New DIY HD Cinema Camera Project

[Igor Babic]

http://www.addonics.com/products/jupiter/jdcs.asp

There are cradels, docking stations, cables, CF to IDE or SATA, alot of removable stuff. Prices are good too. I think that this is realy good stuff.

[Jose A. Garcia]

What's the problem if we just use an internal sata disk?

[Igor Babic]

No hot swaping. You have to powerdown everytime your disk is full. There is data safe issue and system duration. You can use it for testing but for real life you have to be shure your footage is always ok and your disks are safe. Other than this Addonics stuff looks pro, you have your disks in ruged ruber suspended aluminum cartriges that you can connect to any other PC without cradle. You are building profesional recording system, wright? It has to look and feel pro. You don't want your disks laying around naked...

I have found this for I think LS-371
Power Consumption: 8 ~ 24V Full Range DC Input | ( 8V:3.75A – 30 Watts is the typical power consumption with an Intel Core 2 Duo T7600/2M/2.33 GHz processor, Kingston DDR2 533 1GB (HY5PS12821B) memory, Seagate ST340016A 40GB HDD, Behavior DVD ROM, LI SHIN 12V/6.67A power supply, and Windows XP Eng Operating System )
here is link
http://www.globalamericaninc.com/new...ec2.php?id=845

[Seth Kersey]

I believe the processor needs to be a socket 478... even though the board seems to come with a 479 socket (used with the Pentium M) but the two processors are electrically incompatible. The desktop Core Duos use the LGA775 socket, so they won't work.

[Jose A. Garcia]

Ok, so now we need to look for a decent priced core2duo mobile processor between 1,6Ghz and 2,0Ghz. That's about what we need to be sure we have more than enough.

[Seth Kersey]

If you want the Core2 Duo, then probably the T5500 or T6500. If Core Duo is OK, then something like the T2400. Go any faster and the price jumps dramatically.

http://www.pricewatch.com/cpu/

I would think we should avoid the Core Solo, especially if we could find an OS that handles multi-threading really well. What OS are you planning on using?

[Jose A. Garcia]

I've captured using core solo, so if whatever we choose is faster than that, we should have no problem.

I supose you'll think I'm crazy if I say I was planing on using Windows, but for now we just have windows software. I didn't think about that till now. It'd be great if we could build some kind of homemade iMac (i mean, exactly the same hardware appart from the mainboard) and install OSX. We have some very good Mac developers here (Take), and it'd be a plus to have quicktime files right out of the cam, ready for Shake and Final Cut. If not, then Linux.

BUT... We have to know if someone will be developing software. I mean, this is the point where the SI-2k people had to cut and start doing things on their own, cause nobody was in the mood for coding some open source tools.

[Jose A. Garcia]

By the way, Apple just made a faster MacMini. I know Take didn't think a mini was a good idea but I'd like to have a Mac compatible system. Does anyone know which mainboards does Apple use for their MacMinis? They have to be something similar to what we're thinking of with the 3.5"/5.25" boards, cause the MacMini is a bout 16x16cm in size. That's even smaller than a MiniITX board.

I really think we should go for a mac system. It'll give us speed and OSX handles core duo processors very well. We'd also make a difference with the other computer based 2k camera (SI) and as I said, we'd have full compatibility with Shake and Final Cut right out of the camera. We could also use Take's Quicktime codec.

[Take Vos]

A MacMini may be a good choice if you are willing to pry one open. The MacMini has an internal SATA disk, so you need to get this SATA connector outside the case, so you can hook up a fast external disk.

You could get the video inside the MacMini using the ethernet interface with a GigE camera.

Then try a simple debayer algorithm, as the GPU may not be really fast.

[Seth Kersey]

The MacMini could be using Nano-ITX (120mm x 120mm), but I don't know for sure.

http://www.whichsbc.com/picts/all_form_factors_lrg.gif

It uses the Intel GMA 950, the same graphics processor as the LS-371... correct?

Windows might work well enough if we can either highly optimize XP or use XP Embedded (which is compatible with all XP programs). It would definitely be the easiest OS to find software for, though most vendors now provide software for Linux as well.

I have not used Linux in quite a few years now, others may be able to better address which distro could handle the multi-threading for graphics the best.

Hmmm... I wonder if BeOS will run on that LS-371 :)

Just for fun, Mobile-ITX. Via says running a 2 GHz processor with the board is no problem. http://www.bit-tech.net/news/2007/06...start_of_pc2/1
http://www.pcworld.com/article/id,13...1/article.html

[Jose A. Garcia]

I forgot something. OSX doesn't have a tool to overclock the usb port. At least I think so. Take, you say GigE interface but that means we'd need to develop another board with GigE out instead of USB, and that means more problems.

Maybe we should stay with Windows. I have to find out if the overclocking tool works with XP Embedded. If it doesn't and we want to use the board as it is, we have to optimize XP. There're a few very good unattended already optimized windows distributions out there. We can try a few and see which one works better. In fact I'm using XP UE v6 right now.

Damn... Everytime I try to move to mac, we have more problems.

So, for now we stay with the LS-371 board and windows. We should have no problems with that combination.

Ok, now... Any windows developer? We already have C++ code samples. We just need to get them all togheter into a nice looking fullscreen tool (just like the SI-2k) with a few big buttons for the touchscreen lcd that can also handle post debayering and encoding via AviSynth or whatever method the programmer chooses.

[Seth Kersey]

As I understand it, the overclocking of the USB port is actually just replacing the usbport.sys file... or editing it with a hex editor...

http://www.warleagues.com/viewnews.asp?view=45&page=1

FYI, I also seem to remember reading of a problem with the Firewire speeds in XP after the SP2 update. I think it limits Firewire to 100 Mb/s, but there is a fix from Microsoft that alters the registry to fix the problem... or you can use custom device drivers.

All this should work with XP embedded, since it is basically just XP with the ability to select only certain items to install... thus reducing overhead.

If the Intel 950 graphic chip isn't enough, then we would need to resort to either using a Graphics Card (and bigger mobo) or something like this...

http://www.dailytech.com/article.aspx?newsid=5602

It requires an ExpressCard (PCIe bus) though, and the LS-371 uses a PCI bus.

Jose, what graphics chip is your laptop using? Do you think the Intel 950 would be enough?

[Take Vos]

Originally Posted by Jose A. Garcia

I forgot something. OSX doesn't have a tool to overclock the usb port. At least I think so. Take, you say GigE interface but that means we'd need to develop another board with GigE out instead of USB, and that means more problems.

Although there is not tool for setting the USB polling speed, it may be possible to create one. At what bit depth are you getting your data from the camera, only 8 bit?

There are quite a few camera heads available these days with GigE interface, which would allow 16 bit transfers at the same resolution and speed.

But I have a little bit more trust in firewire as it as a real-time transfer mode.

[Seth Kersey]

I don't know if this is any help...

http://www.pleora.com/products/iport_1kvb.php

I believe it is real-time... or at least "equivalent to a frame grabber".

The problem with Firewire and the LS-371 is that the LS-371 only has one expansion slot... and I am pretty sure you would need to use that for RAID. That means no Firewire.

I tried finding an equivalent 3.5" SBC that either included RAID or had more expansion options, but they all had disadvantages such as slower graphics processors.

[Take Vos]

Originally Posted by Seth Kersey

I don't know if this is any help...

http://www.pleora.com/products/iport_1kvb.php

I believe it is real-time... or at least "equivalent to a frame grabber".

The problem with Firewire and the LS-371 is that the LS-371 only has one expansion slot... and I am pretty sure you would need to use that for RAID. That means no Firewire.

I tried finding an equivalent 3.5" SBC that either included RAID or had more expansion options, but they all had disadvantages such as slower graphics processors.

You won't need raid if you have sata, not for 1920 x 850 x 12 @ 24fps.