Cheap follow focus for 5D mk2 under 150 $ wow

[Dylan Couper]

Originally Posted by Dennis Wood

95% of our customers are paid for what they do...and a cheap FF would be (and has been btw) categorically rejected.

Hey, you'll love this one...

Remember the P&S Technik mini35? You know, that $10,000 ground glass 35mm adapter that masses of us drooled over but never really thought we'd ever get a chance to own? I bet 95% of the people who bought it got paid for what they did, and probably also rejected the idea of a cheap version too...

But fortunately, those people only represented about 0.5% of the mid level+ video market. Probably less even... and the rest of us said: that thing is about $4 of technology, $10 of parts, and I could make the damn thing in my garage!

I don't really need to continue the history lesson...

So... you are now making a $10,000 mini35 adapter, only SMALLER, LIGHTER, STRONGER, and BETTER, for $900... and you're telling us that a quality $200 FF unit is not possible...? :)

[Jon Fairhurst]

Originally Posted by Dylan Couper

So... you are now making a $10,000 mini35 adapter, only SMALLER, LIGHTER, STRONGER, and BETTER, for $900... and you're telling us that a quality $200 FF unit is not possible...? :)

Clearly, $200 FF units are possible. They exist, but not at the quality of a $900 unit.

I'm a some-time composer. There's a thriving market for sample libraries. You can get a library of a full orchestra for $10k, $1k, or $200 - and the $200 lib is from a US company. It sells in high volumes to students. Does it compare with the $1k and $10k libraries in coverage, quality and versatility? Far from it. Do any compare with hiring an orchestra, musical director, and sound stage? Certainly not.

I'm no market fundamentalist. (The market serves demand, which is desire plus buying power, rather than human need. If human need were the driver, we'd all be racing to deliver clean water, food and health care to the 3rd world.) That said... if there is a gaping hole in the FF market, it's a vacuum that the market will fill.

In fact, if the market opportunity is that big, rather than prodding Dennis to act, you should be talking with the SBA to get a loan to start your own FF company. With the current fate of the auto industry, you could easily find mechanical engineering talent, as well as machining talent and capacity.

Personally, I see the FF landscape as a niche market. $200 FF units will improve in quality, but will not have the volume to fundamentally change the current market dynamics.

[Marcus Marchesseault]

"... and the rest of us said: that thing is about $4 of technology, $10 of parts, and I could make the damn thing in my garage!"

And how many people are satisfied with their $14 lens adapters with plastic mounts that make lens attachment risky and back focus difficult. A decent used Nikon lens is $150 and I wouldn't put even that on a plastic adapter. I shouldn't even mention how silly it would be to put a really good lens that costs $1000 on a JB Weld adapter with a grocery bag diffuser.

There is a cost to making movies one way or another. Using equipment that takes twice as long to set up annoys your cast and crew and makes everyone tired and cranky on the set. If you are not getting paid and do it just for the love of making movies, you still have the cost of using up the favors and patience of all your friends. If you have any advanced amateurs that can put in a decent performance and you waste their time with junk equipment, you won't get any more free acting performances out of them.

[Chris Barcellos]

Originally Posted by Dylan Couper

Hey, you'll love this one...

Remember the P&S Technik mini35? You know, that $10,000 ground glass 35mm adapter that masses of us drooled over but never really thought we'd ever get a chance to own? :)

I kind of felt sorry for the guy that was advertizing recently on this forum to sell his Mini35, that he paid $ 9,000 for. He is now trying to sell at half price. With the onslaught of the 5D and the GH1, there are a lot of people second guessing their adapter purchases.

[Dylan Couper]

Originally Posted by Marcus Marchesseault

"... and the rest of us said: that thing is about $4 of technology, $10 of parts, and I could make the damn thing in my garage!"

And how many people are satisfied with their $14 lens adapters with plastic mounts that make lens attachment risky and back focus difficult. A decent used Nikon lens is $150 and I wouldn't put even that on a plastic adapter. I shouldn't even mention how silly it would be to put a really good lens that costs $1000 on a JB Weld adapter with a grocery bag diffuser.

Marcus, you've missed my point. The prototypes for what became the current bunch of adapters started off as a bunch of guys inspired to make their own because they saw a product that was completely overpriced and grew inspired. Those $14 lens adapters became what you now know as the Letus, Brevis, M2, etc... (ok, some were more than $14), all of which have basicaly obliterated the mini35 from the marketplace.
Hope that helps.

PS. Dozens of us have $1200+ Nikon lenses mounted with cheap $6 ebay EF adapters that used to cost $200. When the is a demand, there WILL be a supply.

[John Benton]

I have a D-Focus and am very happy with it.
But I need more rings for lenses (without paying 15$ for a large ring)

Anyone getting there own "32 pitch", (0.8 mod) flexible racks?
to wrap around lenses?
I have a few Big zooms and switching the rings isn't ideal

Thanks
J

[Dennis Wood]

Jon, we have a new version of our constant diameter 360 degree universal rings that we're debuting in about two weeks. They're completely redesigned and no, they won't be $15, but they will be a whole lot less expensive (60% less) than our current annodized aluminum parts. Because our shooters do require from 3 to 7 of these per kit, we have invested in mass producing them out of composite materials using brass inserts, non-marking "spokes" etc. Some will recall our remote programmable focus controller (shown at NAB09) which of course could also be tasked with remote aperture or remote zoom. In any case, these rings are designed for all three tasks and are a whole lot easier to mount now too. Importantly for Zeiss lens users, they are effective over 360 degrees.

We've also just designed and kicked off production of inexpensive hard stops for the Durus FF ... compliments of those NAB09 attendees who asked us to figure something out :-)

Cheers,
Dennis Wood
www.cinevate.com

[John Benton]

Dennis,
That's great!
Should I just stayed tuned to cinevate.com?

J

Originally Posted by Dennis Wood

Jon, we have a new version of our constant diameter 360 degree universal rings that we're debuting in about two weeks. They're completely redesigned and no, they won't be $15, but they will be a whole lot less expensive (60% less) than our current annodized aluminum parts. Because our shooters do require from 3 to 7 of these per kit, we have invested in mass producing them out of composite materials using brass inserts, non-marking "spokes" etc. Some will recall our remote programmable focus controller (shown at NAB09) which of course could also be tasked with remote aperture or remote zoom. In any case, these rings are designed for all three tasks and are a whole lot easier to mount now too. Importantly for Zeiss lens users, they are effective over 360 degrees.

We've also just designed and kicked off production of inexpensive hard stops for the Durus FF ... compliments of those NAB09 attendees who asked us to figure something out :-)

Cheers,
Dennis Wood
www.cinevate.com

[Dennis Wood]

I can't edit posts...so forgive the double post. Dylan, the build quality of the mini35 is clearly at a level on its own. Is that overkill for the job it does? For rental companies, their prime customer, absolutely not. For your average money stressed independent film-maker? Yes.

There are cheap FF units out there already. We've talked to literally hundreds of folks who've attempted to use these units professionally. You'll find FreshDV has none of them reviewed. That doesn't mean they haven't reviewed them...it just means they could not recommend folks waste money on them at all.

In any case, I think my point has been adequately made. I'd encourage readers to go with what makes sense to them personally :-) If you only occasionally shoot, it would make for more sense to save your money and focus directly on the lens barrel.

Cheers,
Dennis.

[Steve Witt]

Originally Posted by Dylan Couper

Quoted for truth.

A follow focus, regardless of the price point, is about $0.04 of technology, $8.35 (or less) of materials, and $24.60 of mass production time/machining (or $4.60 if made overseas). The only reason they've been selling at $2000+ is because the lack of demand from the low end of the industry. Now that budget filmmakers are demanding them, we'll probably start seeing a whole lot more options under $300 in the next 2 years. The $2000 market will always be there, since no one will ever put a $300 Indian made FF on their $250,000 35mm system, but demand at a price point will create supply at that price point.

So... bad for the mid range companies but good for all of us!
Anyway, I'm also looking forward to reviews!

Oh, and when DaVinci was making his follow focus, he probably would have whipped up other overpriced low-tech film items such as a crane, dolly, Steadicam, matte box, and Firestore while he was at it.

Interesting Dylan. With such an over-simplified perspective on this, why not design your own FF and let us know what you come up with.

[Christopher McCord]

Originally Posted by Nigel Barker

Not quite. D | FOCUS

This one appears to be cheaper...

HDV Blog: DIY LEGO Follow Focus for EOS 5D Mark II PART 1

http://ryo1972.web.infoseek.co.jp/HD..._follow_1.html

http://vimeo.com/3358395

[Dylan Couper]

Originally Posted by Steve Witt

Interesting Dylan. With such an over-simplified perspective on this, why not design your own FF and let us know what you come up with.

I'll design it.... you build it. Deal?

Edit: I just saw the Lego one. I don't think I can build one cheaper than that.