Blu-Ray authoring workflow (from EX1 footage)

[David Lorente]

Hello, boys and girls (though I haven't seen much of them in this forum).

I intend to create a thread to provide a reference for those who are completely lost (like me at this moment) on how to create a working Blu-Ray to deliver/show/archive our original or edited EX1 footage. Every suggestion, experiences, trials and tribulations will be welcome if they can help to teach others how to do it (and how NOT to do it, which is equally important!).

Of course, there will be several different workflows, and they will depend mainly of the NLE that everyone uses, though different combinations of NLEs and authoring softwares can be made.

[David Lorente]

To keep separate the title post from my own experience, I start a new one, so

Here are my current tribulations with FCS 6.

The FCS suite is (at this moment) unable to create Blu-Rays. The DVD Studio Pro can do HD-DVDs, but who wants to work on a dead format? So, until Apple delivers a DVD Studio Pro that makes Blu-Rays, we need an alternative software (and my BO$$ pocket's are not happy with that).

What I have discovered today is that the Compressor program can create Blu-Ray compatible files. Just send your finished FCP timeline to Compressor, by selecting File>Export>Using Compressor..., then create a new settings template suited for Blu-Ray, and there you go.

That's all I have discovered for now, so I have several M2V files, but I have nothing to transfer them to a Blu-Ray compatible disc.

Keep tuned for the results of my investigations (well, I'm no Sherlock Holmes, so don't expect very valuable things from me. And, if you haven't noticed it, I'm not an english teacher, so don't hesitate in correcting me if I have said some nonsense things)

[Steve Mullen]

Originally Posted by David Lorente

Just send your finished FCP timeline to Compressor, by selecting File>Export>Using Compressor..., then create a new settings template suited for Blu-Ray, and there you go.

... but I have nothing to transfer them to a Blu-Ray compatible disc.

For those not using laptops, you can buy a BD burner and use Toast to burn.

For those using laptops, you can burn AVCHD files to any red-laser disc. These discs will play in HD on most BD players. To create AVCHD files you can use Toast or, under Parallels or Bootcamp, Coral MovieFactory 6+.

Could you post your Compressor settings, please.

[David Lorente]

Sorry, Steve, but what I want is to make full working Blu-rays, with menu options and all the stuff I've making with DVDs. You know, it's hard to make a step back to linear video, like in the VHS era (gosh, I'm frightened just remembering the 240 lines of horizontal resolution, color bleeding, monophonic noisy sound, drop-outs... NOOOOO!!!! It was just a nightmare, we are on the 21st century now!)

My compressor settings. (Notice that I have Compressor in the spanish translated version, so I'm translating back to english the name of some of the settings, and I may not use the same exact words that you see on screen).

On the Settings window, create a new template. Then, in the Inspector, name it as you want, and choose the Encoder button (from the row of buttons just below the Description field).

Choose File format: MPEG-2, Use of Sequence: Blu-ray.

Below, on the Video format tab, choose HD 1920x1080, then adjust the frame rate and field dominance stuff to your project needs.

Then, on the Quality tab choose the MPEG mode (CBR, VBR 1 pass, VBR 2 pass...) and the average and maximum target speeds.

And that's all I know about this stuff.

[Steve Cahill]

Try this out for starters, and let us know how it goes..
http://blogs.adobe.com/davtechtable/...ore_blura.html

[Ulli Grunow]

Hi there,
Although I don't have yet a Blue ray burner in my old PC, I would like to know, whether by experience the latest version of CS3 Encore on Windows XP PC's will work smoothly.
Sonewhere, I read, that Encore works rather unreliable and the workflow was rather poor - but I may be completely wrong.

That's the intension:
Use NLE Premiere/After Effects in Production Studio Premium CS3, latest version
Export via Premiere (optional with Cineform) to appropriate HD format:

One Question: Should it be MPEG2 or H264 t for Blue ray ?!

Then import into Encore for the usual DVD authering. Any big differences to normal DVD authering, instead of the files being HD rather than SD ?!

Sorry I am not yet very experienced with Encore...
But considering my great new EX1 camera, I think I would like to burn much more Blue rays, than anything else... HD ready Flat screens are everywhere nowadays...

regards,
Ulli

[Dee Joslin]

Steve is right. The only way to go from FCP to Blu-Ray is via compressor and Encore. Encore is the only BR option that does full BR discs. I have not been able to get one to work with PS3 though.

I've used Vegas which burns a BR right from the timeline but without any menus. But these work on most any BR player including PS3.

And then there's Cyberlink and Roxio which I have yet to produce a working BR.

There may be other options as well but Compressor to Encore seems to work well.

[Steve Shovlar]

Its very easy. Encore is good and gives full menues just like DVDSP. They are very similar but Adobe has stolen a march by offering Blu-ray authoring.

I have had a problem with burning on a mac, so I have a PC and mac networked together and copy the finished Blue ray files over to the PC to burn the disk with the LG Blue ray burner (which has just dropped to £160 in the UK through SVP) Haven't had a single coaster. Full menues, and blue ray HD quality. All play perectly on my PS3.

[Barry J. Weckesser]

Originally Posted by David Lorente

Hello, boys and girls (though I haven't seen much of them in this forum).

I intend to create a thread to provide a reference for those who are completely lost (like me at this moment) on how to create a working Blu-Ray to deliver/show/archive our original or edited EX1 footage. Every suggestion, experiences, trials and tribulations will be welcome if they can help to teach others how to do it (and how NOT to do it, which is equally important!).

Of course, there will be several different workflows, and they will depend mainly of the NLE that everyone uses, though different combinations of NLEs and authoring softwares can be made.

I have been using 2 programs to author blu-ray discs - DVDit ProHD by sonic (roxio) that costs $300 and DVD Movie Factory 6 Plus with HD Power Pack from Ulead - cost is $ 100. I don't own an EX1 (yet) but using clips from Vortex Media EX1 sampler I produced working blu-rays from both programs (they play in all the computer programs that support blu-ray playback as well as the Sony PS3 and the standalone BDPS1). DVDit Pro HD requires you to transcode to .m2v(elementary) files and .mwa for audio but the Ulead program will accept transport stream (.m2t) from HDV cameras without transcoding. From what I understand, Encore is a step up from DVDit Pro HD.

I thought that the Ulead program (because of it's low cost) would be quite inferior to the other programs but if you like video backgrounds and video thumbnails (for chapters, etc.) you can be quite creative - the thumbnails can be rotated in any direction and in any shape (don't think the roxio program can do this).

[Tom Roper]

I'd like to put short blu-ray collaborations with menus onto single or dual layer dvds without re-encoding the native 35 mbps EX1 1920x1080 file, and that play on every blu-ray player.

Can't be done.

[Ray Bell]

Pretty easy...

EX footage, ingest with cineform to Premier CS3, edit, output
to DVDit HD onto blu ray...

[Tom Roper]

Originally Posted by Ray Bell

Pretty easy...

EX footage, ingest with cineform to Premier CS3, edit, output
to DVDit HD onto blu ray...

Are you responding to me or the topic in general?

[Ray Bell]

topic in general....

Not sure about your question... don't have an answer for it

[Steve Mullen]

Originally Posted by Barry J. Weckesser

I thought that the Ulead program (because of it's low cost) would be quite inferior to the other programs but if you like video backgrounds and video thumbnails (for chapters, etc.) you can be quite creative .

I've used MF6 to make red-laser HD DVD -- running under parallels -- and I too was surprised at how much one can to for $100. Mac users could buy REALLY cheap PC, install a BD burner, and use a network to move the files.

The other possibility -- is there a reason one couldn't buy a cheap first generation BD burner that uses an ATPI bus and mount it in a box that has a USB or FW to/from ATPI converter card. We could do this in the old days with DVD burners. This would work with any laptop.

I think the problem is that todays software may not control a drive over USB or FW. MF6 simply finds my Mac's DVD burner. I have no idea HOW it does this.

[Tom Roper]

Originally Posted by Steve Mullen

I've used MF6 to make red-laser HD DVD -- running under parallels -- and I too was surprised at how much one can to for $100. Mac users could buy REALLY cheap PC, install a BD burner, and use a network to move the files.

The other possibility -- is there a reason one couldn't buy a cheap first generation BD burner that uses an ATPI bus and mount it in a box that has a USB or FW to/from ATPI converter card. We could do this in the old days with DVD burners. This would work with any laptop.

I think the problem is that todays software may not control a drive over USB or FW. MF6 simply finds my Mac's DVD burner. I have no idea HOW it does this.

Lacie makes a USB external BD burner, FWIW. Blu-ray burners are still 2x-4x write speed as you know.

If you use the EX1 to shoot in 1440 HDV mode, with MF6+, Nero and TSRemuxer there is a kludge that lets you author BDMV onto red laser dvd media, with chapters, no menus, and no rendereing of the native HDV file. It plays on the PS3 and a few of the Sony standalones, but not much else.

You use MF6+ to author the BDMV folders, but then use the .m2ts file inside the stream folder as the source file for a TSRemuxer BDMV project. TSRemuxer then puts the .m2ts file inside an AVCHD wrapper, making it look like an AVCHD disk that auto-plays in the PS3 with chapters. The PS3 won't play AVCHD disks with menus however, (although some other players are said to be able to).

If you use MF6+ to just author an AVCHD project from the get go, it won't allow authoring to folders, so you have to target blu-ray media specifically. And you could do the same with a MF6+ BDMV project, (probably a better solution) with full menus and chapters, and good compatibility with BD players, but the target has to be BD media and the source file will get slow rendered. Roxio DVDit is pretty much the same story, except it authors onto red laser media if desired, but with a disclaimer that it won't play on the majority of players.

The problem with the EX1 (for me), is in getting that gorgeous 1920 native 35 mbps onto blu-ray without getting it rendered somewhere in the editing/authoring chain.