Recieved my 7D today! Wide-Angle lens advice (have 2 in mind)

Matt Gottshalk · January 2nd, 2010, 02:51 PM

The Tokina 11-16mm is the bees knees.

Tim Kay · January 2nd, 2010, 11:13 PM

Wow - thats an amazing photo

Andy Wilkinson · January 5th, 2010, 11:02 AM

Just to add to this thread.... as I've just bought a Canon 10-22mm wide angle for my 7D! Should have it in a few days assuming the delivery van can drive through the deep snow we've now got forecast! :-)

I read a ton of on-line reviews on what seems like every camera forum/site on Earth the last few days.... and it was not an easy choice but I thought I'd share why I went the direction I did. This might help others considering the Tokina 11-16mm versus Canon 10-22mm "dilemma", especially for the video-centric like us. Bear in mind I've not got the Canon lens yet - or handled the Tokina either. From what I've read, both are super lenses and which one is right for you depends on your own needs, but for me, in no particular order...

Tokina 11-16 Pros
(1) Constant F2.8 - no other super wide zoom lens for the 7D can match that!
(2) Sharp
(3) More solid build quality
(4) Bigger/wider focus ring

Tokina 11-16 Cons
(1) Very susceptible to lens flare - and I like to take lots of pictures with backlighting (often sun backlit) for effect, so this was an important issue for me. I've seen some flare issues/loss of shots with my otherwise excellent Canon 17-55 F2.8 IS AF USM EF-S and don't want any worse than what that gives for sure. This could be an issue with such a wide lens used for video where you're moving around (from what I've experienced with the 17-55, especially outside with a low sun).
(2) Very limited zoom range, really it's a prime with a very fine adjustment for framing! Sure, in video work I'm not going to do any zooming anyway (with the ergonomics of the 7D, except in post).
(3) In the UK at least, very, very similar in cost to the Canon (which I got with Hoya Pro filter and special Canon shade for £600, by the way). There seems to be a shortage of Tokina 11-16s at the moment... so those that have them...
(4) Very slightly slower/noisier AF - but it's super wide so I doubt this is really any issue - as very little won't be in focus/will need focus adjustment (and in video I only use AF before I hit record anyway). Or, if I want to throw away a second in edit and re-autofocus, whilst I'm still video recording, I just just press the AF On button on the back of the 7D (this works even during video recording). Mostly, I manual focus with video though for obvious reasons.
(5) Moderate, i.e. noticeable, chromatic aberration, possibly more than Canon from what I've read.

Canon 10-22 Pros
(1) Less barrel distortion - except perhaps at full wide, 10mm, but very consistent across the range for a wide angle. This is very important to me as I'm doing a lot of architectural/commercial design photography/videography on the wide end with my EX3 and that has quite noticeable barrel distortion (which has resulted in some shots being totally unusable in editing).
(2) More useful zoom range, meaning I won't have to take off/swap lenses so often, and a nice overlap with my next lens up.
(3) Little bit lighter in weight - minor point but I do like to keep my 7D kit as minimal in weight as possible as I walk a lot with it.
(4) I like the Canon "anytime manual" focus ring approach, where you can just give it a nudge if you don't like what AF gave you. With the Tokina you have to snap the focus ring into a different position to go full manual (much like on my EX3) - which may give a judder if you're hand holding whilst recording video and just want to tweak focus to catch a fleeting moment better.
(5) Closer minimum focus than the Tokina - allowing a bit more creative scope (and it goes a tad wider to 10mm too!). Note to self, better polish my shoes as they'll be in shot sometimes!!!

Canon 10-22 Cons
(1) Slower lens, F3.5 is as fast as it gets on the wide end and by the 20-22mm area it's F4.5, so really more an outdoor lens or I might need to light my subjects if indoor (which I often do anyway if it's paying work). Bit of a pain it's not constant aperture - for video when framing/setting up the shot. Anyway, I'm also planning to buy a super fast general lens very shortly for the 7D/indoor/low light work, so no worries.
(2) You have to buy the shade separately - come on Canon get real!
(3) That's another EF-S lens I've just bought - mind you I don't think the crop format is leaving our (or more importantly my) future anytime soon...

Like I wrote, both appear to be great lenses - but that's why I just spent £600 on the Canon offering (including the necessary extras).

Manus Sweeney · January 30th, 2010, 01:13 PM

nice one Andy..

Ive also been trailing through sites today with a view to getting a wide angle sometime soon.. It can get a bit confusing trying to weed out the pros and cons that are relevant for video guys.

Very good summary even if you haven't used either, I'm sure you made a good choice and from what I've read i have no doubt theyre both fantastic lenses.

Andy Wilkinson · January 31st, 2010, 11:31 AM

Thanks for the thanks! Had the Canon 10-22mm a few weeks now - thrilled with it - no regrets at all. Super lens!

However, if anyone does decide on the Toki, I've just read on other threads etc. that the Tokina 11-16 seem to have become available again - and then sold out almost as fast, at least at B&H in the States! Not sure about our side of the pond regarding availability but a few weeks ago they were very hard to find, at least at a sensible price.

Next purchase for me is going to be a Canon 70-200mm F4 IS AF USM. I have the F2.8 IS version on loan for a month at present from a 5DMkII owning mate - great lens but I've begun to see that it's just too blumming big, way too heavy and definitely unnecessarily expensive for my needs - so I'd rather buy the F4 version which I'll do before I have to hand this big baby back!

Jad Meouchy · January 31st, 2010, 06:21 PM

+1 to the Tokina 11-16, and Andy is spot on with his assessment of it

Joe Lawry · January 31st, 2010, 06:37 PM

Im currently debating between getting the Tokina 11-16 or the Canon 16-35..

Now of course they are a different focal range to each other, but as someone who plans on upgrading to a 5d2 when the firmware comes out.. is it a waste of money buying the tokina as it'll probably end up being too wide for a 5d2..

The tokina is half the price of the canon however.. tough decision.

Sylus Harrington · January 31st, 2010, 06:51 PM

I thought the Tokina only fits APC-C camera body. Does it even work with the 5d?

Joe Lawry · January 31st, 2010, 07:00 PM

Good point, completely forgot about that.

Tokina it is.

Can sell it with the 7D body if i do upgrade in the end anyway.

Ray Bell · January 31st, 2010, 09:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sylus Harrington

I thought the Tokina only fits APC-C camera body. Does it even work with the 5d?

some folks use the lens on the 5d with a TC... works fine...

Jason Mongue · January 31st, 2010, 11:23 PM

I'm pretty interested in the Tokina as well, but I just read this on the BHPhoto website: Only fits on the EOS Digital Rebel series or 50D, 40D, 30D & 20D SLR cameras

Do you need an adaptor to mount this lens on a 7d?

Ray Bell · February 1st, 2010, 05:21 AM

No adapter required for 7D... just order the Canon mount version... B&H just didn't list the
7D...

And if you need it to fit it on a 5D you use a TC for that camera body. Then the 5D has the
same reach as the 7D with that lens...

Richard D. George · February 1st, 2010, 10:26 PM

Go with the Canon EF-S 10-22, with 77mm filter threads. You will be thankful, for a number of reasons.

Tim Kay · February 2nd, 2010, 01:43 AM

Wow, had no idea so many others shared the same question and uncertainty regarding wide angels.

Thanks to a lot of feedback and research, I ended up getting the Tokina and while the feel is different, I have really enjoyed it. Only in still mode, I have noticed some distortion while at 11mm.

Heres the Tokina in action:

Joe Lawry · February 5th, 2010, 09:21 PM

My Tokina arrived. Love it. So theres another happy customer.

Anyone using it with a CP filter?

Ken Rockwell said in his review - "Avoid using a polarizer, because with lenses this wide you'll more likely get a dark band across your sky than a dark sky. This is because sky polarization differs as you look across the sky, and wide lenses see a huge swath of sky."

Tokina 11-16mm

Has anyone come across this? coming from a video background using a Polar on a wide lens has always been pretty standard for me.

So not sure whether or not to purchase one for the Tokina..

January 2nd, 2010, 11:13 PM	#17
Tim Kay Regular Crew Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: SF & LA Posts: 195	Wow - thats an amazing photo __________________ Event Production Services \| Video Production San Francisco

January 5th, 2010, 11:02 AM	#18
Andy Wilkinson Inner Circle Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Cambridge UK Posts: 2,853	Canon 10-22mm versus Tokina 11-66mm for 7D Just to add to this thread.... as I've just bought a Canon 10-22mm wide angle for my 7D! Should have it in a few days assuming the delivery van can drive through the deep snow we've now got forecast! :-) I read a ton of on-line reviews on what seems like every camera forum/site on Earth the last few days.... and it was not an easy choice but I thought I'd share why I went the direction I did. This might help others considering the Tokina 11-16mm versus Canon 10-22mm "dilemma", especially for the video-centric like us. Bear in mind I've not got the Canon lens yet - or handled the Tokina either. From what I've read, both are super lenses and which one is right for you depends on your own needs, but for me, in no particular order... Tokina 11-16 Pros (1) Constant F2.8 - no other super wide zoom lens for the 7D can match that! (2) Sharp (3) More solid build quality (4) Bigger/wider focus ring Tokina 11-16 Cons (1) Very susceptible to lens flare - and I like to take lots of pictures with backlighting (often sun backlit) for effect, so this was an important issue for me. I've seen some flare issues/loss of shots with my otherwise excellent Canon 17-55 F2.8 IS AF USM EF-S and don't want any worse than what that gives for sure. This could be an issue with such a wide lens used for video where you're moving around (from what I've experienced with the 17-55, especially outside with a low sun). (2) Very limited zoom range, really it's a prime with a very fine adjustment for framing! Sure, in video work I'm not going to do any zooming anyway (with the ergonomics of the 7D, except in post). (3) In the UK at least, very, very similar in cost to the Canon (which I got with Hoya Pro filter and special Canon shade for £600, by the way). There seems to be a shortage of Tokina 11-16s at the moment... so those that have them... (4) Very slightly slower/noisier AF - but it's super wide so I doubt this is really any issue - as very little won't be in focus/will need focus adjustment (and in video I only use AF before I hit record anyway). Or, if I want to throw away a second in edit and re-autofocus, whilst I'm still video recording, I just just press the AF On button on the back of the 7D (this works even during video recording). Mostly, I manual focus with video though for obvious reasons. (5) Moderate, i.e. noticeable, chromatic aberration, possibly more than Canon from what I've read. Canon 10-22 Pros (1) Less barrel distortion - except perhaps at full wide, 10mm, but very consistent across the range for a wide angle. This is very important to me as I'm doing a lot of architectural/commercial design photography/videography on the wide end with my EX3 and that has quite noticeable barrel distortion (which has resulted in some shots being totally unusable in editing). (2) More useful zoom range, meaning I won't have to take off/swap lenses so often, and a nice overlap with my next lens up. (3) Little bit lighter in weight - minor point but I do like to keep my 7D kit as minimal in weight as possible as I walk a lot with it. (4) I like the Canon "anytime manual" focus ring approach, where you can just give it a nudge if you don't like what AF gave you. With the Tokina you have to snap the focus ring into a different position to go full manual (much like on my EX3) - which may give a judder if you're hand holding whilst recording video and just want to tweak focus to catch a fleeting moment better. (5) Closer minimum focus than the Tokina - allowing a bit more creative scope (and it goes a tad wider to 10mm too!). Note to self, better polish my shoes as they'll be in shot sometimes!!! Canon 10-22 Cons (1) Slower lens, F3.5 is as fast as it gets on the wide end and by the 20-22mm area it's F4.5, so really more an outdoor lens or I might need to light my subjects if indoor (which I often do anyway if it's paying work). Bit of a pain it's not constant aperture - for video when framing/setting up the shot. Anyway, I'm also planning to buy a super fast general lens very shortly for the 7D/indoor/low light work, so no worries. (2) You have to buy the shade separately - come on Canon get real! (3) That's another EF-S lens I've just bought - mind you I don't think the crop format is leaving our (or more importantly my) future anytime soon... Like I wrote, both appear to be great lenses - but that's why I just spent £600 on the Canon offering (including the necessary extras). __________________ Andy K Wilkinson - https://www.shootingimage.co.uk Cambridge (UK) Corporate Video Production Last edited by Andy Wilkinson; January 5th, 2010 at 01:24 PM. Reason: adding info/typos

January 31st, 2010, 11:31 AM	#20
Andy Wilkinson Inner Circle Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Cambridge UK Posts: 2,853	Thanks for the thanks! Had the Canon 10-22mm a few weeks now - thrilled with it - no regrets at all. Super lens! However, if anyone does decide on the Toki, I've just read on other threads etc. that the Tokina 11-16 seem to have become available again - and then sold out almost as fast, at least at B&H in the States! Not sure about our side of the pond regarding availability but a few weeks ago they were very hard to find, at least at a sensible price. Next purchase for me is going to be a Canon 70-200mm F4 IS AF USM. I have the F2.8 IS version on loan for a month at present from a 5DMkII owning mate - great lens but I've begun to see that it's just too blumming big, way too heavy and definitely unnecessarily expensive for my needs - so I'd rather buy the F4 version which I'll do before I have to hand this big baby back! __________________ Andy K Wilkinson - https://www.shootingimage.co.uk Cambridge (UK) Corporate Video Production

January 31st, 2010, 06:21 PM	#21
Jad Meouchy Major Player Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 663	+1 to the Tokina 11-16, and Andy is spot on with his assessment of it __________________ software engineer

February 2nd, 2010, 01:43 AM	#29
Tim Kay Regular Crew Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: SF & LA Posts: 195	Wow, had no idea so many others shared the same question and uncertainty regarding wide angels. Thanks to a lot of feedback and research, I ended up getting the Tokina and while the feel is different, I have really enjoyed it. Only in still mode, I have noticed some distortion while at 11mm. Heres the Tokina in action: "Water" by Tim Kay 60p & 24p --- Slo Mo & Reg. on Vimeo __________________ Event Production Services \| Video Production San Francisco

January 2nd, 2010, 02:51 PM	#16
Matt Gottshalk Major Player Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Potomac Falls, VA Posts: 215	The Tokina 11-16mm is the bees knees.

January 30th, 2010, 01:13 PM	#19
Manus Sweeney Major Player Join Date: May 2009 Location: Amsterdam, NL Posts: 217	nice one Andy.. Ive also been trailing through sites today with a view to getting a wide angle sometime soon.. It can get a bit confusing trying to weed out the pros and cons that are relevant for video guys. Very good summary even if you haven't used either, I'm sure you made a good choice and from what I've read i have no doubt theyre both fantastic lenses.

January 31st, 2010, 06:37 PM	#22
Joe Lawry Major Player Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Auckland, New Zealand Posts: 418	Im currently debating between getting the Tokina 11-16 or the Canon 16-35.. Now of course they are a different focal range to each other, but as someone who plans on upgrading to a 5d2 when the firmware comes out.. is it a waste of money buying the tokina as it'll probably end up being too wide for a 5d2.. The tokina is half the price of the canon however.. tough decision.

January 31st, 2010, 06:51 PM	#23
Sylus Harrington Regular Crew Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Honolulu, HI Posts: 58	I thought the Tokina only fits APC-C camera body. Does it even work with the 5d?

January 31st, 2010, 07:00 PM	#24
Joe Lawry Major Player Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Auckland, New Zealand Posts: 418	Good point, completely forgot about that. Tokina it is. Can sell it with the 7D body if i do upgrade in the end anyway.

January 31st, 2010, 11:23 PM	#26
Jason Mongue Tourist Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Oakland CA Posts: 1	I'm pretty interested in the Tokina as well, but I just read this on the BHPhoto website: Only fits on the EOS Digital Rebel series or 50D, 40D, 30D & 20D SLR cameras Do you need an adaptor to mount this lens on a 7d?

February 1st, 2010, 05:21 AM	#27
Ray Bell Regular Crew Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 1,414	No adapter required for 7D... just order the Canon mount version... B&H just didn't list the 7D... And if you need it to fit it on a 5D you use a TC for that camera body. Then the 5D has the same reach as the 7D with that lens...

February 1st, 2010, 10:26 PM	#28
Richard D. George Major Player Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Denver, CO Posts: 351	Go with the Canon EF-S 10-22, with 77mm filter threads. You will be thankful, for a number of reasons.

February 5th, 2010, 09:21 PM	#30
Joe Lawry Major Player Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Auckland, New Zealand Posts: 418	My Tokina arrived. Love it. So theres another happy customer. Anyone using it with a CP filter? Ken Rockwell said in his review - "Avoid using a polarizer, because with lenses this wide you'll more likely get a dark band across your sky than a dark sky. This is because sky polarization differs as you look across the sky, and wide lenses see a huge swath of sky." Tokina 11-16mm Has anyone come across this? coming from a video background using a Polar on a wide lens has always been pretty standard for me. So not sure whether or not to purchase one for the Tokina..