7D workflow with MacBook Pro + Premiere CS4 at DVinfo.net

Matti Poutanen · October 23rd, 2009, 12:46 AM

Hi!

I´m about to purchase 7D and Macbook Pro (17" screen, intel 2.8Ghz, 4gigs ram, NVIDIA GeForce 9400M + 9600M GT with 512MB, 500gb 7200rpm disc). The question is the workflow with Adobe Premiere CS4: I do really like Premiere, and would like to use it with 7D footage also.

Does the Powerbook have enough juice to play and edit the 7D footage? Have people used Premiere CS4 with the footage out from 7D straight up, or did you have to convert to ProRes for example?

All input appreciated!

Thanks,

Matti Poutanen

Brian Parker · October 23rd, 2009, 10:28 AM

I have a dual core mac pro (2008) with 10gb of ram. And 7d footage still only plays back smoothly for about 3 secs before it starts to stutter on the premiere cs4 timeline. I just dont think it's an editing format.

The real pain is that there is currently no fullHD imtermediate editing solution for premiere users. I will make dvcPro HD proxy files in media encoder first and then edit with them. When I've finished the edit I'll replace the proxy files with the originals and do my final export.

That's what I'm thinking now. If cineform update neoHD within the next 6 weeks, then I'll be a very happy bunny and do all my editing and exporting with cineform files.

Christopher Lovenguth · October 23rd, 2009, 11:04 AM

I have a three year old macbook pro 17" 2.33Ghz Intel Duo, 4G ram.

What I do is make proxy files. I really like this option for cutting, yes it's low-res but you get unstuttering footage. There are more complicated (and most likely better) ways to do this with bringing files offline then online within Premiere. But for me I do it a real simple way: I have my original footage in a folder, I make proxies in Adobe Media Encoder (for me they are 640 h.264 but I bet you could make the resolution even higher on your system 940+) and put those in a separate folder under a single project folder (for example "project X" is my main folder then in that folder I have a folder called "originals" and another folder called "proxies"). You have to make sure that every file in each folder has the same name since Media Encoder will usually add a _1 to every file (so in originals folder 01.mov and in proxies folder it is also 01.mov and not 01_1.mov, etc). Next, start a project with 1080 output intention and import all my proxy clips and start cutting. You will see a huge mat around your clip obviously since the project is in 1080. Then when you get everything the way you want as far as editing, save close Premiere and then rename your "originals" folder to "proxies", make sure you rename your proxies folder first to something like "real proxies". Then open up Premiere again and the project will find all the orginal files, even if you make subclips, etc, and you have your fully edited project ready to go with 1080 files. I then render this and start my grading which I do in after effects.

*EDIT: I just noticed above Brian stating the same process. I would only add that obviously don't try to correct levels or grade, etc footage with the smaller files.

Matti Poutanen · October 23rd, 2009, 11:43 PM

Pretty clever! Christopher, how long the proxy converting process in Media Encoder takes on your system, can you give some kind of estimate? Let´s say if you had one hour of footage?

Brian Parker · October 24th, 2009, 06:28 AM

I'm currently doing it now and I've noticed that if you make dvcpro files, it writes them into the p2 multi folder format and gives all the files weird names. So that's unusable as a proxy format.

Now I'm making high quality mpeg 2 1080p 24fps proxy files. They have the same name, just a different file extension. They are also the same resolution, so editing will be easier. And mpeg2 is less computer intensive than h2.64 (7d files), so playback on the timeline should be quite reasonable. Having the same size resolution proxy files as the originals also has the advantage that if you do any moving or resizing of your clips on the timeline, then those positions will match perfectly when it comes time to replace the proxies with the originals. Working with different resolution proxies would bring headaches there.

And very subtly differently to Christopher, my way of doing the final "swap" from proxy files to the originals, is simply to move the folder with all the proxy files to the recylcle bin (or anywhere else is fine too), and then when I open the project Premiere will ask me where those files have gone, and I just point it to the folder with my original files. The names are all the same and so premiere will relink to all of those videos instead.

Brian Parker · October 24th, 2009, 06:29 AM

One last thing. The conversion time on my mac pro in media encoder is about 1:1. So an hours worth of files will take about an hour.

J.J. Kim · October 24th, 2009, 11:53 PM

this is such a eye-opening work flow for me.
I just test with .mov --> mpeg2 --> then replace with original file after editing.
My fear was that since the extension between those 2 files were different, Premiere Pro was going to reject the replacement saying something like "the file type is not same as original, so we can replace it!" or something like that.
I know encoding takes 1:1 time, but still a lot better than dealing stop-n-go playback on my timeline.
Thank you very much for sharing!

JJ

Gilles Guerraz · October 27th, 2009, 02:03 AM

Hi,

I got a newbie question : could somebody explain how you do proxy files with Adobe media Encoder ?
I usually create MPEG HD files (1080, 24 or 25P) from 7D .mov files, and edit them in PPro CS4.
My concern is about a potential loss of quality during the process.

What do you think ?

J.J. Kim · October 27th, 2009, 08:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by J.J. Kim

this is such a eye-opening work flow for me.
I just test with .mov --> mpeg2 --> then replace with original file after editing.
My fear was that since the extension between those 2 files were different, Premiere Pro was going to reject the replacement saying something like "the file type is not same as original, so we can replace it!" or something like that.
I know encoding takes 1:1 time, but still a lot better than dealing stop-n-go playback on my timeline.
Thank you very much for sharing!

JJ

It doesn't work on my studio computer... video preview is dead. Wonder what's going on.
Do you create MPEG2 file as well, Gilles?
What's the magic number for the bitrate, though?

JJ

Christopher Lovenguth · October 27th, 2009, 10:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Matti Poutanen

Pretty clever! Christopher, how long the proxy converting process in Media Encoder takes on your system, can you give some kind of estimate? Let´s say if you had one hour of footage?

I turn my "raw" 5D files in to: 640 × 426 h.264 and I think it's roughly 1:1 rendering

I've tried 940 H.264 but my macbook can't handle them as smoothly as 640. What I would recommend is that one tries to push the size as much as possible for their computer playability. I keep the files as h.264 30fps because I feel that keeps the integrity of the timeline when it comes to audio and syncing. That could be all in my head but I really believe I had issues when making my proxy files prores and sync issues when then working with the real files.

Gilles Guerraz · October 28th, 2009, 03:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by J.J. Kim

It doesn't work on my studio computer... video preview is dead. Wonder what's going on.
Do you create MPEG2 file as well, Gilles?
What's the magic number for the bitrate, though?

JJ

Hi JJ,

I create MPEG2 files with a comfortable bitrate of 15mb/s.
i did the same for a music video I shot in July with a Sony EX1. PProo CS4 was crashing repeatly when working on EX1 natives files.
It went way better with MPEG2 files, with no problem in color correction (quite heavy in Afrer Effects, with Magic Bullets looks, blurs, etc...)

Anyway, I'm still wondering if there's a better workflow that I'm missing.

I don't like it so much to waste time transcoding my video files before editing them...

October 23rd, 2009, 12:46 AM	#1
Matti Poutanen New Boot Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Joensuu FINLAND Posts: 10	7D workflow with MacBook Pro + Premiere CS4 Hi! I´m about to purchase 7D and Macbook Pro (17" screen, intel 2.8Ghz, 4gigs ram, NVIDIA GeForce 9400M + 9600M GT with 512MB, 500gb 7200rpm disc). The question is the workflow with Adobe Premiere CS4: I do really like Premiere, and would like to use it with 7D footage also. Does the Powerbook have enough juice to play and edit the 7D footage? Have people used Premiere CS4 with the footage out from 7D straight up, or did you have to convert to ProRes for example? All input appreciated! Thanks, Matti Poutanen

October 27th, 2009, 02:03 AM	#8
Gilles Guerraz Regular Crew Join Date: May 2004 Location: Paris, France Posts: 53	Hi, I got a newbie question : could somebody explain how you do proxy files with Adobe media Encoder ? I usually create MPEG HD files (1080, 24 or 25P) from 7D .mov files, and edit them in PPro CS4. My concern is about a potential loss of quality during the process. What do you think ? __________________ http://www.gillesguerraz.com/

October 23rd, 2009, 10:28 AM	#2
Brian Parker Major Player Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Tokyo Posts: 230	I have a dual core mac pro (2008) with 10gb of ram. And 7d footage still only plays back smoothly for about 3 secs before it starts to stutter on the premiere cs4 timeline. I just dont think it's an editing format. The real pain is that there is currently no fullHD imtermediate editing solution for premiere users. I will make dvcPro HD proxy files in media encoder first and then edit with them. When I've finished the edit I'll replace the proxy files with the originals and do my final export. That's what I'm thinking now. If cineform update neoHD within the next 6 weeks, then I'll be a very happy bunny and do all my editing and exporting with cineform files.

October 23rd, 2009, 11:04 AM	#3
Christopher Lovenguth Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Brooklyn, NY Posts: 85	I have a three year old macbook pro 17" 2.33Ghz Intel Duo, 4G ram. What I do is make proxy files. I really like this option for cutting, yes it's low-res but you get unstuttering footage. There are more complicated (and most likely better) ways to do this with bringing files offline then online within Premiere. But for me I do it a real simple way: I have my original footage in a folder, I make proxies in Adobe Media Encoder (for me they are 640 h.264 but I bet you could make the resolution even higher on your system 940+) and put those in a separate folder under a single project folder (for example "project X" is my main folder then in that folder I have a folder called "originals" and another folder called "proxies"). You have to make sure that every file in each folder has the same name since Media Encoder will usually add a _1 to every file (so in originals folder 01.mov and in proxies folder it is also 01.mov and not 01_1.mov, etc). Next, start a project with 1080 output intention and import all my proxy clips and start cutting. You will see a huge mat around your clip obviously since the project is in 1080. Then when you get everything the way you want as far as editing, save close Premiere and then rename your "originals" folder to "proxies", make sure you rename your proxies folder first to something like "real proxies". Then open up Premiere again and the project will find all the orginal files, even if you make subclips, etc, and you have your fully edited project ready to go with 1080 files. I then render this and start my grading which I do in after effects. *EDIT: I just noticed above Brian stating the same process. I would only add that obviously don't try to correct levels or grade, etc footage with the smaller files.

October 23rd, 2009, 11:43 PM	#4
Matti Poutanen New Boot Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Joensuu FINLAND Posts: 10	Pretty clever! Christopher, how long the proxy converting process in Media Encoder takes on your system, can you give some kind of estimate? Let´s say if you had one hour of footage?

October 24th, 2009, 06:28 AM	#5
Brian Parker Major Player Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Tokyo Posts: 230	I'm currently doing it now and I've noticed that if you make dvcpro files, it writes them into the p2 multi folder format and gives all the files weird names. So that's unusable as a proxy format. Now I'm making high quality mpeg 2 1080p 24fps proxy files. They have the same name, just a different file extension. They are also the same resolution, so editing will be easier. And mpeg2 is less computer intensive than h2.64 (7d files), so playback on the timeline should be quite reasonable. Having the same size resolution proxy files as the originals also has the advantage that if you do any moving or resizing of your clips on the timeline, then those positions will match perfectly when it comes time to replace the proxies with the originals. Working with different resolution proxies would bring headaches there. And very subtly differently to Christopher, my way of doing the final "swap" from proxy files to the originals, is simply to move the folder with all the proxy files to the recylcle bin (or anywhere else is fine too), and then when I open the project Premiere will ask me where those files have gone, and I just point it to the folder with my original files. The names are all the same and so premiere will relink to all of those videos instead.

October 24th, 2009, 06:29 AM	#6
Brian Parker Major Player Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Tokyo Posts: 230	One last thing. The conversion time on my mac pro in media encoder is about 1:1. So an hours worth of files will take about an hour.

October 24th, 2009, 11:53 PM	#7
J.J. Kim Major Player Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Wheeling, IL Posts: 270	this is such a eye-opening work flow for me. I just test with .mov --> mpeg2 --> then replace with original file after editing. My fear was that since the extension between those 2 files were different, Premiere Pro was going to reject the replacement saying something like "the file type is not same as original, so we can replace it!" or something like that. I know encoding takes 1:1 time, but still a lot better than dealing stop-n-go playback on my timeline. Thank you very much for sharing! JJ