very simple oscillating GG at DVinfo.net

Daniel Schaumberger · September 14th, 2006, 10:56 AM

hi guys,

here is my selfmade oscillating gg i want to share.
made from a piece of plastic and a pager vibrator.
The vibration is very good. The motor needs only 1.2 - 1.5 Volts.
Depending on the thickness of the plastic.

http://www.jetsetmodels.info/pics/selfmade1.jpg
http://www.jetsetmodels.info/pics/selfmade2.jpg

Daniel

Sorry for the misunderstanding. I only want to share information with others who do such DIY Projects. Thanks to Toenis Liivamaegi at www.cinedof.eu for the design.

Toenis Liivamaegi · September 14th, 2006, 11:36 AM

You`ll always know who was the first. And as creative commons licence requires, please let everyone know from where that design originates. Moderators?
And say hello to... Thomas, I quess.

That is too thin to allow only biaxial vibration btw.

Best regards,
T

I J Walton · September 14th, 2006, 12:13 PM

You are right, I too have also seen this design a few times before on other forums and websites. And it's the same as one my friend was working on last year.

But I also didn't know that it has been copyright registered? Has someone registered any other types of DIY projects here? like the spinning ground glass?

Toenis Liivamaegi · September 14th, 2006, 12:35 PM

Everything is quite free for non commercial usage when used with rights that can be free. It`s always free to DIY but another story when you sell it.
One thing is to have a commercial patent in Europe, US, Canada or Australia but when you don`t take a patent for Cina or India it will be manufactured there without a notice, sold via eBay back to US or EU still nothing.
I quess there will always be the competitive edge that will sort it out.
Even Redrock in Texas doesn`t sanction SGpro in UK not to mention P+S in Germany sanctioning all the others.

Hell, I cann`t make mayself Adidas Originals even if I got the equipment.

Cheers,
T

Daniel Schaumberger · September 14th, 2006, 12:43 PM

hi guys,

I dont want to sell this. Its for my personal use only. That should be free for everyone. I tried many designs but this one rocks.
I want to make a solid 35mm for my own projects.
Its not finished yet. But i will make a tutorial with pics and manymore how to build one. Like the spinning device from mediachance.

Daniel

Mike Oveson · September 14th, 2006, 02:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by I J Walton

But I also didn't know that it has been copyright registered? Has someone registered any other types of DIY projects here? like the spinning ground glass?

As far as I know, the original mini35 has the copyright on a spinning design. I'm not certain about that, but that is what I have heard in these forums.

Edit: removed my rant. I was in a bad mood yesterday.

Rene Hinojosa · September 14th, 2006, 02:33 PM

Dan,

Looks slick, didn't know you were running into patent issues there.

Can you post some footage with your GG on the camera?
Also, can you post your photos of how you setup your adaper?
Lastly, does your adapter need a pcx or achromat lens?

PS: Forgot to ask: what type of material did you use to cut out that design?
Thanks for sharing.

David Delaney · September 14th, 2006, 03:19 PM

I believe I have seen pictures for that design over 2 years ago, it isn't anything original, but it is a great way to make one

Daniel Schaumberger · September 14th, 2006, 08:40 PM

Hi Toenis,

now ive seen some patents from P+S. You can't sell it anyway because they patented all the motions for the GG (oscillating, wobbling, spinning...) not the design. The patent is made for US and EU.

My goal is to give back what ive learned here.
You have to read the whole forums to get some information. Ive made a huge research on getting all the info about these 35mm adapters. Soon i will post a tutorial about DIY oscillating wax gg, rail system, matte box...

Daniel

David Delaney · September 14th, 2006, 09:04 PM

Can't wait to see the tutorials Dan!

Bob Hart · September 14th, 2006, 09:44 PM

I like the work. I had some initial misgivings about stability on the focal plane but the thinner section across the flexing sections should take care of it. (Besides, very many helicopter rotor head control systems which operate on a similar principle without falling out of the sky can't be wrong).

(Also off-topic, the spiral method of supporting a centre hub to an outer rim is an old, once universally understood, engineering design which was an industry standard for casting pulley wheels and avoiding cracking.

Sadly, nowadays, this has been forgotten and radially spoked cast pulley wheels which look cool instead of antique, now have an in-built thermally induced stress load and tendency to crack failure).

To enhance stability across the focal plane I would use a stand-off mount for the motor and run the eccentric weight inside a clearance hole inside the panel, directly across the focal plane.

I might also be tempted to add two small pieces of ballast weight outside of the motor position on the same side as the motor to provide inertial leverage over the resistance to motion on the side opposite the motor.

This resistance otherwise may alter the motion in that area of the groundglass from orbital to closer to linear although the design provides positive mechanical linkages to resist this tendency.

This resistence however may, in combination with the existing off-plane mounting of the eccentric weight, tend to cause a a local movement off the focal plane in this area of the groundglass opposite the motor.

This inertial resistance is also a potential issue with the Letus design but is solved in that design by the overall excursion of the groundglass and the firm tie of the groundglass via the pillars to the focal plane.

Stephen Buck · September 14th, 2006, 10:26 PM

Yes, it's a good design but not a new design. I've also been working on a similar design for quite some time and may eventually offer it for sale in some form. My patent research shows that there is a fair bit of prior art in this area, going back a number of years. Two obvious areas with relevant patents are vibration reducing electric motor mounts (concentric leafsprings) and laboratory sample shakers (3 axis eccentric drive).

I definitely don't want to diminish the creative work done on this though -- top notch work! I think it's quite possible for us to freely exchange ideas in a community form AND reward entrepreneurs who wish to add some value to a community design in some creative way -- as long as it's not blatant exploitation of other's efforts. My background is software development and it's very commonplace for commercial products to make use of open-source libraries and components. It's all legal and generally encouraged.

Frank Hool · September 14th, 2006, 11:22 PM

No problems, Daniel, nobody can take Yours. Much ado about nothing. Can You describe manufacturing process of a vibra plate.
Also topic name is a bit confusing. We understand micro/mini/sgpro like here as oscillating.

Bob Hart · September 15th, 2006, 03:41 AM

The thing would really shine if it was possible to fasten a thin steel ring or round magnet to the outside of the GG area and position a bunch of small coils around the periphery and chase a pulse of current sequentially around each of the coils in turn to pull the GG in an orbital motion. - Just wires to burn out, no wearing parts, counterbalancing by virtue of magnetic pull in both directions.

Wouldn't want to take it near an aircraft though and the cam might require some shielding.

Daniel Schaumberger · September 15th, 2006, 06:20 AM

Manufacturing is quite simple because im using a little cnc machine with a 0.6mm mill from http://www.step-four.at (540 Pro)

For the material i use a 2mm Polystyrol (some plastic with higher elasticity).
You have to cut out carefully all things or it will break. If you want to build it maybe a dremel with 1mm mill will work.

Daniel

September 14th, 2006, 10:56 AM	#1
Daniel Schaumberger Regular Crew Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Atlantis Posts: 58	very simple oscillating GG hi guys, here is my selfmade oscillating gg i want to share. made from a piece of plastic and a pager vibrator. The vibration is very good. The motor needs only 1.2 - 1.5 Volts. Depending on the thickness of the plastic. http://www.jetsetmodels.info/pics/selfmade1.jpg http://www.jetsetmodels.info/pics/selfmade2.jpg Daniel Sorry for the misunderstanding. I only want to share information with others who do such DIY Projects. Thanks to Toenis Liivamaegi at www.cinedof.eu for the design. Last edited by Daniel Schaumberger; September 14th, 2006 at 01:14 PM.

September 14th, 2006, 12:43 PM	#5
Daniel Schaumberger Regular Crew Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Atlantis Posts: 58	gg hi guys, I dont want to sell this. Its for my personal use only. That should be free for everyone. I tried many designs but this one rocks. I want to make a solid 35mm for my own projects. Its not finished yet. But i will make a tutorial with pics and manymore how to build one. Like the spinning device from mediachance. Daniel

September 14th, 2006, 11:36 AM	#2
Toenis Liivamaegi Major Player Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Tartu, Estonia Posts: 579	You`ll always know who was the first. And as creative commons licence requires, please let everyone know from where that design originates. Moderators? And say hello to... Thomas, I quess. That is too thin to allow only biaxial vibration btw. Best regards, T

September 14th, 2006, 12:13 PM	#3
I J Walton Regular Crew Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 40	You are right, I too have also seen this design a few times before on other forums and websites. And it's the same as one my friend was working on last year. But I also didn't know that it has been copyright registered? Has someone registered any other types of DIY projects here? like the spinning ground glass?

September 14th, 2006, 12:35 PM	#4
Toenis Liivamaegi Major Player Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Tartu, Estonia Posts: 579	Everything is quite free for non commercial usage when used with rights that can be free. It`s always free to DIY but another story when you sell it. One thing is to have a commercial patent in Europe, US, Canada or Australia but when you don`t take a patent for Cina or India it will be manufactured there without a notice, sold via eBay back to US or EU still nothing. I quess there will always be the competitive edge that will sort it out. Even Redrock in Texas doesn`t sanction SGpro in UK not to mention P+S in Germany sanctioning all the others. Hell, I cann`t make mayself Adidas Originals even if I got the equipment. Cheers, T

September 14th, 2006, 02:33 PM	#7
Rene Hinojosa Regular Crew Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 37	Dan, Looks slick, didn't know you were running into patent issues there. Can you post some footage with your GG on the camera? Also, can you post your photos of how you setup your adaper? Lastly, does your adapter need a pcx or achromat lens? PS: Forgot to ask: what type of material did you use to cut out that design? Thanks for sharing.

September 14th, 2006, 03:19 PM	#8
David Delaney Trustee Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Niagara Ontario Canada Posts: 1,121	I believe I have seen pictures for that design over 2 years ago, it isn't anything original, but it is a great way to make one

September 14th, 2006, 08:40 PM	#9
Daniel Schaumberger Regular Crew Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Atlantis Posts: 58	Hi Toenis, now ive seen some patents from P+S. You can't sell it anyway because they patented all the motions for the GG (oscillating, wobbling, spinning...) not the design. The patent is made for US and EU. My goal is to give back what ive learned here. You have to read the whole forums to get some information. Ive made a huge research on getting all the info about these 35mm adapters. Soon i will post a tutorial about DIY oscillating wax gg, rail system, matte box... Daniel

September 14th, 2006, 09:04 PM	#10
David Delaney Trustee Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Niagara Ontario Canada Posts: 1,121	Can't wait to see the tutorials Dan!

September 14th, 2006, 09:44 PM	#11
Bob Hart Inner Circle Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: PERTH. W.A. AUSTRALIA. Posts: 4,477	I like the work. I had some initial misgivings about stability on the focal plane but the thinner section across the flexing sections should take care of it. (Besides, very many helicopter rotor head control systems which operate on a similar principle without falling out of the sky can't be wrong). (Also off-topic, the spiral method of supporting a centre hub to an outer rim is an old, once universally understood, engineering design which was an industry standard for casting pulley wheels and avoiding cracking. Sadly, nowadays, this has been forgotten and radially spoked cast pulley wheels which look cool instead of antique, now have an in-built thermally induced stress load and tendency to crack failure). To enhance stability across the focal plane I would use a stand-off mount for the motor and run the eccentric weight inside a clearance hole inside the panel, directly across the focal plane. I might also be tempted to add two small pieces of ballast weight outside of the motor position on the same side as the motor to provide inertial leverage over the resistance to motion on the side opposite the motor. This resistance otherwise may alter the motion in that area of the groundglass from orbital to closer to linear although the design provides positive mechanical linkages to resist this tendency. This resistence however may, in combination with the existing off-plane mounting of the eccentric weight, tend to cause a a local movement off the focal plane in this area of the groundglass opposite the motor. This inertial resistance is also a potential issue with the Letus design but is solved in that design by the overall excursion of the groundglass and the firm tie of the groundglass via the pillars to the focal plane.

September 14th, 2006, 10:26 PM	#12
Stephen Buck New Boot Join Date: Dec 2003 Posts: 7	Yes, it's a good design but not a new design. I've also been working on a similar design for quite some time and may eventually offer it for sale in some form. My patent research shows that there is a fair bit of prior art in this area, going back a number of years. Two obvious areas with relevant patents are vibration reducing electric motor mounts (concentric leafsprings) and laboratory sample shakers (3 axis eccentric drive). I definitely don't want to diminish the creative work done on this though -- top notch work! I think it's quite possible for us to freely exchange ideas in a community form AND reward entrepreneurs who wish to add some value to a community design in some creative way -- as long as it's not blatant exploitation of other's efforts. My background is software development and it's very commonplace for commercial products to make use of open-source libraries and components. It's all legal and generally encouraged.

September 14th, 2006, 11:22 PM	#13
Frank Hool Major Player Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Barca Spain Posts: 384	No problems, Daniel, nobody can take Yours. Much ado about nothing. Can You describe manufacturing process of a vibra plate. Also topic name is a bit confusing. We understand micro/mini/sgpro like here as oscillating.

September 15th, 2006, 03:41 AM	#14
Bob Hart Inner Circle Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: PERTH. W.A. AUSTRALIA. Posts: 4,477	The thing would really shine if it was possible to fasten a thin steel ring or round magnet to the outside of the GG area and position a bunch of small coils around the periphery and chase a pulse of current sequentially around each of the coils in turn to pull the GG in an orbital motion. - Just wires to burn out, no wearing parts, counterbalancing by virtue of magnetic pull in both directions. Wouldn't want to take it near an aircraft though and the cam might require some shielding.

September 15th, 2006, 06:20 AM	#15
Daniel Schaumberger Regular Crew Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Atlantis Posts: 58	Manufacturing is quite simple because im using a little cnc machine with a 0.6mm mill from http://www.step-four.at (540 Pro) For the material i use a 2mm Polystyrol (some plastic with higher elasticity). You have to cut out carefully all things or it will break. If you want to build it maybe a dremel with 1mm mill will work. Daniel