SHUTTER CONTROL is what we need!! at DVinfo.net

Nicky Campos · December 14th, 2008, 04:19 PM

Hi all, there are several ways to get aperture control of the 5Dm2... now we desperately need SHUTTER CONTROL!!!

Then we will have what we want :) - 1/60th, 1/125th = nice film-motion... hhmmmmmm!

Whenever my 5Dm2 uses anything below 1/60th shutter it looks like video ..... HELP!

Ive noticed when zooming in telephoto on the kit-lens the camera chooses nicer shutter speeds... But then it unlocks when you zoom out again...

The exposure compensation wheel helps sometimes but Canon have this incredible way of not allowing the "golden iso/shutter combo" no matter how hard I try and play and fiddle!!

Floris van Eck · December 16th, 2008, 01:06 PM

Euh... film motion is 1/24 and not 1/60 or 1/125.

So it works the opposite as what you say.

Mathieu Kassovitz · December 16th, 2008, 01:33 PM

Actually, it is a 180-degree 1/48th shutter speed (24 frames per second). At 30p, 180-degree is 1/60th.

Jon Fairhurst · December 16th, 2008, 02:19 PM

I'm wondering is 1/60 is the correct target for a 30p camera. If you go with 1/50th (close to 1/48th), you get the same smear as with 24 fps 1/48th. And, yes, it will be smoother than 24 fps, if that's what you want for the shot.

The other interesting shutter is 1/80th. That speed has roughly the same "gap" as 24 fps 1/48, and has less smear. On the other hand, we have a higher frame rate so less smear might be the way to go. It would give us judder, but without the 3/2 cadence, which isn't natural anyway. Film was made to be projected at 24 fps (usually with two flashes per frame), not at 30 fps with an irregular cadence.

24fps 1/48
Open: 20.8 ms
Closed: 20.8 ms

30fps 1/80
Open: 12.5 ms
Closed: 20.8 ms

30fps 1/60
Open: 16.7 ms
Closed 16.7 ms

30fps 1/50
Open 20.0 ms
Closed: 13.3 ms

Now, if only we could reliably control it!

Mathieu Kassovitz · December 16th, 2008, 05:57 PM

As 3/2 cadence, you are referring the 30p 1/50th shutter speed *2'' open 1.33'' closed* correct?

At first glance, I thought the same. I've changed my mind though. For 24 frames conversion, keeping the 180-degree seems the best option.

Jon Fairhurst · December 16th, 2008, 06:22 PM

Mathieu,

In the US we use a 3:2 cadence to show 24p on a 60i or 60p TV. The television shows film frame #1 twice, #2 three times, #3 twice, #4 three times, etc. So, not only do we get the 24 fps judder due to the slow motion, but we get a strange syncopation effect.

There are 2,3,2,3 cadences and 2,3,3,2 cadences and other sub-variations possible when dealing with 24p to 60i.

I'm thinking that rather than this bizarre 24 to 60 cadence, a 30p with the right shutter speed might still give us the dreamlike feel without the one-short-leg-one-long-leg problem that 24p presents.

In Europe, this doesn't apply. Stick with 24p and speed it up by 4% and double the frames for your 50 Hz TVs. I still don't get why Canon didn't support the European market with 25p.

December 16th, 2008, 06:22 PM	#6
Jon Fairhurst Inner Circle Join Date: May 2006 Location: Camas, WA, USA Posts: 5,513	Mathieu, In the US we use a 3:2 cadence to show 24p on a 60i or 60p TV. The television shows film frame #1 twice, #2 three times, #3 twice, #4 three times, etc. So, not only do we get the 24 fps judder due to the slow motion, but we get a strange syncopation effect. There are 2,3,2,3 cadences and 2,3,3,2 cadences and other sub-variations possible when dealing with 24p to 60i. I'm thinking that rather than this bizarre 24 to 60 cadence, a 30p with the right shutter speed might still give us the dreamlike feel without the one-short-leg-one-long-leg problem that 24p presents. In Europe, this doesn't apply. Stick with 24p and speed it up by 4% and double the frames for your 50 Hz TVs. I still don't get why Canon didn't support the European market with 25p. __________________ Jon Fairhurst

December 14th, 2008, 04:19 PM	#1
Nicky Campos Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Johannesburg, South Africa Posts: 35	SHUTTER CONTROL is what we need!! Hi all, there are several ways to get aperture control of the 5Dm2... now we desperately need SHUTTER CONTROL!!! Then we will have what we want :) - 1/60th, 1/125th = nice film-motion... hhmmmmmm! Whenever my 5Dm2 uses anything below 1/60th shutter it looks like video ..... HELP! Ive noticed when zooming in telephoto on the kit-lens the camera chooses nicer shutter speeds... But then it unlocks when you zoom out again... The exposure compensation wheel helps sometimes but Canon have this incredible way of not allowing the "golden iso/shutter combo" no matter how hard I try and play and fiddle!!

December 16th, 2008, 01:06 PM	#2
Floris van Eck Major Player Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 993	Euh... film motion is 1/24 and not 1/60 or 1/125. So it works the opposite as what you say.

December 16th, 2008, 01:33 PM	#3
Mathieu Kassovitz Major Player Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: paris Posts: 289	Actually, it is a 180-degree 1/48th shutter speed (24 frames per second). At 30p, 180-degree is 1/60th.

December 16th, 2008, 02:19 PM	#4
Jon Fairhurst Inner Circle Join Date: May 2006 Location: Camas, WA, USA Posts: 5,513	I'm wondering is 1/60 is the correct target for a 30p camera. If you go with 1/50th (close to 1/48th), you get the same smear as with 24 fps 1/48th. And, yes, it will be smoother than 24 fps, if that's what you want for the shot. The other interesting shutter is 1/80th. That speed has roughly the same "gap" as 24 fps 1/48, and has less smear. On the other hand, we have a higher frame rate so less smear might be the way to go. It would give us judder, but without the 3/2 cadence, which isn't natural anyway. Film was made to be projected at 24 fps (usually with two flashes per frame), not at 30 fps with an irregular cadence. 24fps 1/48 Open: 20.8 ms Closed: 20.8 ms 30fps 1/80 Open: 12.5 ms Closed: 20.8 ms 30fps 1/60 Open: 16.7 ms Closed 16.7 ms 30fps 1/50 Open 20.0 ms Closed: 13.3 ms Now, if only we could reliably control it! __________________ Jon Fairhurst

December 16th, 2008, 05:57 PM	#5
Mathieu Kassovitz Major Player Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: paris Posts: 289	As 3/2 cadence, you are referring the 30p 1/50th shutter speed 2'' open 1.33'' closed correct? At first glance, I thought the same. I've changed my mind though. For 24 frames conversion, keeping the 180-degree seems the best option.