HD100/200/250 and Avid Liquid 7.1

Stephen L. Noe · April 29th, 2006, 07:02 AM

@S. Mullen & G. Barwood,

I recommend you pick up a copy of Liquid 7 and try it for youself with your HD-100's & BR50's.

take care...

BTW There is an event called "Liquid Immersion" that is happening in North Carolina later this year. This is a Liquid editor summit. I will be there to display how Liquid works with HDV as well. I invite you to come join the fun. Click Here

Guy Barwood · April 29th, 2006, 09:36 AM

Already have 7.1 thanks.

Stephen L. Noe · April 29th, 2006, 09:54 AM

Me too, and camera and deck....

Yusuf Thakur · April 29th, 2006, 11:08 AM

Have been editing now in 720P25 for over 3 months no crash, no hang ups, just work and I am talking long form (read 30 mins plus docus), will post a link soon to a 6 min film fully edited in Liquid 7.1 in 720P25 shot on the GYHD100, with mass dupes on CD which play via DiVX compatible DVD in HD as well as on compurters. Now thats a complete solution. Shoot HD edit HD and distribute HD.

Doug Harvey · April 29th, 2006, 02:45 PM

Hi Stephen:

I was just on the Avid - Liquid site and I was trying to find out what version of Liquid is version 7.1. They have Avid Liquid, Avid Liquid Pro, and Avid Liquid Chrome all refering to just version 7. Some of the features that you describe and show in the demonstration video are not available on the Avid Liquid version 7 that I have.

Thanks

Stephen L. Noe · April 29th, 2006, 03:07 PM

The interface is identicle between 7.0 and 7.1 so nothing should look unfamiliar to you (unless you're using the new bubblegum interface). The presets that I show, I created.

I'm displaying the "classic" FAST interface, not the new default interface. I keep fogetting that people who are new to Liquid are using the new interface and probably have never launced the 'classic' interface.

Steve Mullen · April 30th, 2006, 02:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stephen L. Noe

I recommend you pick up a copy of Liquid 7 and try it for youself with your HD-100's & BR50's.

I'm totally confused.

Avid claims Liquid does not capture 24p. Guy also says it does not.

Guy and Avid both say use a separate capture rountine.

You claim Liquid does 24p Capture and 24p Export-to-Tape.

Clearly someone is right and someone is wrong.

I'm not interested in wasting my time on downloading 7.0 when 7.1 is coming -- and still no answer to a simple 24p question.

So Stephen, HOW do you capture 24p and export 24p to HDV tape, from WITHIN Liquid 7.0 or 7.1 WITHOUT using any other software?

Guy Barwood · April 30th, 2006, 02:50 AM

I was basing my info on the knowledge that previous versions didn't support it and I couldn't remember seeing this as a feature of 7.1, however as I don't have a 24p camera it could slip by me.

7.1 is not 'publically' released yet, but I would think you could almost start holding your breath as you would have seen at NAB. Also not being released, things can still change.

You need not worry anyway Steve, I doubt I'll ever hear of you using Liquid either way.

John Mitchell · April 30th, 2006, 05:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve Mullen

I'm totally confused.

Avid claims Liquid does not capture 24p. Guy also says it does not.

Steve - no need to be confused, Stephen posted a link which demonstrates the live capture and record to tape of 24P within the Liquid interface (using JVC) as well as a 24P filmout. I know it's pretty dreary as far as tutorials go, but it answered all your questions. Just watch it.

Steve Mullen · April 30th, 2006, 05:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Guy Barwood

You need not worry anyway Steve, I doubt I'll ever hear of you using Liquid either way.

The new GUI looked good, far better than the FAST version for the Sony I reviewed years ago. And, the integrated DVD burner is great. Hopefully, Avid has revised the German-to-English manual that came with the first version.

Bizzare that the Avid guys claimed no 24p support when folks were beating on them to support 24p and 24F.

With 24p support, it would certainly be worth reviewing.

Looks like Avid has a three prong strategy: software MC at $5000, XP at $2000, and Liquid at $500-$1000. Oddly, Liquid 7 and MC may be the best choices of the three.

Guy Barwood · April 30th, 2006, 06:08 AM

Funny how we all like different things. I like the origonal (classic) interface but don't like the integrated DVD authoring and still author my DVDs in ReelDVD.

"Bizzare that the Avid guys claimed no 24p support when folks were beating on them to support 24p and 24F."
I can't deny that video does exactly what I thought 24p I/O was all about, clearly I was wrong and Liquid 7 does do 24p I/O. Maybe there is a native 24p (not encapsulated in a 60p stream as it is in HDV) that it doesn't do hence why they still don't claim 24p support, but that seems almost like they are being too harsh on themselves and should give themselves credit for the 24p ProHD support they have.

PS: They re-wrote the manual a few versions ago, it is far far better, though most people don't read manuals if iy can helped ;-)

Stephen L. Noe · April 30th, 2006, 07:20 AM

You guys should remember a couple of things.

First, There is no DV 24p support so DVX100 camera owners still can not use Liquid as a solution for 24p

Second, HDV 24p is captured at 60p and then the repeat flags are disregarded by the software. You are really capturing 60p and dumping back to tape 60p (with repeat flags back in place). Liquid 6.1 worked the same way except you had to import the files. Now with Liquid 7.1 you can capture and dump right back to tape as you would with regular DV with the added bonus of the ProHD workflow.

@John M. no extra charge for the "Dreary" ;-) "Seat of my Pants" productions are uncut. I did update the file after I downloaded a version of Camtasia that the audio plays smoothly and doesn't drop out in the middle.

John Mitchell · April 30th, 2006, 08:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stephen L. Noe

@John M. no extra charge for the "Dreary" ;-) "Seat of my Pants" productions are uncut. I did update the file after I downloaded a version of Camtasia that the audio plays smoothly and doesn't drop out in the middle.

Mate - I thought it was lifted from a professional tutorial. I find them all pretty heavy going. You know what it's like when you know the basics and you just want to get to the point of the exercise in a hurry. Brilliant that you put that together for our benefit.

I guess it more like a live demo as opposed to a scripted tutorial :)

Steve Mullen · April 30th, 2006, 09:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stephen L. Noe

There is no DV 24p support so DVX100 camera owners still can not use Liquid as a solution for 24p.

And probably not for 24F. But we don't care. :)

Don't take the "Dreary" to heart! It is far better to have seat-of-the-pants that none at all!

Please do more. Maybe I'll do some when EDIUS V4 arrives.

Guy Barwood · April 30th, 2006, 11:31 PM

While Camtasia is very good, everyone with a PC should be aware you can also do the same thing with the free Microsoft Windows Media Encoder as well. It probably doesn't have the same bells and whistles as Camtasia, but then again it is totally free as well.

Free little tutorials really rock.

Guy

If only life had an Undo.

April 29th, 2006, 11:08 AM	#19
Yusuf Thakur Regular Crew Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Dubai, UAE Posts: 68	It works Have 7.1 Have been editing now in 720P25 for over 3 months no crash, no hang ups, just work and I am talking long form (read 30 mins plus docus), will post a link soon to a 6 min film fully edited in Liquid 7.1 in 720P25 shot on the GYHD100, with mass dupes on CD which play via DiVX compatible DVD in HD as well as on compurters. Now thats a complete solution. Shoot HD edit HD and distribute HD.

April 30th, 2006, 07:20 AM	#27
Stephen L. Noe Trustee Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Chicago Posts: 1,214	You guys should remember a couple of things. First, There is no DV 24p support so DVX100 camera owners still can not use Liquid as a solution for 24p Second, HDV 24p is captured at 60p and then the repeat flags are disregarded by the software. You are really capturing 60p and dumping back to tape 60p (with repeat flags back in place). Liquid 6.1 worked the same way except you had to import the files. Now with Liquid 7.1 you can capture and dump right back to tape as you would with regular DV with the added bonus of the ProHD workflow. @John M. no extra charge for the "Dreary" ;-) "Seat of my Pants" productions are uncut. I did update the file after I downloaded a version of Camtasia that the audio plays smoothly and doesn't drop out in the middle. Last edited by Stephen L. Noe; April 30th, 2006 at 08:30 AM.

April 29th, 2006, 07:02 AM	#16
Stephen L. Noe Trustee Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Chicago Posts: 1,214	@S. Mullen & G. Barwood, I recommend you pick up a copy of Liquid 7 and try it for youself with your HD-100's & BR50's. take care... BTW There is an event called "Liquid Immersion" that is happening in North Carolina later this year. This is a Liquid editor summit. I will be there to display how Liquid works with HDV as well. I invite you to come join the fun. Click Here

April 29th, 2006, 09:36 AM	#17
Guy Barwood Major Player Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 423	Already have 7.1 thanks.

April 29th, 2006, 09:54 AM	#18
Stephen L. Noe Trustee Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Chicago Posts: 1,214	Me too, and camera and deck....

April 29th, 2006, 02:45 PM	#20
Doug Harvey New Boot Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Port Stanley, Canada Posts: 23	Hi Stephen: I was just on the Avid - Liquid site and I was trying to find out what version of Liquid is version 7.1. They have Avid Liquid, Avid Liquid Pro, and Avid Liquid Chrome all refering to just version 7. Some of the features that you describe and show in the demonstration video are not available on the Avid Liquid version 7 that I have. Thanks

April 29th, 2006, 03:07 PM	#21
Stephen L. Noe Trustee Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Chicago Posts: 1,214	The interface is identicle between 7.0 and 7.1 so nothing should look unfamiliar to you (unless you're using the new bubblegum interface). The presets that I show, I created. I'm displaying the "classic" FAST interface, not the new default interface. I keep fogetting that people who are new to Liquid are using the new interface and probably have never launced the 'classic' interface.

April 30th, 2006, 02:50 AM	#23
Guy Barwood Major Player Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 423	I was basing my info on the knowledge that previous versions didn't support it and I couldn't remember seeing this as a feature of 7.1, however as I don't have a 24p camera it could slip by me. 7.1 is not 'publically' released yet, but I would think you could almost start holding your breath as you would have seen at NAB. Also not being released, things can still change. You need not worry anyway Steve, I doubt I'll ever hear of you using Liquid either way.

April 30th, 2006, 06:08 AM	#26
Guy Barwood Major Player Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 423	Funny how we all like different things. I like the origonal (classic) interface but don't like the integrated DVD authoring and still author my DVDs in ReelDVD. "Bizzare that the Avid guys claimed no 24p support when folks were beating on them to support 24p and 24F." I can't deny that video does exactly what I thought 24p I/O was all about, clearly I was wrong and Liquid 7 does do 24p I/O. Maybe there is a native 24p (not encapsulated in a 60p stream as it is in HDV) that it doesn't do hence why they still don't claim 24p support, but that seems almost like they are being too harsh on themselves and should give themselves credit for the 24p ProHD support they have. PS: They re-wrote the manual a few versions ago, it is far far better, though most people don't read manuals if iy can helped ;-)

April 30th, 2006, 11:31 PM	#30
Guy Barwood Major Player Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 423	While Camtasia is very good, everyone with a PC should be aware you can also do the same thing with the free Microsoft Windows Media Encoder as well. It probably doesn't have the same bells and whistles as Camtasia, but then again it is totally free as well. Free little tutorials really rock. Guy If only life had an Undo.