New 60d advise at DVinfo.net

Steve Bleasdale · March 18th, 2011, 04:19 PM

Hi folks

New 60d arriving tommorow, cant wait, just a few questions anyone to help... as i understand i need for video footage sandisk class 10 or class 6 extreme, 8gb or better 16gb do i get 20mb or 30mb or does it not matter??
When i do my photography days and not video do i need the extreme and can i just get the cheaper class 4 or do i need 6??
I have a 50mm 1.8 + a 18-55 kit lens, a broken 17-55mm canon 2.8 but wasnt keen on it anyway? so i have lens in mind?
help me choose bearing in mind i need both video and stills.. so tamron 17-50 2.8... sigma 30mm 1.4 prime..... 24mm 2.8 canon, cant afford the 1.4.... 28mm 1.8 canon... tokina 11-16mm 2.8.....help. steve

John Wiley · March 18th, 2011, 05:33 PM

Tokina 11-16 and Tamron 17-50 are two of the most highly recommended lenses for video with the Canon DSLR's.

As for primes, have you considered checking out older Nikon and Pentax glass and using adaptors? No autofocus for stills but you'll save a ton of money.

Steve Bleasdale · March 18th, 2011, 05:50 PM

Hi John thanks for reply, yes i have looked into older glass but everytime in the description it either says dust on the glass and a little fungus and a little this and that so it has put me offfff. steve

Steve Bleasdale · March 19th, 2011, 05:05 PM

Hi all just to add with the 60d, what do you guys in general use for picture quality, neutral or faithful? what other settings do you find best? obviously weddings my game!! Bruce has given me some great advice, would like to hear from others with their settings and workflow.. so shutter 1/50 pal, iso 100/400 if poss, fast primes going for 28mm 1.8. 85mm 1.8 and got 50mm 1.8, possibly 24mm 2.8 or tokina 11-16 , set my white balance? does anyone use auto wb? p mode, av mode, or full manual??? steve

Chris Westerstrom · March 19th, 2011, 07:37 PM

hey steve, I'll bite
I use the 7d
ISO settings on 160, 320, 640 and double that there on out, if I have to go up to near 1600 I use NEAT video plugin to remove noise, although, most the time, I actually sort of like the noise for some of the work that needs a little nostalgia feel anyways
I usually stick to the 180 degree rule with shutter speed, that is twice the frame rate, although I have no problem with lowering it to 40 or even 30 (i am in Europe so I almost always shoot in PAL) to get more light in, instead of opening up too much or increasing ISO, I find this works fine and adds a touch more motion blur which is a plus not a minus
White balance, I start with a preset, then roll the color temperature to what I find is the best (not always the one that matches actual white most)
For picture profile, I use neutral, have played around with some of the more radical flat settings but I find that neutral is best for minimal grading, especially since I have to hand over material to other editors for broadcast and when I edit myself, usually the turnaround time for the project is too short to do anything beside minor correction and some added contrast.

I shoot with tamron 17-50 2.8, canon 70-200 2.8 and some vintage primes in 28, 30 and 50.
It seems more and more that the 30 is the one that stays on my camera the most
I might get a tokina 11-16 2.8 eventually.
that is my personal kit, the production company I film for equips me with the 5d and a canon 24-70 which is way better than anything else on the 7d, especially when it comes to low light, but 90% of what I shoot is with the 7d anyways( a little frustrated as the t2i, 60d and 600d seem to all be of more value for their price)

Steve Bleasdale · March 20th, 2011, 03:03 AM

Thanks Chris i appreciatte your reply, first lens is the 28mm 1.8 then as the reviews just give the 28 the edge over the sigma 30mm, and to cover i will get the tamron zoom for stills. The 85mm maybe to give me something longer in the church as i cant afford the 70-22, I am not a lover of the flat look, my brides love colour tone! to them they just want good colours good footage nice and smooth, so would that be neutral with standard settings saturation default?? i will introduce the 60d and then see how it goes, still use my cams for now?? thanks again

Chris Westerstrom · March 20th, 2011, 05:03 AM

interesting, what brand is the 28 1.8 that got better reviews? there is really hardly any noticeable difference IMO between the 28-30mm IMO, I was considering updating to the sigma 30 1.4, but if that 28 1.8 got better reviews, I might have to re-think!

As for the longer lenses, IMO it does get harder to 'catch' footage with longer lenses on DSLR's than it is with a HD video cam like , thanks to short focus and so on. But some churches are pretty dark, so it could be a trade off. I've only shot a couple of wedding films, not really what I do, but do have some clients that sort of forced me to film relatives of theirs.
If you have to record whole ceremonies, I'd probably stick with the Video camera and then get supporting footage with your DSLR that will be more attractive.

As I said about picture settings, use neutral if you aren't looking to grade much.
The flat settings that you can download are to give you more leeway when you grade, so you'll get more color and so on in post. This isn't something that there is any one answer too.
Way better cinematographers then myself will probably shoot super flat, because they can grade. I shoot and for my own projects have my own settings that I like, that (I HOPE!!!) have my own look. Sometimes I leave my stuff to other editors or have a director or DOP over me, they often decide my settings.
More often than not, my clients, editors, DOP seem to more and more just want the footage shot in neutral.

Steve Bleasdale · March 20th, 2011, 09:36 AM

Hi Chris

It was on the rockwell photography site, he says the canon 28mm 1.8 is better build better focus system, overall similar picture quality, but looks the part also as its the same colour black as the 60d 550d 7d 600d.
Also the 28mm is built to last and the sigma cheaper build? Will try various picture setinhgs!! What is your prefered settings work flow ie shutter, iso, apeture, focus, film, when you get to an event? steve

Spiros Zaharakis · March 20th, 2011, 02:06 PM

Steve, congrats on your new 60D. It's a great camera.
1) You don't have to go with the expensive Sandisc cards, Transcend Class10 cards are the best VFM in the market.I would go with a couple 32GB cards.
2) Tokina 11-16 is a great lens, the Canon 28 f1.8 is fine but I really prefer the 30 f1.4 Sigma. I have to dissagree with Ken Rockwell's verdict (as do many other tests around). For a 50mm for video use, no way I would chose the Canon f1.8 with the inaccurate, flimsy,short travel focus ring. A used MF Olympus or Pentax Tacumar would be my first choice. Actually any old MF (except FD or MD mount) in good condition would be a better choice. The 85 f1.8 is a great lens but if you don't shoot stills then maybe the Samyang 85 f1.4 should also be on your list.
3) The Neutral picture style as is is fine if you don't colour grade, otherwise knock down the contrast at -3 or -4 and saturation at -1 or -2 if you do.Faithfull will give you redish skin tones (not my favorite)

Steve Bleasdale · March 21st, 2011, 04:45 AM

Hi Spiros thanks for your input!! Do you have a link for the class 10s as im struggling to buy them, they seem so expensive at the moment, would class 6 do as it says in the manual... Is the picture setting neutral default neutral? So key that in user define 1 and save it or just use default neutral? Lastly Spiros i do actually do stills also so im in a bit of a mind bending decisions, here are my choices!!! i have the 50mm plastic fantastic, and 18-55 kit lens, was thinking to buy tamron 17-50mm vc, or sigma 17-50mm, the 28mm 1.8 canon, or just go all primes 28mm, 50mm, 85mm, and zoom with feet!! or get at least one zoom mentioned as i think i am guna need that for stills!!
or i could get tokina 11-16mm and the 30mm 1.4 sigma keep the kit lens and the 50mm 1.8 for lowish light!!! steve

Colin Rowe · March 21st, 2011, 05:29 AM

Hi Steve.
Re class 10 cards.

Transcend 16GB SDHC Class 10 Memory Card: Amazon.co.uk: Computers & Accessories

http://www.7dayshop.com/catalog/prod...ucts_id=110291

Spiros Zaharakis · March 21st, 2011, 09:17 AM

Steve, for picture style I suggest that you start with the default neutral setting and adjust contrast and saturation to your taste.
IMHO you will need to knock down contrast and saturation a bit even if you don't plan to colour grade in post.
I find -2 contrast and -1 saturation to be very pleasing in the eye without any colour grading. However this is a very subjective thing.
Since you also do stills the 85 f1.8 is an excelent buy. Also a nice alternative to the Tokina is the Samyang 14 f2.8. It is a manual focus lens and not as wide as the Tokina but at that focal length AF doesn't help much anyway, 14mm is wide enough most of the times, it's very sharp according to reviews and it is much cheaper.
I also think that it is good to have a fast f2.8 standard zoom with build in stabilizer so I'd suggest that you get that Tamron 17-50 VC.
When I was shooting stills with my 20D I could shoot everything with my 17-55 f2.8 IS and 85 f1.8, for video you might need something longer sometimes but the best lens for this is the pricy 70-200L 2.8 IS.
Sigma has also anounced a new stabilized version of the 50-150 f2.8 which is probably going to be a nice alternative to the 70-200L Canon.

Steve Bleasdale · March 21st, 2011, 09:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Colin Rowe

Hi Steve.
Re class 10 cards.
Transcend 16GB SDHC Class 10 Memory Card: Amazon.co.uk: Computers & Accessories
7dayshop.com - Online Store

Colin your a bloody star...... i forgot about transend and concentrated on sandisk???? steve

Steve Bleasdale · March 21st, 2011, 09:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spiros Zaharakis

Steve, for picture style I suggest that you start with the default neutral setting and adjust contrast and saturation to your taste.
IMHO you will need to knock down contrast and saturation a bit even if you don't plan to colour grade in post.
I find -2 contrast and -1 saturation to be very pleasing in the eye without any colour grading. However this is a very subjective thing.
Since you also do stills the 85 f1.8 is an excelent buy. Also a nice alternative to the Tokina is the Samyang 14 f2.8. It is a manual focus lens and not as wide as the Tokina but at that focal length AF doesn't help much anyway, 14mm is wide enough most of the times, it's very sharp according to reviews and it is much cheaper.
I also think that it is good to have a fast f2.8 standard zoom with build in stabilizer so I'd suggest that you get that Tamron 17-50 VC.
When I was shooting stills with my 20D I could shoot everything with my 17-55 f2.8 IS and 85 f1.8, for video you might need something longer sometimes but the best lens for this is the pricy 70-200L 2.8 IS.
Sigma has also anounced a new stabilized version of the 50-150 f2.8 which is probably going to be a nice alternative to the 70-200L Canon.

Spiros you are a bloody star also mate thanks... steve

Jim Greene · March 21st, 2011, 10:11 AM

I don't think class 10 cards are needed. I shoot with the T2i using 32GB class 6 cards and never had a problem. We use eFilm & Transcend. Unless I'm mistaken, the 60D will output the exact same bitrate and file type as the T2i.

March 18th, 2011, 04:19 PM	#1
Steve Bleasdale Trustee Join Date: May 2010 Location: England liverpool Posts: 1,343	New 60d advise Hi folks New 60d arriving tommorow, cant wait, just a few questions anyone to help... as i understand i need for video footage sandisk class 10 or class 6 extreme, 8gb or better 16gb do i get 20mb or 30mb or does it not matter?? When i do my photography days and not video do i need the extreme and can i just get the cheaper class 4 or do i need 6?? I have a 50mm 1.8 + a 18-55 kit lens, a broken 17-55mm canon 2.8 but wasnt keen on it anyway? so i have lens in mind? help me choose bearing in mind i need both video and stills.. so tamron 17-50 2.8... sigma 30mm 1.4 prime..... 24mm 2.8 canon, cant afford the 1.4.... 28mm 1.8 canon... tokina 11-16mm 2.8.....help. steve

March 18th, 2011, 05:33 PM	#2
John Wiley Trustee Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Byron Bay, Australia Posts: 1,155	Re: New 60d advise Tokina 11-16 and Tamron 17-50 are two of the most highly recommended lenses for video with the Canon DSLR's. As for primes, have you considered checking out older Nikon and Pentax glass and using adaptors? No autofocus for stills but you'll save a ton of money.

March 18th, 2011, 05:50 PM	#3
Steve Bleasdale Trustee Join Date: May 2010 Location: England liverpool Posts: 1,343	Re: New 60d advise Hi John thanks for reply, yes i have looked into older glass but everytime in the description it either says dust on the glass and a little fungus and a little this and that so it has put me offfff. steve

March 19th, 2011, 05:05 PM	#4
Steve Bleasdale Trustee Join Date: May 2010 Location: England liverpool Posts: 1,343	Re: New 60d advice please Hi all just to add with the 60d, what do you guys in general use for picture quality, neutral or faithful? what other settings do you find best? obviously weddings my game!! Bruce has given me some great advice, would like to hear from others with their settings and workflow.. so shutter 1/50 pal, iso 100/400 if poss, fast primes going for 28mm 1.8. 85mm 1.8 and got 50mm 1.8, possibly 24mm 2.8 or tokina 11-16 , set my white balance? does anyone use auto wb? p mode, av mode, or full manual??? steve

March 19th, 2011, 07:37 PM	#5
Chris Westerstrom Major Player Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Gothenburg, Sweden Posts: 259	Re: New 60d advise hey steve, I'll bite I use the 7d ISO settings on 160, 320, 640 and double that there on out, if I have to go up to near 1600 I use NEAT video plugin to remove noise, although, most the time, I actually sort of like the noise for some of the work that needs a little nostalgia feel anyways I usually stick to the 180 degree rule with shutter speed, that is twice the frame rate, although I have no problem with lowering it to 40 or even 30 (i am in Europe so I almost always shoot in PAL) to get more light in, instead of opening up too much or increasing ISO, I find this works fine and adds a touch more motion blur which is a plus not a minus White balance, I start with a preset, then roll the color temperature to what I find is the best (not always the one that matches actual white most) For picture profile, I use neutral, have played around with some of the more radical flat settings but I find that neutral is best for minimal grading, especially since I have to hand over material to other editors for broadcast and when I edit myself, usually the turnaround time for the project is too short to do anything beside minor correction and some added contrast. I shoot with tamron 17-50 2.8, canon 70-200 2.8 and some vintage primes in 28, 30 and 50. It seems more and more that the 30 is the one that stays on my camera the most I might get a tokina 11-16 2.8 eventually. that is my personal kit, the production company I film for equips me with the 5d and a canon 24-70 which is way better than anything else on the 7d, especially when it comes to low light, but 90% of what I shoot is with the 7d anyways( a little frustrated as the t2i, 60d and 600d seem to all be of more value for their price)

March 20th, 2011, 03:03 AM	#6
Steve Bleasdale Trustee Join Date: May 2010 Location: England liverpool Posts: 1,343	Re: New 60d advise Thanks Chris i appreciatte your reply, first lens is the 28mm 1.8 then as the reviews just give the 28 the edge over the sigma 30mm, and to cover i will get the tamron zoom for stills. The 85mm maybe to give me something longer in the church as i cant afford the 70-22, I am not a lover of the flat look, my brides love colour tone! to them they just want good colours good footage nice and smooth, so would that be neutral with standard settings saturation default?? i will introduce the 60d and then see how it goes, still use my cams for now?? thanks again

March 20th, 2011, 05:03 AM	#7
Chris Westerstrom Major Player Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Gothenburg, Sweden Posts: 259	Re: New 60d advise interesting, what brand is the 28 1.8 that got better reviews? there is really hardly any noticeable difference IMO between the 28-30mm IMO, I was considering updating to the sigma 30 1.4, but if that 28 1.8 got better reviews, I might have to re-think! As for the longer lenses, IMO it does get harder to 'catch' footage with longer lenses on DSLR's than it is with a HD video cam like , thanks to short focus and so on. But some churches are pretty dark, so it could be a trade off. I've only shot a couple of wedding films, not really what I do, but do have some clients that sort of forced me to film relatives of theirs. If you have to record whole ceremonies, I'd probably stick with the Video camera and then get supporting footage with your DSLR that will be more attractive. As I said about picture settings, use neutral if you aren't looking to grade much. The flat settings that you can download are to give you more leeway when you grade, so you'll get more color and so on in post. This isn't something that there is any one answer too. Way better cinematographers then myself will probably shoot super flat, because they can grade. I shoot and for my own projects have my own settings that I like, that (I HOPE!!!) have my own look. Sometimes I leave my stuff to other editors or have a director or DOP over me, they often decide my settings. More often than not, my clients, editors, DOP seem to more and more just want the footage shot in neutral.

March 20th, 2011, 09:36 AM	#8
Steve Bleasdale Trustee Join Date: May 2010 Location: England liverpool Posts: 1,343	Re: New 60d advise Hi Chris It was on the rockwell photography site, he says the canon 28mm 1.8 is better build better focus system, overall similar picture quality, but looks the part also as its the same colour black as the 60d 550d 7d 600d. Also the 28mm is built to last and the sigma cheaper build? Will try various picture setinhgs!! What is your prefered settings work flow ie shutter, iso, apeture, focus, film, when you get to an event? steve

March 20th, 2011, 02:06 PM	#9
Spiros Zaharakis Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Chania Crete Greece Posts: 171	Re: New 60d advise Steve, congrats on your new 60D. It's a great camera. 1) You don't have to go with the expensive Sandisc cards, Transcend Class10 cards are the best VFM in the market.I would go with a couple 32GB cards. 2) Tokina 11-16 is a great lens, the Canon 28 f1.8 is fine but I really prefer the 30 f1.4 Sigma. I have to dissagree with Ken Rockwell's verdict (as do many other tests around). For a 50mm for video use, no way I would chose the Canon f1.8 with the inaccurate, flimsy,short travel focus ring. A used MF Olympus or Pentax Tacumar would be my first choice. Actually any old MF (except FD or MD mount) in good condition would be a better choice. The 85 f1.8 is a great lens but if you don't shoot stills then maybe the Samyang 85 f1.4 should also be on your list. 3) The Neutral picture style as is is fine if you don't colour grade, otherwise knock down the contrast at -3 or -4 and saturation at -1 or -2 if you do.Faithfull will give you redish skin tones (not my favorite)

March 21st, 2011, 04:45 AM	#10
Steve Bleasdale Trustee Join Date: May 2010 Location: England liverpool Posts: 1,343	Re: New 60d advise Hi Spiros thanks for your input!! Do you have a link for the class 10s as im struggling to buy them, they seem so expensive at the moment, would class 6 do as it says in the manual... Is the picture setting neutral default neutral? So key that in user define 1 and save it or just use default neutral? Lastly Spiros i do actually do stills also so im in a bit of a mind bending decisions, here are my choices!!! i have the 50mm plastic fantastic, and 18-55 kit lens, was thinking to buy tamron 17-50mm vc, or sigma 17-50mm, the 28mm 1.8 canon, or just go all primes 28mm, 50mm, 85mm, and zoom with feet!! or get at least one zoom mentioned as i think i am guna need that for stills!! or i could get tokina 11-16mm and the 30mm 1.4 sigma keep the kit lens and the 50mm 1.8 for lowish light!!! steve

March 21st, 2011, 05:29 AM	#11
Colin Rowe Major Player Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Cornwall UK Posts: 793	Re: New 60d advise Hi Steve. Re class 10 cards. Transcend 16GB SDHC Class 10 Memory Card: Amazon.co.uk: Computers & Accessories Transcend 16GB SDHC Class 10 Memory Card: Amazon.co.uk: Computers & Accessories http://www.7dayshop.com/catalog/prod...ucts_id=110291 __________________ Colin

March 21st, 2011, 09:17 AM	#12
Spiros Zaharakis Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Chania Crete Greece Posts: 171	Re: New 60d advise Steve, for picture style I suggest that you start with the default neutral setting and adjust contrast and saturation to your taste. IMHO you will need to knock down contrast and saturation a bit even if you don't plan to colour grade in post. I find -2 contrast and -1 saturation to be very pleasing in the eye without any colour grading. However this is a very subjective thing. Since you also do stills the 85 f1.8 is an excelent buy. Also a nice alternative to the Tokina is the Samyang 14 f2.8. It is a manual focus lens and not as wide as the Tokina but at that focal length AF doesn't help much anyway, 14mm is wide enough most of the times, it's very sharp according to reviews and it is much cheaper. I also think that it is good to have a fast f2.8 standard zoom with build in stabilizer so I'd suggest that you get that Tamron 17-50 VC. When I was shooting stills with my 20D I could shoot everything with my 17-55 f2.8 IS and 85 f1.8, for video you might need something longer sometimes but the best lens for this is the pricy 70-200L 2.8 IS. Sigma has also anounced a new stabilized version of the 50-150 f2.8 which is probably going to be a nice alternative to the 70-200L Canon.

March 21st, 2011, 10:11 AM	#15
Jim Greene Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Boston, MA Posts: 74	Re: New 60d advise I don't think class 10 cards are needed. I shoot with the T2i using 32GB class 6 cards and never had a problem. We use eFilm & Transcend. Unless I'm mistaken, the 60D will output the exact same bitrate and file type as the T2i.