Storage- How Are You Handling 5D files at DVinfo.net

Chris Barcellos · October 22nd, 2009, 12:09 PM

Okay, in the HVX200 intro days, this was a constant discussion. With the 5D and 7D, we are facing that again. Having filled a couple of Terabyte disks, I am trying to figure how to go with storage next. I would like to free up those disks, and wonder what others are doing to archive footage. Though I convert to Cineform, I will be saving only the original files. I can always reencode with Cineform, if needed.

Any one have any mass storage ideas at this point ? Is Blue Ray data a possibility ? Stable ?

Tom Daigon · October 22nd, 2009, 01:07 PM

My approach is to convert H.264 files with MPEG Streamclip to Prores 422 then store those on a double sided dvd.I then assign a volume name and number to the dvd and log basic info into a database. This gives me 8 gigs of storage. For Larger projects Blu-ray would be a better way to do it.

Evan Donn · October 22nd, 2009, 01:36 PM

Right now I'm just keeping my source & other project related files on a mirrored array and all the prores files on a raid0. Closing in on about 4TB total from this past year and I just figure I'll add another similar pair of drives to carry me through the next year. At a cost of just a few hundred dollars it seems the cheapest & easiest way to go.

Bill Binder · October 22nd, 2009, 04:22 PM

I just buy 1 Terabyte external eSata drives like they are going out of style, LOL. It's great. I just dropped an eSata card in my PCI slot and now these puppies hum pretty fast once connected externally. And these days, they only cost like $129 or somesuch. Anyway, I keep two copies of the originals (like you I discard the intermediates and keep the untouched originals), with the second kept off site.

Charles W. Hull · October 22nd, 2009, 05:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bill Binder

I just buy 1 Terabyte external eSata drives like they are going out of style, LOL.

This is what I'm doing. Seems like the best approach. I've never quite trusted DVDs for long term storage, and while I love Blu-ray video I'm not yet confident in that media for data storage.

Greg Joyce · October 23rd, 2009, 02:34 PM

I'm running into the same problem with storage, especially when you have to change to PreRes for editing.

I've seen large, cheap internal drives for sale (1.5TB+ at $129). Is it possible to put one of those into what's called an "enclosure" and use that? If the combo had e-Sata, it would be a lot of space for not too much money.

Mike Williams · October 23rd, 2009, 07:51 PM

I back up "critical" footage to DVD, DVD DL, and BluRay disks. Bought an internal BR drive from MCE tech and love it to pieces (plugged right in no issues at all, no additional sw to load)! I find BR blanks for as low as $3 25gb single on the bay. I heard long term is not a good idea on HDD.

At $3 25GB for long term storage is a great solution. Burn MUCH faster than I thought it would. The simplicity is awesome with the latest tiger updates allowing you to create a BR burn folder right on the desktop! Drag and drop 48GB into a burn folder and make some coffee! or keep working because it will let you do that too :)

Gotta love those deals on HDD though. I only store the native files like you mentioned because you can always transcode again.

I bought 50GB ink jet printable BR disks for under $6 delivered..... brand ..starts with an S and ends with an ony BR storage is a solution now that the media is much cheaper than it was only a few months ago.

Chris Barcellos · October 23rd, 2009, 08:45 PM

Well for the next Terabyte, I bought a Vantec NexStar hard drive dock, for $40, and then bought an Hitachi terabyte drive for $70, both at Frys. The Dock works like a popping the hard drive in like a toaster. It all hooks into the SATA set up on my mother board. Should be just like an internal drive, except you can change drive easily by just ejecting one and replacing with another. I will be installing this weekend.

See picture below.

Peer Landa · October 23rd, 2009, 09:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris Barcellos

I am trying to figure how to go with storage next.

Currently I use three hard-drives, one work-drive and two containing redundant backups -- my internal drive is my work-drive, and then I have two external ones for backup -- one of the backup-drives I always keep in my car, and the other I have locked in at work. Over the years I've lost quite a bit of data... and each time I've said "never again".

-- peer

Tom Daigon · October 23rd, 2009, 10:32 PM

Long term storage (if that what you need) on an HDD is looking for trouble. Between reports that magnetic info disipates over time (unless the disk is powered up and files structures are verified) and the always imminent mechanical failure drive are renowned for. If you work in a video production facility like I do, those are not an option. I like Mikes approach, but believe it or not the manner that is accepeted to be most reliable is very expensive file backup to data tape, which sounds to damn slow to me.

Chris Barcellos · October 24th, 2009, 12:12 AM

I can remember when the HVX200 was the rage, and all were trying to figure out what to do. I finally suggested tape backup..

Ben Denham · October 24th, 2009, 02:59 AM

Delkin Devices makes a gold blue ray disc which they "guarantee" to store your data for 200 years. The prices listed on the link below are a around a dollar a Gig which is significantly more expensive than some of the other solutions mentioned but if they do hold data for 200 years then they might even be cheaper in the long term.

I would love to hear anyone's thoughts on this product.

Blu-ray Archival Gold Recordable Media, The 200 Year Disc – Delkin Devices

Gavin Owens · October 24th, 2009, 10:43 AM

Have a look at the Sony XD Deck PDWU1
Sony Product Detail Page - PDWU1

I have been working with XDHD422 a lot and I have to say, it's a solid piece of kit and codec.

The discs are more or less a similar price to Bluray discs

The only thing is that you'll have to convert everything to XD files but for me thats a positive not a negitive

Hope this helps

G

Tom Daigon · October 24th, 2009, 11:37 AM

I would stick to the blu-ray approach. That way if you have Prores clips or movies (or any other sources from clients other then XDCAM) no conversion is needed for archiving.

Steev Dinkins · October 24th, 2009, 12:44 PM

I'm using hard drives through SATA external storage bays and docks. Online drives have 1 copy of current projects. I keep 2 separate backups of those projects - one onsite, one offsite. Then archived projects I put on drives and keep onsite, and have 1 backup of everything offsite. I'll also make DVDs of final exports and compressed versions. It also helps to have things published and distributed on disc or online and that's another way that at least distributed copies exist.

If all that fails? Well screw it, I tried. Life is too short to worry endlessly over this stuff. Find a reasonably convenient method you'll actually use and follow, and move on.

-steev

October 22nd, 2009, 12:09 PM	#1
Chris Barcellos Inner Circle Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Elk Grove CA Posts: 6,838	Storage- How Are You Handling 5D files Okay, in the HVX200 intro days, this was a constant discussion. With the 5D and 7D, we are facing that again. Having filled a couple of Terabyte disks, I am trying to figure how to go with storage next. I would like to free up those disks, and wonder what others are doing to archive footage. Though I convert to Cineform, I will be saving only the original files. I can always reencode with Cineform, if needed. Any one have any mass storage ideas at this point ? Is Blue Ray data a possibility ? Stable ? __________________ Chris J. Barcellos

October 22nd, 2009, 01:36 PM	#3
Evan Donn Major Player Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Philadelphia Posts: 795	Right now I'm just keeping my source & other project related files on a mirrored array and all the prores files on a raid0. Closing in on about 4TB total from this past year and I just figure I'll add another similar pair of drives to carry me through the next year. At a cost of just a few hundred dollars it seems the cheapest & easiest way to go. __________________ My latest short documentary: "Four Pauls: Bring the Hat Back!"

October 23rd, 2009, 02:34 PM	#6
Greg Joyce Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Boston, MA Posts: 106	cheap internal drives -> external drives? I'm running into the same problem with storage, especially when you have to change to PreRes for editing. I've seen large, cheap internal drives for sale (1.5TB+ at $129). Is it possible to put one of those into what's called an "enclosure" and use that? If the combo had e-Sata, it would be a lot of space for not too much money.

October 23rd, 2009, 07:51 PM	#7
Mike Williams Major Player Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: USVI Posts: 232	Optical BR and HDDs I back up "critical" footage to DVD, DVD DL, and BluRay disks. Bought an internal BR drive from MCE tech and love it to pieces (plugged right in no issues at all, no additional sw to load)! I find BR blanks for as low as $3 25gb single on the bay. I heard long term is not a good idea on HDD. At $3 25GB for long term storage is a great solution. Burn MUCH faster than I thought it would. The simplicity is awesome with the latest tiger updates allowing you to create a BR burn folder right on the desktop! Drag and drop 48GB into a burn folder and make some coffee! or keep working because it will let you do that too :) Gotta love those deals on HDD though. I only store the native files like you mentioned because you can always transcode again. I bought 50GB ink jet printable BR disks for under $6 delivered..... brand ..starts with an S and ends with an ony BR storage is a solution now that the media is much cheaper than it was only a few months ago.

October 23rd, 2009, 08:45 PM	#8
Chris Barcellos Inner Circle Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Elk Grove CA Posts: 6,838	Well for the next Terabyte, I bought a Vantec NexStar hard drive dock, for $40, and then bought an Hitachi terabyte drive for $70, both at Frys. The Dock works like a popping the hard drive in like a toaster. It all hooks into the SATA set up on my mother board. Should be just like an internal drive, except you can change drive easily by just ejecting one and replacing with another. I will be installing this weekend. See picture below. Attached Thumbnails __________________ Chris J. Barcellos

October 22nd, 2009, 01:07 PM	#2
Tom Daigon Regular Crew Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Las Vegas, NV Posts: 170	My approach is to convert H.264 files with MPEG Streamclip to Prores 422 then store those on a double sided dvd.I then assign a volume name and number to the dvd and log basic info into a database. This gives me 8 gigs of storage. For Larger projects Blu-ray would be a better way to do it.

October 22nd, 2009, 04:22 PM	#4
Bill Binder Major Player Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: San Francisco Posts: 542	I just buy 1 Terabyte external eSata drives like they are going out of style, LOL. It's great. I just dropped an eSata card in my PCI slot and now these puppies hum pretty fast once connected externally. And these days, they only cost like $129 or somesuch. Anyway, I keep two copies of the originals (like you I discard the intermediates and keep the untouched originals), with the second kept off site.

October 23rd, 2009, 10:32 PM	#10
Tom Daigon Regular Crew Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Las Vegas, NV Posts: 170	Long term storage (if that what you need) on an HDD is looking for trouble. Between reports that magnetic info disipates over time (unless the disk is powered up and files structures are verified) and the always imminent mechanical failure drive are renowned for. If you work in a video production facility like I do, those are not an option. I like Mikes approach, but believe it or not the manner that is accepeted to be most reliable is very expensive file backup to data tape, which sounds to damn slow to me.

October 24th, 2009, 12:12 AM	#11
Chris Barcellos Inner Circle Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Elk Grove CA Posts: 6,838	I can remember when the HVX200 was the rage, and all were trying to figure out what to do. I finally suggested tape backup.. __________________ Chris J. Barcellos

October 24th, 2009, 02:59 AM	#12
Ben Denham Regular Crew Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: NSW Australia Posts: 149	archival blue ray discs Delkin Devices makes a gold blue ray disc which they "guarantee" to store your data for 200 years. The prices listed on the link below are a around a dollar a Gig which is significantly more expensive than some of the other solutions mentioned but if they do hold data for 200 years then they might even be cheaper in the long term. I would love to hear anyone's thoughts on this product. Blu-ray Archival Gold Recordable Media, The 200 Year Disc – Delkin Devices

October 24th, 2009, 10:43 AM	#13
Gavin Owens Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Grado, Asturias, Spain Posts: 39	This might be the most reliable option Have a look at the Sony XD Deck PDWU1 Sony Product Detail Page - PDWU1 I have been working with XDHD422 a lot and I have to say, it's a solid piece of kit and codec. The discs are more or less a similar price to Bluray discs The only thing is that you'll have to convert everything to XD files but for me thats a positive not a negitive Hope this helps G

October 24th, 2009, 11:37 AM	#14
Tom Daigon Regular Crew Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Las Vegas, NV Posts: 170	I would stick to the blu-ray approach. That way if you have Prores clips or movies (or any other sources from clients other then XDCAM) no conversion is needed for archiving.

October 24th, 2009, 12:44 PM	#15
Steev Dinkins Major Player Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: San Francisco, CA Posts: 613	I'm using hard drives through SATA external storage bays and docks. Online drives have 1 copy of current projects. I keep 2 separate backups of those projects - one onsite, one offsite. Then archived projects I put on drives and keep onsite, and have 1 backup of everything offsite. I'll also make DVDs of final exports and compressed versions. It also helps to have things published and distributed on disc or online and that's another way that at least distributed copies exist. If all that fails? Well screw it, I tried. Life is too short to worry endlessly over this stuff. Find a reasonably convenient method you'll actually use and follow, and move on. -steev __________________ www.holyzoo.com