Moire and aliasing issues on Canon 6D

[Andreas Schmidt]

Hello,

I think many like myself are thinking about getting the 6D for video instead of the Mark 3 as it is about $1000 cheaper. So I ordered one early Dec 12 for shooting video. Unfortunately I found out pretty fast that the moire and aliasing issues are so bad that the camera is unusable for video production. I sold it on eBay and now bought the Canon 5D Mark 3 instead. For taking pictures the camera is wonderful and I can highly recommend it.

To show the moire and aliasing issues I uploaded this simple clip.

Simple Test with Canon 6D - YouTube

As I thought this might be of general interest I shared it as this buying and selling costed me more pennies then I liked.

Cheers
- Andreas

[Tony Davies-Patrick]

The 6D is even worse than the older 5D Mark II for moire.

Canon Full Frame Shootout! Canon EOS 6D vs Canon EOS 5D Mark III vs Canon EOS 5D Mark II - YouTube

[James Manford]

Very good comparison.

To be perfectly honest, I think owners of the 5d MK2 shouldn't bother upgrading the body to the MK3 ... I can't tell any significant difference in the video between the MK3 & MK2. Im sure clients won't be able to either!

[Bill Grant]

I think these threads are always interesting. I have the mkIII and the 6D and I used to have the mkII. I see a night and day difference with the mkII and III in low light especially. But that's from actually owning it, not just looking at tests. Also, I've seen no real aliasing issues on the 6D but I never really had issue with it on the mkII either. No one notices moire and aliasing but us pixel peepers. All I know is the mkIII and 6D both live very comfortably at 6400+ ISO and that's all that matters to me for weddings. It's hard to judge the difference with any cameras in good light, it's when things get dark that the great cams shine. That's my opinion.
Bill

[Eric Olson]

Originally Posted by Bill Grant

No one notices moire and aliasing but us pixel peepers.

Generally that's true, but occasionally those pixel level errors create red and grey flashing roofs as in the first post that are impossible to ignore. The same can happen with any objects that have a regular pattern: brick walls, certain fabrics and so forth. While the flashing roofs could have been avoided by slightly defocusing the lens, there is nothing that can fix it after you've shot the video.

[Noa Put]

Originally Posted by Bill Grant

No one notices moire and aliasing but us pixel peepers.

Did you even look at the video Andreas posted? :D Are you really considering this as a pixel peeping issue?

I do agree that most of the time alsiasing and moire is not an issue but in some occasions it can be very nasty and then it will draw all attention to it, no matter who is viewing the footage. The moire in the clip from Andreas I wouldn't even dare to show a client. You have to be blind not to see it.

[Andreas Schmidt]

Originally Posted by Bill Grant

. No one notices moire and aliasing but us pixel peepers.

Hi Bill,

I didn't post this little clip and my experience to be a pixel peeper.

First - I bought the 6D and I was fully aware of the test by Johnnie Behiri on Vimeo:

mmmm…Canon 6D ("beta quality") test footage on Vimeo

and I found it quite acceptable for me. At least for a $1000 difference in price. But what I saw back at home after my first shooting of a festival just made me fall of my chair. Please watch the roofs on my little clip - the are blue flickering "BLUE !" instead just plain red. Defocussing when everything is at infinity might be an option but honestly - not a very good one.

Second - I did post this here just to help everyone to make an informed buying decision as I believe a lot of people are very interested in this camera.

Overall I really loved the camera. Very solid build, good menus. Everything besides that moire and aliasing. I was really sad to let it go.

Cheers
Andreas

[Noa Put]

I think Bill would rather just go out and shoot instead joining this silly discussion, I bet he finds us funny as well ;)

Johnnies video looks very good, you do see some occasional moire and aliasing but I guess the trick is to work around it, only in some cases it's not possible and I must say the sample clip you posted is about as worse I have seen so far. I bet Canon deliberately crippled the camera to protect the 5DIII sales.

[Robert Turchick]

Originally Posted by Bill Grant

I think these threads are always interesting. I have the mkIII and the 6D and I used to have the mkII. I see a night and day difference with the mkII and III in low light especially. But that's from actually owning it, not just looking at tests. Also, I've seen no real aliasing issues on the 6D but I never really had issue with it on the mkII either. No one notices moire and aliasing but us pixel peepers. All I know is the mkIII and 6D both live very comfortably at 6400+ ISO and that's all that matters to me for weddings. It's hard to judge the difference with any cameras in good light, it's when things get dark that the great cams shine. That's my opinion.
Bill

I shot with a 7D for years and edited 5D mk2 footage alongside it. I had seen a little aliasing here and there but no big deal, I used a different camera when it mattered. Then it happened...
I was doing a shoot for a corporate client where they had me steadicam the 7D down a carpeted hallway. BAM...I learned what moire was. The shoot was a total loss for that day and I had to go back with my broadcast camera to fix it. Luckily I didn't have crew or actors to pay for the extra day of shooting and the client was understanding and appreciative that I wouldn't let such a problem go onto their video.
That was the day I made the decision to upgrade to the 5D mk3 and always have my broadcast cam in the car if the 5D mk3 showed any sign of moire.
I had the mk3 the first week it was released and have not seen any issues. As a goofy test I even tried a quick greenscreen shoot and the aliasing is so minimized on the mk3 that it could actually work in a pinch. (the 7D and mk2 were horrible on green screen)
So the pixel peepers aren't the only ones who can see the moire issues. I've seen it several times on local commercials that were shot on dslrs and even my wife says "why is that guy's suit dancing around like that?" Aliasing is a pixel peeper thing though.

[Bill Grant]

Noa,
I do think it's a funny discussion. I shot many a brick wall with the mkII and I always saw the moire, but clients never noticed or said anything. Just in case, I'll be sure to use the mkIII for any tight patterns. I used to see moire using video cams all the time. I still think you guys are being a bit persnickity about it and I may be blind, but blissfully so. :-)
Bill

[Scott Hutchcroft]

Here's my test of the 6D performing in Low Light with some moire issues

Canon 6D Low Light & Moire test - YouTube

[Bill Grant]

Scott
What was your conclusion here? Looks pretty good to me

[Scott Hutchcroft]

Originally Posted by Bill Grant

Scott
What was your conclusion here? Looks pretty good to me

The Moire and aliasing is definitely worse in 1280 x 720 30p. I need to do a test at f4 so as to keep a wider range of focus. But I must say that I purchased the 6D for juicy eye candy close-ups and shallow DOF stuff. I have a Sony EX3 and a Panasonic AC130 for when I want to shoot power lines and brick walls...Ha! At 1080 30p the moire and aliasing is much less noticeable. I love the 6D, now all I have to do is spend $$$ on some more lenses. Below is some footage for a spot I shot recently with the 6D at 1080 30p 50mm f1.4

Canon 6D video Sample on Vimeo

[Tariq Peter]

Can you adjust ISO, Aperture, Sound on the 6D while recording?

[Bill Grant]

Everything but sound and white balance.