recommend it. The only diavantage is that it is a mono. Radio shack has an adaptor for mono to stereo for the mini jack." - This appears top me that the MKE is in fact a mono mic AND at least for the GL1 Radio Shack has a MONO to STEREO wire set. - Could this be your present predicament? - You're attemtping to apply a MONO feed via a wire set that only gives the Canon ONE channel?

Maybe something here?

Grazie

Justin Morgan · July 9th, 2003, 04:08 PM

Thanks for that. So, it sounds like the MKE 300 is in fact only a mono microphone. The person that sold it to me didn't tell me that - I asked him about the Canon DM-50 mic and he said that this Sennheiser one was much better.

Is the fact that it's only mono actually a bad thing? Should I exchange it for a stereo mic?

Graham Bernard · July 9th, 2003, 04:58 PM

Justin,

I've put together some "light" reading for you.

IMHO you need to be armed with a little more info - next time you visit a mic shoppe:

http://www.lenardaudio.com/education/10_mics.html

This next weblink gives you the full list of senni mics and WHAT they do - along with their "dynamic" recording parameters:
http://www.sennheiser.co.uk/mpindex17.htm

Jump in with both feet - it aint hard. Filling out a tax return is hard - This aint!

Just to whet your appetite:-

The MKE300 is a Cardoid mic.

My ME66 is a Super Cardoid mic.

I would never describe either as a Stereo Mic. If you think about it - What is a Stereo Mic anyway? What would it do and for what reason?

We have an excellent mic on board the XM2. It produces 2 channels. BUT - big but here - How and why is stereo created in the first place AND why is it created?

Do some further reading and all will be made clear . . . on both channels ;-)

Regards,

Grazie

Justin Morgan · July 10th, 2003, 02:34 AM

Thanks very much for your help, for the information and the for the links Graham.

I have read through all the information you've suggested and your (slightly cryptic) post.

Sorry - don't despair but, after reading the info, I still don't have a conlusive answer to my problem. What I am guessing from your info is that the fact that it is mono is not a problem.

It was just a bit worrying to me after having been using the built-in mic for a while (where I had been seeing both the left and right audio channels moving on the display) and then attaching my brand new and expensive mic to see input on only one of the two channels.

So, is this in fact not a problem?

Graham Bernard · July 10th, 2003, 02:59 AM

Nah - I aint despairing - just wanna get you the best shot at this stuff - yeah?

As a simple test I would have suggested that you select the other XLR channel. BUT you only have a single jack plug. Is that right - on your MKE300? You see with the Senni 66, being an XLR pro mic, you get the option to plug it into EITHER of the channels, to test.

You're concerns are well met. You want to make sure both channels are working as they should. I've tried so far to assist. Further than this others might be able to confirm OR suggest a "bolt 'n braces" approach - yeah? Maybe the use of a "Y" adpator to bring 2 separate mic feeds into a stereo female. Then you may well be able to confirm both channels are being taken up. My thoughts are along the lines of plugging another mic - as a test - into one branch of the "Y" and your exsisting mic into the other - don't know. Maybe I'm peeing in the wind here.

But I do admire your persistance - THIS alone will most likely get you thorugh the NITE!

I hope the links were indeed valuable - helped me to understand the differences between, Cardoid, Super Cardoid & Lavlier mics - yes?

As another "trest" approach, go back to the shoppe and have them confirm both channels are working. I suppose you did pick up the fact that when you attach the MA300 all bets are off for the on board mic.

Best regards,

Grazie

Justin Morgan · July 10th, 2003, 03:32 AM

The MKE 300 has a lead that come out of the side of it (I don't think this lead can be changed without opening up the mic) with a little plug on the end which slots into the Jack socket on the side of the camera (in the hole labelled 'MIC'). Surely if something extra was needed to split the signal into stereo this would have come with the microphone or would have been included in the design...?

I have also this morning emailed the place I got it from - Optex in Barnet - who are a reputable supplier - to see if they can shed some light. Haven't heard a reply from them yet.

Yes, your links were helpful - thanks for those and thanks also for YOUR persistence in trying to help me. The fact that the on-board mic would be disabled when I connected the new mic was something I have always been perfectly clear about from the very beginning. I only mentioned the on-board mic because when using it (ie before connecting the new mic) I was seeing data on both the L and R channels of the audio display. With the new mic attached (and hence the on-board mic disabled) I was only seeing data on the L channel of the audio display - which, after being used to seeing both channels move when using the built-in mic, seemed wrong.

Don Palomaki · July 10th, 2003, 04:53 AM

The MKE300 is a mono microphone. It has a mono plug on the cord.

If conencted to a GL series MIC jack, it disables the built in mic, and connects only to the left channel input. The right channel input is shorted by the plug's sleeve. That is normal for this microphone.

Some people use a mono-to-stereo adapter in the mic input to feed the mono signal to both channels. Others pan the left channel only audio to both channels when editing. YOu can find the adapter fr a couple US$ at Radio Shack and other similar outlets.

You can buy find stereo mcirophones for direct camcorder use. A couple exampels are the AT-822, SOny ECM-MS957 and 907C, and ther is a stereo varient of the AT-835.

Justin Morgan · July 10th, 2003, 05:05 AM

Thanks for helping to clear that up, Don.

So would you recommend me getting one of those couple of $ adapters?

Jeff Price · July 10th, 2003, 09:29 AM

It all depends on where you will be playing the footage back. If your typical playback is on a mono TV then I wouldn't worry about it. If stereo is important then you have two choices -

1) The adaptor

2) Fix it in post. That is take the audio track and duplicate it - Voila, stereo.

Bryan Sun · July 10th, 2003, 09:31 AM

Hi Justin,

I have an MKE-300 for my camera too-- it has worked quite well for me. The Radio Shack mono-to-stereo adapter is inexpensive and you can try it, but I would suggest monitoring your audio carefully with headphones if you do. I tried a couple of these adapters and found that the connection was not always secure, so that the audio signal would sometimes cut out, especially if you accidentally touched the plug or adapter when filming. There are probably high-quality adapters out there.

The solution to copy/pan the audio to both channels in editing works fine; that's what I've chosen to do.

Best,
Bryan

July 9th, 2003, 01:59 PM	#1
Justin Morgan Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: London Posts: 189	Attached mic problem Hi I've just attched a Sennheiser MKE 300 Directional Microphone to the accesory shoe (and plugged in the cable to the mic socket) of my XM-2. On the LCD display I am only seeing input on the 'L' side of the audio display - the 'R' side is dead (there is no signal). Unfortunately, I suspect that this is a fault but just wanted to check before I take the mic back. And is the problem more likely to be the mic than the camera - the built-in mic works fine. Thanks

July 9th, 2003, 02:56 PM	#4
Bud Kuenzli Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: North Pole, Alaska Posts: 197	it's the cable? could it be that the cable is only for mono? __________________ on the Internet, when you get where you're going you still don't know where you are

July 10th, 2003, 02:59 AM	#10
Graham Bernard Old Boot Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: London UK Posts: 3,633	I'm Back! Nah - I aint despairing - just wanna get you the best shot at this stuff - yeah? As a simple test I would have suggested that you select the other XLR channel. BUT you only have a single jack plug. Is that right - on your MKE300? You see with the Senni 66, being an XLR pro mic, you get the option to plug it into EITHER of the channels, to test. You're concerns are well met. You want to make sure both channels are working as they should. I've tried so far to assist. Further than this others might be able to confirm OR suggest a "bolt 'n braces" approach - yeah? Maybe the use of a "Y" adpator to bring 2 separate mic feeds into a stereo female. Then you may well be able to confirm both channels are being taken up. My thoughts are along the lines of plugging another mic - as a test - into one branch of the "Y" and your exsisting mic into the other - don't know. Maybe I'm peeing in the wind here. But I do admire your persistance - THIS alone will most likely get you thorugh the NITE! I hope the links were indeed valuable - helped me to understand the differences between, Cardoid, Super Cardoid & Lavlier mics - yes? As another "trest" approach, go back to the shoppe and have them confirm both channels are working. I suppose you did pick up the fact that when you attach the MA300 all bets are off for the on board mic. Best regards, Grazie

July 10th, 2003, 04:53 AM	#12
Don Palomaki Wrangler Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Northern VA Posts: 4,489	The MKE300 is a mono microphone. It has a mono plug on the cord. If conencted to a GL series MIC jack, it disables the built in mic, and connects only to the left channel input. The right channel input is shorted by the plug's sleeve. That is normal for this microphone. Some people use a mono-to-stereo adapter in the mic input to feed the mono signal to both channels. Others pan the left channel only audio to both channels when editing. YOu can find the adapter fr a couple US$ at Radio Shack and other similar outlets. You can buy find stereo mcirophones for direct camcorder use. A couple exampels are the AT-822, SOny ECM-MS957 and 907C, and ther is a stereo varient of the AT-835. __________________ dpalomaki@dspalomaki.com

July 10th, 2003, 09:29 AM	#14
Jeff Price Major Player Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Chico, California Posts: 357	It all depends on where you will be playing the footage back. If your typical playback is on a mono TV then I wouldn't worry about it. If stereo is important then you have two choices - 1) The adaptor 2) Fix it in post. That is take the audio track and duplicate it - Voila, stereo. __________________ Jeff Price Flickerflix Nature Videos flickerflix@yahoo.com

July 9th, 2003, 02:09 PM	#2
Graham Bernard Old Boot Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: London UK Posts: 3,633	You've got the MA300 connected? Well this disables the ambient onboard mic and its 2-channel functions. Putting on the MA300, I guess, prepares the camera to recieve just one channel. As the MA300 is equiped to handle 2 distinct channels L or R, connecting a cable directly to the cammy - this I'd like to know how you've done this - will only produce ONE channel. Now, Ive got the self-same MA300. I've also got a Senni - but this has an XLR cable connected to the left ch. of the MA300. What are you actually doing? - I'm confused. I doubt you've got a hardware problem. Hel! SOmebody else take over here . . . please. . . Grazie

July 9th, 2003, 02:18 PM	#3
Justin Morgan Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: London Posts: 189	I have connected the MKE 300 to the accessory shoe on top of the camera (as it says to do in the instructions) and plugged the little cable that comes from the mic into the little mic socket on the side of the camera.

July 9th, 2003, 03:08 PM	#5
Justin Morgan Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: London Posts: 189	Don't know? I was hoping someone here could help... Is there a way of telling whether the cable is only for mono - and is it supposed to be stereo?

July 9th, 2003, 03:17 PM	#6
Graham Bernard Old Boot Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: London UK Posts: 3,633	There is something really odd being done here Justin - I really can't put my finger on it. I still don't think it is a hardware issue. Tell me what is the MKE Senni mic? I've got a shotgun ME66 with the K6 power module. I've found this from another forum - "I bought a sennhieser MKE 300 for my GL1 and have used it to at two weddings. I highly recommend it. The only diavantage is that it is a mono. Radio shack has an adaptor for mono to stereo for the mini jack." - This appears top me that the MKE is in fact a mono mic AND at least for the GL1 Radio Shack has a MONO to STEREO wire set. - Could this be your present predicament? - You're attemtping to apply a MONO feed via a wire set that only gives the Canon ONE channel? Maybe something here? Grazie

July 9th, 2003, 04:08 PM	#7
Justin Morgan Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: London Posts: 189	Thanks for that. So, it sounds like the MKE 300 is in fact only a mono microphone. The person that sold it to me didn't tell me that - I asked him about the Canon DM-50 mic and he said that this Sennheiser one was much better. Is the fact that it's only mono actually a bad thing? Should I exchange it for a stereo mic?

July 9th, 2003, 04:58 PM	#8
Graham Bernard Old Boot Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: London UK Posts: 3,633	Justin, I've put together some "light" reading for you. IMHO you need to be armed with a little more info - next time you visit a mic shoppe: http://www.lenardaudio.com/education/10_mics.html This next weblink gives you the full list of senni mics and WHAT they do - along with their "dynamic" recording parameters: http://www.sennheiser.co.uk/mpindex17.htm Jump in with both feet - it aint hard. Filling out a tax return is hard - This aint! Just to whet your appetite:- The MKE300 is a Cardoid mic. My ME66 is a Super Cardoid mic. I would never describe either as a Stereo Mic. If you think about it - What is a Stereo Mic anyway? What would it do and for what reason? We have an excellent mic on board the XM2. It produces 2 channels. BUT - big but here - How and why is stereo created in the first place AND why is it created? Do some further reading and all will be made clear . . . on both channels ;-) Regards, Grazie

July 10th, 2003, 02:34 AM	#9
Justin Morgan Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: London Posts: 189	Thanks very much for your help, for the information and the for the links Graham. I have read through all the information you've suggested and your (slightly cryptic) post. Sorry - don't despair but, after reading the info, I still don't have a conlusive answer to my problem. What I am guessing from your info is that the fact that it is mono is not a problem. It was just a bit worrying to me after having been using the built-in mic for a while (where I had been seeing both the left and right audio channels moving on the display) and then attaching my brand new and expensive mic to see input on only one of the two channels. So, is this in fact not a problem?

July 10th, 2003, 03:32 AM	#11
Justin Morgan Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: London Posts: 189	The MKE 300 has a lead that come out of the side of it (I don't think this lead can be changed without opening up the mic) with a little plug on the end which slots into the Jack socket on the side of the camera (in the hole labelled 'MIC'). Surely if something extra was needed to split the signal into stereo this would have come with the microphone or would have been included in the design...? I have also this morning emailed the place I got it from - Optex in Barnet - who are a reputable supplier - to see if they can shed some light. Haven't heard a reply from them yet. Yes, your links were helpful - thanks for those and thanks also for YOUR persistence in trying to help me. The fact that the on-board mic would be disabled when I connected the new mic was something I have always been perfectly clear about from the very beginning. I only mentioned the on-board mic because when using it (ie before connecting the new mic) I was seeing data on both the L and R channels of the audio display. With the new mic attached (and hence the on-board mic disabled) I was only seeing data on the L channel of the audio display - which, after being used to seeing both channels move when using the built-in mic, seemed wrong.

July 10th, 2003, 05:05 AM	#13
Justin Morgan Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: London Posts: 189	Thanks for helping to clear that up, Don. So would you recommend me getting one of those couple of $ adapters?

July 10th, 2003, 09:31 AM	#15
Bryan Sun New Boot Join Date: May 2003 Location: Boston, MA Posts: 5	Hi Justin, I have an MKE-300 for my camera too-- it has worked quite well for me. The Radio Shack mono-to-stereo adapter is inexpensive and you can try it, but I would suggest monitoring your audio carefully with headphones if you do. I tried a couple of these adapters and found that the connection was not always secure, so that the audio signal would sometimes cut out, especially if you accidentally touched the plug or adapter when filming. There are probably high-quality adapters out there. The solution to copy/pan the audio to both channels in editing works fine; that's what I've chosen to do. Best, Bryan