Anyone planning to use EF-S Lenses? at DVinfo.net

Josh Dahlberg · December 24th, 2011, 05:58 AM

If one is not already heavily invested in L glass, is there any reason not to take advantage of some of the higher end EF-S lenses with the C300, vis-a-vis their more prestigious counterparts.

I'm thinking in particular of zooms at wide to medium focal lengths, the 10-22mm f/3.5-4.5 and 17-55mm f2.8 IS, both of which have decent reputations.

They're considerably smaller, lighter, and go wider than their respective L siblings, and in the case of the 17-55 offer IS which is unobtainable in FF glass in this range.

Tokina also makes some nice APC-C glass: I'm thinking in particular of the 11-16 2.8

I imagine there are a few others around like me, who could manage the budget for a C300 body but will have to go easy on glass (ie: the likes of EOS Cinema lenses are out of the equation). While I may have answered my own question, I'd love further input before unwittingly making a catastrophic error.

Happy Christmas!

Josh

Alister Chapman · December 24th, 2011, 07:04 AM

Another thing to consider is the use of Nikon fit lenses on the C300. Why? Because the canon electronic iris control works in small steps. Although the steps are small, they still step and this means iris changes mid shot are not good. Many (not all) Tokina, Zeiss, Sigma etc Nikon fit lenses will have a manual iris ring.

I think I'm going to invest in a nice Canon 24-70mm L series zoom as my GP lens and then use my existing Nikon fit lenses for other applications.

Josh Dahlberg · December 24th, 2011, 07:21 AM

Thanks Alister,

Curiously the 24-70 is the one L series lens I still own (left over from my days with the 5DII), but it's a case in point. I was considering selling it to fund a 17-55 IS.

Unless one prefers the longer focal length, isn't the 17-55 a better option for the C300? 24 isn't all that wide for the sensor size, and the 24-70 is heavier, costlier, and lacks IS. By all accounts the 17-55 is right up there with the Ls for image quality. Again, I may be answering my own question but I just wanted to double-check there's nothing inherently "wrong" with using APS-C size lenses on the C300.

On the iris steps (not sure if this has been noted on DVinfo), Phil Bloom mentions in his hands on with the C300 that the iris steps are much smaller than on conventional EOS cameras due to a feature called "fine iris"... he counted 2 to 3 additional clicks between the standard 1/3 stop increments (not perfectly smooth, but a nice step up):
A hands on look at the Canon C300 | Philip Bloom

Alister Chapman · December 24th, 2011, 08:25 AM

I believe there are 8 steps for each stop, but you can still see them when you shoot :-(

There is no reason why you can't or should not use EFS lenses. The L series lens though are of consistently high quality, have minimal breathing and are built to last. Many EFS lenses are not built to the same standards and may be less robust, have much more compressed focus scales making them very hard to manually focus. It's not great on the 24-70, but on the 18-55 it's about 3mm of travel from 3m to infinity!

Chris Medico · December 24th, 2011, 09:18 AM

One of the pluses to the L glass is the full time manual focus overide. You can't do that with most of the consumer lenses.

Thierry Humeau · December 24th, 2011, 09:36 AM

I think the EF-S 17-55mm f2.8 IS is a must have for handheld filming. The 24-70 or 24-105 are sadly not wide enough. I also think the EF-S 11-22mm or the Tokina 11-16 f2.8 is a must have for super wide. I don't like Tokina's sliding focus ring but other than that, it's a really nice and well built piece of glass. It's much faster than Canon's 11-22 too much zoom range is a bit short. I do like Canon's IS though, works really well for video even on tripod shots

Canon needs to ramp up its L series lens offerings for APS-C sensors. It would be great to see:

17-65 f2.8 IS
11-22 f2.8 IS
50-150mm f2.8 IS

Take care,

Thierry.

Don Miller · December 24th, 2011, 12:09 PM

The problem with not starting the kit with the 17-55 is that it may lead to buying an extra lens. The 24-70 or 24-105 is awkward on APS-C cameras.
I do like the extra reach of the 24-105 on the 5DII. There's no equivalent For the C300.
I said in another thread that my kit has evolved to f4 zooms and fast primes. It's kinda messed up on the C300.

Justin Molush · December 24th, 2011, 02:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thierry Humeau

Canon needs to ramp up its L series lens offerings for APS-C sensors.

I think Canon has made it clear that all L lenses will be full frame compatible with their offerings. While I agree with you I don't think it will happen unfortunately.

Syeed Ali · December 24th, 2011, 06:49 PM

I'll be using the canon 17-55 and the tokina 11-17 both of which I currently use with my 7d. I'll also be getting a cannon 70-200 IS as well.

Not sure what to get after that. I prefer using lens with aperture rings so may look at nikons.

Thierry Humeau · December 24th, 2011, 10:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Don Miller

The problem with not starting the kit with the 17-55 is that it may lead to buying an extra lens. The 24-70 or 24-105 is awkward on APS-C cameras.
I do like the extra reach of the 24-105 on the 5DII. There's no equivalent For the C300.
I said in another thread that my kit has evolved to f4 zooms and fast primes. It's kinda messed up on the C300.

Yeah and that is why the 1Dx will be an attractive alternative with its added video and audio capabilities.

T.

Justin Molush · December 24th, 2011, 11:19 PM

Im curious as to what Canon will add with whatever camera will inherit the 5D line or a 1DX cousin... Ever since I started covering live performances I have been craving timecode in DSLR footage. If I could get a bunch of DSLR handhelds running around the audience and auto synch it into a multicam sequence in premiere, my life would be a WHOLE lot easier in producing coverage of live performances than artificially cutting into audience reaction... Which I'm sure a few of you have done as well as I have... Id be thankful haha

I do like the direction they took with the 1DX to support the video feature, but I routinely hit limitations with the rolling shutter when the venue likes to include lasers and strobes. Here's to hoping the 1DX mkII includes a global shutter. Thank you Canon for taking the right direction, but here's to you taking an even better direction.

Nigel Barker · December 25th, 2011, 08:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Justin Molush

Im curious as to what Canon will add with whatever camera will inherit the 5D line or a 1DX cousin... Ever since I started covering live performances I have been craving timecode in DSLR footage. If I could get a bunch of DSLR handhelds running around the audience and auto synch it into a multicam sequence in premiere, my life would be a WHOLE lot easier in producing coverage of live performances than artificially cutting into audience reaction... Which I'm sure a few of you have done as well as I have... Id be thankful haha

Timecode might have been a 'nice to have' 2-3 years ago but nowadays PluralEyes makes synching multiple DSLRs so easy that it's not essential.

Andrew Dean · December 25th, 2011, 05:39 PM

I consider the 17-55 to be the single most important lens in my kit. I have several bits of L, but the 17-55 range with IS is a golden handheld solution. Anything else in that range without IS is a nightmare to handhold. Even tiny vibrations in the wind can cause jigglevision.

However, the 17-55 is not without issues. It isn't totally weather sealed, so it sucks dust inside the body over time. Its also not nearly as robust and the zoom isn't anywhere as smooth as L. (i LOVE the zoom on my 70-200 2.8l IS.

I haven't found another lens that works as well, but I would love a more robust version of the 17-55.

Actually, a "cinema" version of the 17-55 with gears on the zoom and focus and weather sealing would be pretty awesome.

So, for me, its not a matter of "settling on ef-s lenses" as much as "starting with the 17-55 2.8 and then buying L glass to fill out the zoom and prime needs."

Emmanuel Plakiotis · January 9th, 2012, 05:44 AM

Having filmed with the 17-55 2.8 and a 7D body under Iguazu falls, I can attest that lens is completely weather proof.
A word of caution to anybody who is planning to buy EF-S lenses for C300. According to Canon's site, C300 might not be entirely compatible with them (some might introduce vignetting) . So its better to wait until the camera arrives and is tested with the specific lenses.

Mark Dobson · January 9th, 2012, 06:56 AM

As Emmanuel Plakiotis points out there might be vignetting issues with EF-S lenses.

I haven't seen any reference to them having been tried out in the films that have been posted online so far.

Let's keep our fingers crossed.

The EF-S17-55 2.8 is a superb lens. I bought it for filming with my 7D and the IS works incredibly well. I actually bought a EF 16-35mm f/2.8 USM L II but got really lacklustre results so swapped it for the 17-55.

Must be something to do with the 7Ds smaller sensor.

December 24th, 2011, 05:58 AM	#1
Josh Dahlberg Major Player Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Wellington, New Zealand Posts: 513	Anyone planning to use EF-S Lenses? If one is not already heavily invested in L glass, is there any reason not to take advantage of some of the higher end EF-S lenses with the C300, vis-a-vis their more prestigious counterparts. I'm thinking in particular of zooms at wide to medium focal lengths, the 10-22mm f/3.5-4.5 and 17-55mm f2.8 IS, both of which have decent reputations. They're considerably smaller, lighter, and go wider than their respective L siblings, and in the case of the 17-55 offer IS which is unobtainable in FF glass in this range. Tokina also makes some nice APC-C glass: I'm thinking in particular of the 11-16 2.8 I imagine there are a few others around like me, who could manage the budget for a C300 body but will have to go easy on glass (ie: the likes of EOS Cinema lenses are out of the equation). While I may have answered my own question, I'd love further input before unwittingly making a catastrophic error. Happy Christmas! Josh

December 24th, 2011, 07:04 AM	#2
Alister Chapman Inner Circle Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Bracknell, Berkshire, UK Posts: 4,957	Re: Anyone planning to use EF-S Lenses? Another thing to consider is the use of Nikon fit lenses on the C300. Why? Because the canon electronic iris control works in small steps. Although the steps are small, they still step and this means iris changes mid shot are not good. Many (not all) Tokina, Zeiss, Sigma etc Nikon fit lenses will have a manual iris ring. I think I'm going to invest in a nice Canon 24-70mm L series zoom as my GP lens and then use my existing Nikon fit lenses for other applications. __________________ Alister Chapman, Film-Maker/Stormchaser http://www.xdcam-user.com/alisters-blog/ My XDCAM site and blog. http://www.hurricane-rig.com

December 24th, 2011, 07:21 AM	#3
Josh Dahlberg Major Player Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Wellington, New Zealand Posts: 513	Re: Anyone planning to use EF-S Lenses? Thanks Alister, Curiously the 24-70 is the one L series lens I still own (left over from my days with the 5DII), but it's a case in point. I was considering selling it to fund a 17-55 IS. Unless one prefers the longer focal length, isn't the 17-55 a better option for the C300? 24 isn't all that wide for the sensor size, and the 24-70 is heavier, costlier, and lacks IS. By all accounts the 17-55 is right up there with the Ls for image quality. Again, I may be answering my own question but I just wanted to double-check there's nothing inherently "wrong" with using APS-C size lenses on the C300. On the iris steps (not sure if this has been noted on DVinfo), Phil Bloom mentions in his hands on with the C300 that the iris steps are much smaller than on conventional EOS cameras due to a feature called "fine iris"... he counted 2 to 3 additional clicks between the standard 1/3 stop increments (not perfectly smooth, but a nice step up): A hands on look at the Canon C300 \| Philip Bloom

December 24th, 2011, 08:25 AM	#4
Alister Chapman Inner Circle Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Bracknell, Berkshire, UK Posts: 4,957	Re: Anyone planning to use EF-S Lenses? I believe there are 8 steps for each stop, but you can still see them when you shoot :-( There is no reason why you can't or should not use EFS lenses. The L series lens though are of consistently high quality, have minimal breathing and are built to last. Many EFS lenses are not built to the same standards and may be less robust, have much more compressed focus scales making them very hard to manually focus. It's not great on the 24-70, but on the 18-55 it's about 3mm of travel from 3m to infinity! __________________ Alister Chapman, Film-Maker/Stormchaser http://www.xdcam-user.com/alisters-blog/ My XDCAM site and blog. http://www.hurricane-rig.com

December 24th, 2011, 09:18 AM	#5
Chris Medico Inner Circle Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Efland NC, USA Posts: 2,322	Re: Anyone planning to use EF-S Lenses? One of the pluses to the L glass is the full time manual focus overide. You can't do that with most of the consumer lenses. __________________ http://www.LandYachtMedia.com

December 24th, 2011, 09:36 AM	#6
Thierry Humeau Telecam Films Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Washington DC Posts: 723	Re: Anyone planning to use EF-S Lenses? I think the EF-S 17-55mm f2.8 IS is a must have for handheld filming. The 24-70 or 24-105 are sadly not wide enough. I also think the EF-S 11-22mm or the Tokina 11-16 f2.8 is a must have for super wide. I don't like Tokina's sliding focus ring but other than that, it's a really nice and well built piece of glass. It's much faster than Canon's 11-22 too much zoom range is a bit short. I do like Canon's IS though, works really well for video even on tripod shots Canon needs to ramp up its L series lens offerings for APS-C sensors. It would be great to see: 17-65 f2.8 IS 11-22 f2.8 IS 50-150mm f2.8 IS Take care, Thierry. __________________ Thierry Humeau, DoP Télécam Films www.telecamfilms.com Last edited by Thierry Humeau; December 24th, 2011 at 10:43 AM.

December 24th, 2011, 12:09 PM	#7
Don Miller Major Player Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Chicago Posts: 706	Re: Anyone planning to use EF-S Lenses? The problem with not starting the kit with the 17-55 is that it may lead to buying an extra lens. The 24-70 or 24-105 is awkward on APS-C cameras. I do like the extra reach of the 24-105 on the 5DII. There's no equivalent For the C300. I said in another thread that my kit has evolved to f4 zooms and fast primes. It's kinda messed up on the C300.

December 24th, 2011, 06:49 PM	#9
Syeed Ali Regular Crew Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: London Posts: 161	Re: Anyone planning to use EF-S Lenses? I'll be using the canon 17-55 and the tokina 11-17 both of which I currently use with my 7d. I'll also be getting a cannon 70-200 IS as well. Not sure what to get after that. I prefer using lens with aperture rings so may look at nikons.

December 24th, 2011, 11:19 PM	#11
Justin Molush Major Player Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Montreal Posts: 388	Re: Anyone planning to use EF-S Lenses? Im curious as to what Canon will add with whatever camera will inherit the 5D line or a 1DX cousin... Ever since I started covering live performances I have been craving timecode in DSLR footage. If I could get a bunch of DSLR handhelds running around the audience and auto synch it into a multicam sequence in premiere, my life would be a WHOLE lot easier in producing coverage of live performances than artificially cutting into audience reaction... Which I'm sure a few of you have done as well as I have... Id be thankful haha I do like the direction they took with the 1DX to support the video feature, but I routinely hit limitations with the rolling shutter when the venue likes to include lasers and strobes. Here's to hoping the 1DX mkII includes a global shutter. Thank you Canon for taking the right direction, but here's to you taking an even better direction.

December 25th, 2011, 05:39 PM	#13
Andrew Dean Major Player Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Motukarara, New Zealand Posts: 475	Re: Anyone planning to use EF-S Lenses? I consider the 17-55 to be the single most important lens in my kit. I have several bits of L, but the 17-55 range with IS is a golden handheld solution. Anything else in that range without IS is a nightmare to handhold. Even tiny vibrations in the wind can cause jigglevision. However, the 17-55 is not without issues. It isn't totally weather sealed, so it sucks dust inside the body over time. Its also not nearly as robust and the zoom isn't anywhere as smooth as L. (i LOVE the zoom on my 70-200 2.8l IS. I haven't found another lens that works as well, but I would love a more robust version of the 17-55. Actually, a "cinema" version of the 17-55 with gears on the zoom and focus and weather sealing would be pretty awesome. So, for me, its not a matter of "settling on ef-s lenses" as much as "starting with the 17-55 2.8 and then buying L glass to fill out the zoom and prime needs."

January 9th, 2012, 05:44 AM	#14
Emmanuel Plakiotis Major Player Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Athens, Greece Posts: 344	Re: Anyone planning to use EF-S Lenses? Having filmed with the 17-55 2.8 and a 7D body under Iguazu falls, I can attest that lens is completely weather proof. A word of caution to anybody who is planning to buy EF-S lenses for C300. According to Canon's site, C300 might not be entirely compatible with them (some might introduce vignetting) . So its better to wait until the camera arrives and is tested with the specific lenses.

January 9th, 2012, 06:56 AM	#15
Mark Dobson Major Player Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Horsham / United Kingdom Posts: 328	Re: Anyone planning to use EF-S Lenses? As Emmanuel Plakiotis points out there might be vignetting issues with EF-S lenses. I haven't seen any reference to them having been tried out in the films that have been posted online so far. Let's keep our fingers crossed. The EF-S17-55 2.8 is a superb lens. I bought it for filming with my 7D and the IS works incredibly well. I actually bought a EF 16-35mm f/2.8 USM L II but got really lacklustre results so swapped it for the 17-55. Must be something to do with the 7Ds smaller sensor.