60D aliasing at DVinfo.net

Khoi Pham · August 29th, 2010, 12:05 AM

Look at this video at 17 seconds with the water, I see no aliasing at all, also at the end of the video with tight patern on the window, with my 7D and T2i I'm sure with a scene like that it would have aliasing out the ying yang, could it be that they solve the problem?
YouTube - Canon EOS 60D sample video!

Andy Wilkinson · August 29th, 2010, 04:37 AM

I agree it looks VERY promising (but note that I think the brief water shots you mention start at about 26 seconds on). The seats on the boat (with narrow near horizontal slits in them) and the wires above the bridge shot look pretty good (might be a little aliasing on the latter - viewing the 1080p on my 15-inch MBP right now so that might be my end as this thing is not a Full HD screen)

I think we really need a 'brickwork or roof tile' type shot, or windows with lots of narrow Venitian blinds etc. in most of the frame to really know for sure - but here's hoping Canon really have found a game changing way to sample their big (stills) high res sensor for killer, non-aliasing 1080p video with the 60D (or if not, much better reduction of it when compared to the 5DMkII/7D/550D).

If this actually turns out to be true (when "pixel peeper types" get our hands on them), what with that articulating screen as a bonus, then this camera's going to sell like hot cakes (and my 7D/EX3 combo will be getting a little sister soon!)

Nigel Barker · August 29th, 2010, 05:55 AM

I think that this is all just wishful thinking. I don't believe that you can draw any conclusions from material on YouTube where the quality is so far removed from what the camera recorded.

Andy Wilkinson · August 29th, 2010, 06:36 AM

Yes, of course I agree/we all know that.... but for someone like me (where 90% of my corporate clients use web delivery) it would be a step forward if it's essentially "unnoticeable" to the average viewer.

5DMkII/7D/550D (and others) will all show VERY noticeable aliasing even once YouTube/Vimeo/ExposureRoom (insert web delivery service of your choice etc.) have "mangled their output" unless very careful shot selection and DOF techniques to defocus potentially troublesome scenes/backgrounds are used. So it could, and I stress could, be a promising step forward. Like I wrote, we'll only know when one of us (that this matters too) actually gets our hands on a 60D body! The quality versus cost is, already, something we dreamed of just 2-3 years ago ...and set to get better (if Canon don't do it, one of the others will soon). Just maybe they have "compromised" the stills capability in favour of improved HD Video??....or maybe it's just essentially a T2i/550D with a swivel screen??

We'll know soon I expect. Exciting times we live in!

EDIT: Just viewed the short 60D 720p and 1080p sample clips on the DPReview site. The 720p London Tower Bridge shot shows awful aliasing much like my 7D would deliver. The 1080p example is more difficult to judge but I'm pretty sure I'm seeing it on the guy's horizontal striped T shirt. Ah well, looks like we've just the guts of a 550D here in a better built body with a swivel out screen after all - but I'd LOVE to be proved wrong when one of you lot get one to test!

Jonanthan Carr · August 29th, 2010, 09:46 PM

its the same sensor from what I heard, so your have the same problems you do with the 7D. To properly test the camera you need to use an aliasing chart. I posted a video a while back with my 7D doing a Moire/Aliasing test, so with the 60D it should look about the same.

Tim Le · August 29th, 2010, 10:30 PM

It's also still Digic IV, so the video is unlikely to be much different (IMO). When Digic V comes around, that should hopefully mean 2nd generation EOS HD movie. Using history as a guide, Digic V should come out this fall...perhaps in the EOS-1DsMkIV if that thing ever shows up. But it could be that it won't arrive until the 5DMkIII arrives, which based on history "should" be sometime next year.

August 29th, 2010, 12:05 AM	#1
Khoi Pham Major Player Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Dallas Posts: 747	60D aliasing Look at this video at 17 seconds with the water, I see no aliasing at all, also at the end of the video with tight patern on the window, with my 7D and T2i I'm sure with a scene like that it would have aliasing out the ying yang, could it be that they solve the problem? YouTube - Canon EOS 60D sample video! __________________ Khoi Pham www.proeditproductions.com

August 29th, 2010, 04:37 AM	#2
Andy Wilkinson Inner Circle Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Cambridge UK Posts: 2,853	I agree it looks VERY promising (but note that I think the brief water shots you mention start at about 26 seconds on). The seats on the boat (with narrow near horizontal slits in them) and the wires above the bridge shot look pretty good (might be a little aliasing on the latter - viewing the 1080p on my 15-inch MBP right now so that might be my end as this thing is not a Full HD screen) I think we really need a 'brickwork or roof tile' type shot, or windows with lots of narrow Venitian blinds etc. in most of the frame to really know for sure - but here's hoping Canon really have found a game changing way to sample their big (stills) high res sensor for killer, non-aliasing 1080p video with the 60D (or if not, much better reduction of it when compared to the 5DMkII/7D/550D). If this actually turns out to be true (when "pixel peeper types" get our hands on them), what with that articulating screen as a bonus, then this camera's going to sell like hot cakes (and my 7D/EX3 combo will be getting a little sister soon!) __________________ Andy K Wilkinson - https://www.shootingimage.co.uk Cambridge (UK) Corporate Video Production

August 29th, 2010, 06:36 AM	#4
Andy Wilkinson Inner Circle Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Cambridge UK Posts: 2,853	Yes, of course I agree/we all know that.... but for someone like me (where 90% of my corporate clients use web delivery) it would be a step forward if it's essentially "unnoticeable" to the average viewer. 5DMkII/7D/550D (and others) will all show VERY noticeable aliasing even once YouTube/Vimeo/ExposureRoom (insert web delivery service of your choice etc.) have "mangled their output" unless very careful shot selection and DOF techniques to defocus potentially troublesome scenes/backgrounds are used. So it could, and I stress could, be a promising step forward. Like I wrote, we'll only know when one of us (that this matters too) actually gets our hands on a 60D body! The quality versus cost is, already, something we dreamed of just 2-3 years ago ...and set to get better (if Canon don't do it, one of the others will soon). Just maybe they have "compromised" the stills capability in favour of improved HD Video??....or maybe it's just essentially a T2i/550D with a swivel screen?? We'll know soon I expect. Exciting times we live in! EDIT: Just viewed the short 60D 720p and 1080p sample clips on the DPReview site. The 720p London Tower Bridge shot shows awful aliasing much like my 7D would deliver. The 1080p example is more difficult to judge but I'm pretty sure I'm seeing it on the guy's horizontal striped T shirt. Ah well, looks like we've just the guts of a 550D here in a better built body with a swivel out screen after all - but I'd LOVE to be proved wrong when one of you lot get one to test! __________________ Andy K Wilkinson - https://www.shootingimage.co.uk Cambridge (UK) Corporate Video Production Last edited by Andy Wilkinson; August 29th, 2010 at 07:48 AM.

August 29th, 2010, 09:46 PM	#5
Jonanthan Carr Regular Crew Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: United States Posts: 50	its the same sensor from what I heard, so your have the same problems you do with the 7D. To properly test the camera you need to use an aliasing chart. I posted a video a while back with my 7D doing a Moire/Aliasing test, so with the 60D it should look about the same. __________________ Dp Reel http://www.visualcinema.com/reels/ Rentals in NYC http://www.visualcinema.com/rentals/cameras/ Scarlet-X SN#634 "HEXTALL"

August 29th, 2010, 05:55 AM	#3
Nigel Barker Inner Circle Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Norwich, Norfolk, UK Posts: 3,531	I think that this is all just wishful thinking. I don't believe that you can draw any conclusions from material on YouTube where the quality is so far removed from what the camera recorded.

August 29th, 2010, 10:30 PM	#6
Tim Le Major Player Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Los Angeles, CA Posts: 350	It's also still Digic IV, so the video is unlikely to be much different (IMO). When Digic V comes around, that should hopefully mean 2nd generation EOS HD movie. Using history as a guide, Digic V should come out this fall...perhaps in the EOS-1DsMkIV if that thing ever shows up. But it could be that it won't arrive until the 5DMkIII arrives, which based on history "should" be sometime next year.