SGpro Revision 2/FX1 footage at DVinfo.net

Wayne Kinney · September 11th, 2006, 12:22 PM

Hello guys,

We had the pleasure of having a loan of the FX1 last week, so we decided this was a great opportunity to test drive it with the new SGpro Revision 2. Revision 2 of the SGpro proves to be much better suited to the HD format, utilizing a new high quality, fully anti reflection coated achromat thats actually custom designed and made for the purpose, new condenser lens and new GG. Here is an image of the SGpro r2 connected to the FX1:

http://www.sgpro.co.uk/SGpro_r2_FX1.jpg

First thing we did was to shoot a res chart. This was with a 50mm F1.4 lens set to F4, and the FX1 set to F2 (warning its a 6MB file).

http://www.sgpro.co.uk/FX1e_SGpro_r2_res%20chart.tif

We went out and shot some footage with the setup. There are 4 scenes, but i've only uploaded the first. Its a scene in a bar, all natural light.

Its a 40MB file in wmv format:

http://www.sgpro.co.uk/SGpror2_FX1e_pub.wmv

and a full res grab from the above footage:

http://www.sgpro.co.uk/face03.jpg

Also, for all you bokeh fans, here is a small clip from the other scenes:

http://www.sgpro.co.uk/SGpror2_FX1e_bokeh.wmv

I will be rendering and uploading the other 3 scenes tonight, and will post ASAP. The 3 other scenes are all exterior.

I would love to know your opinions on the footage.

----------
*EDIT*
----------
OK, i've uploaded 1 of 3 of the exterior footage. This was shot with the following lenses:

Canon FD:
24mm F2
28mm F1.8
50mm F1.4
85mm F1.8

The file is 60MB:

http://www.sgpro.co.uk/SGpror2_FX1e_brighton_marina.wmv

And some full frame grabs from the footage above:

http://www.sgpro.co.uk/flowers.jpg

http://www.sgpro.co.uk/flag.jpg

http://www.sgpro.co.uk/appartments.jpg

All of the footage was shot in Cineframe25 mode.

Theodoros Chliapas · September 11th, 2006, 01:14 PM

It's shaaarp!

Wayne, as far as i can see the improvement from the previous model is VERY BIG!

It's sharp. It's very sharp! Actually is one of the sharpest footages with a 35mm adapter i've seen. Even at wide open aperture on the lens, it seems that the sharpness don't care :)

To be honest, i can't find something bad in that footage. I think that my upcoming hvx will need this great thing!!

Great work Wayne!!

Jim Lafferty · September 11th, 2006, 01:20 PM

Looks damn good. I only wish you'd had the lens stopped down a little when shooting the guy in the Pub -- clearly you could've done it given the f/4.0 segment. For shooting a person, f/1.4 is IMO too soft.

But, it all looks damn good, like I said :) Congrats!

Wayne Kinney · September 11th, 2006, 02:28 PM

Thanks guys,

Jim: Yes you're right. Being a maker and not a shooter, im not up to scratch with pulling focus. But from my time last week shooting, i've learnt the importance of not shooting wide open. Firstly, no lens is at its sharpest wide open anyway, but also the bokeh is very mushy fully wide. I think closing down the aperture gives a much more pleasing image. As you say, I should have shot the guys face (my father) @F2.8 or higher.

I am happy with the new GG though. The light loss is very low indeed, and the amount of diffussion/bokeh seems nice. There is no flickering with the new GG even at 1/2000th shutter speed. Its professionally made for me, both the disk cut and finished. The revision 1 disks were hand finished by myself.

Thomas Richter · September 11th, 2006, 03:05 PM

Awesome. I had laid an eye on your adaptor for a while now but I am happy that I waited.

This is absolutely awesome. I am now seriously considering to stop my experiments with other gear (the Canon ee-s is good, but I can't get an achromat setup to work ;-).

Please take this as a compliment to your excellent work.

Are we still at 450 quid? I fear not.

Wayne Kinney · September 11th, 2006, 03:25 PM

Thanks for the kind words.

Yes the r1 was £400 and the r2 is £450.

Thomas Richter · September 11th, 2006, 03:26 PM

Holey shamoley.

I'll start saving instantaneously.

I wish I hadn't booked that stupid stupid holiday ...

David Delaney · September 11th, 2006, 03:41 PM

Wayne,

Looks great. I think that is some fine footage. I am surprised you didn't stop down on the lens though and shot it all at 1.4...

Wayne Kinney · September 11th, 2006, 03:43 PM

Thanks David.

It was not all shot @F1.4. The video show what the aperture setting was in each shot, some @F4. One shot you see me stopping down from wide to F4.

Kyle Edwards · September 11th, 2006, 07:34 PM

That footage looks great, really sharp. Did you try any other lenses with the FX1 setup (besides the 50mm & 85mm)?

Dennis Wood · September 11th, 2006, 09:32 PM

Nice bokeh! It's pretty bad when you start noticing the number of aperture blades on spec highlights during a focus rack:-) F4 on that 85mm is not bad to get some decent aperture discs showing up. I've found that full open (as many like to use them) does not look good at all.

Bob Hart · September 11th, 2006, 09:57 PM

"I've found that full open (as many like to use them) does not look good at all."-----------------

A local industry professional expresses a preference not to have the SLR lenses fully open, but to be able to use the range f4 to f8.

This enables focus to hold for dynamic situations where a wide-open lens would be almost impossible to control for focus, eg., tracking ahead of a person walking fast, periodically stopping and describing things, yet allow some softness of background.

Dennis Wood · September 11th, 2006, 10:06 PM

Bob, I've been chasing my 3 year old around all week with an adapter and stabilizer. Shallow DOF is useless in that situation :-)

As I'm sure you've already found out, the sharpest images come with a mix of both 35mm lens and video cam aperture...generally from f2.8 to f4 or so. Wayne's got it right shooting at f4.

Wayne Kinney · September 12th, 2006, 03:28 AM

Thanks for your comments.

Kyle: Yes I have 3 more clips to post today, shot with:

24mm F2
28mm F1.8
50mm F1.4
85mm F1.8

All exterior shots. Just need to finish the lens info then upload.

Dennis: Yes i'm very happy with the way the GG renders the highlights and bokeh. As we all know it’s tough to get good bokeh and low lightloss. I think I’ve hit the compromise just right. That’s why I love your 'swappable diffuser' option on the Brevis.

Bob Hart · September 12th, 2006, 05:52 AM

Dennis and Wayne.

If you have a spare copy of the fine groundglass, try melting parrafin wax onto the groundglass face, fine pieces shaved off with a fine grater onto the GG, slowly cooked up in bottom of a frypan until it melts and spreads, no hotter, let it set and cool, then boil it off in a pot of water and dishwash detergent, then cleaned with Preen the great unstainer, then rinsed off in warm water with hands only, rubbed on with raw detergent, then rinsed off again with hands again, not cloth or tissue and then allowed to dry on its own.

I'm getting a freak result with a AO5 GG which I think may have a fine residue of wax in the very bottom of the pits and valleys but the ridges and peaks are clean.

I can close this thing down to f16 and there is no flicker, but moving smooth objects get grain, fixed objects do not - very confusing. I am using a CD-R sized glass spinning disk at about 1500rpm.

At f16, with camcorder settings adjusted for correct exposure, a very slight improvement in contrast and colour seems to happen. However, high contrast edges like street poles against bright blue sky gain quite a thick lighter coloured outline.

Conditions, camcorder and adaptor settings:-

1-30pm, clear bright sky, sun at 60 degrees to one side shining towards but mainly across image plane.

Adaptor.

AO5 disk glass CD-R sized @ 1500 rpm.

SLR lens.

Nikon f1.8 85mm set at f16.

Camcorder.

Sony FX1.
7+ Century Optics acromatic dioptre.
2 x rigth-angle prisms.
Zoom at about 45mm for 28mm wide 16:9 frame off GG.
Shutter 1/50th sec.
ND off.
AE slow auto.
Gain setting 0db.
Aperture manual for best image.

September 11th, 2006, 12:22 PM	#1
Wayne Kinney Major Player Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Brighton, East Sussex, UK Posts: 938	SGpro Revision 2/FX1 footage Hello guys, We had the pleasure of having a loan of the FX1 last week, so we decided this was a great opportunity to test drive it with the new SGpro Revision 2. Revision 2 of the SGpro proves to be much better suited to the HD format, utilizing a new high quality, fully anti reflection coated achromat thats actually custom designed and made for the purpose, new condenser lens and new GG. Here is an image of the SGpro r2 connected to the FX1: http://www.sgpro.co.uk/SGpro_r2_FX1.jpg First thing we did was to shoot a res chart. This was with a 50mm F1.4 lens set to F4, and the FX1 set to F2 (warning its a 6MB file). http://www.sgpro.co.uk/FX1e_SGpro_r2_res%20chart.tif We went out and shot some footage with the setup. There are 4 scenes, but i've only uploaded the first. Its a scene in a bar, all natural light. Its a 40MB file in wmv format: http://www.sgpro.co.uk/SGpror2_FX1e_pub.wmv and a full res grab from the above footage: http://www.sgpro.co.uk/face03.jpg Also, for all you bokeh fans, here is a small clip from the other scenes: http://www.sgpro.co.uk/SGpror2_FX1e_bokeh.wmv I will be rendering and uploading the other 3 scenes tonight, and will post ASAP. The 3 other scenes are all exterior. I would love to know your opinions on the footage. ---------- EDIT ---------- OK, i've uploaded 1 of 3 of the exterior footage. This was shot with the following lenses: Canon FD: 24mm F2 28mm F1.8 50mm F1.4 85mm F1.8 The file is 60MB: http://www.sgpro.co.uk/SGpror2_FX1e_brighton_marina.wmv And some full frame grabs from the footage above: http://www.sgpro.co.uk/flowers.jpg http://www.sgpro.co.uk/flag.jpg http://www.sgpro.co.uk/appartments.jpg All of the footage was shot in Cineframe25 mode. __________________ Thanks, Wayne. Last edited by Wayne Kinney; September 12th, 2006 at 07:22 AM.

September 11th, 2006, 01:20 PM	#3
Jim Lafferty Major Player Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Brooklyn, NY Posts: 636	Looks damn good. I only wish you'd had the lens stopped down a little when shooting the guy in the Pub -- clearly you could've done it given the f/4.0 segment. For shooting a person, f/1.4 is IMO too soft. But, it all looks damn good, like I said :) Congrats! __________________ Realism, anyway, is never exactly the same as reality, and in the cinema it is of necessity faked. -- J-L G

September 11th, 2006, 02:28 PM	#4
Wayne Kinney Major Player Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Brighton, East Sussex, UK Posts: 938	Thanks guys, Jim: Yes you're right. Being a maker and not a shooter, im not up to scratch with pulling focus. But from my time last week shooting, i've learnt the importance of not shooting wide open. Firstly, no lens is at its sharpest wide open anyway, but also the bokeh is very mushy fully wide. I think closing down the aperture gives a much more pleasing image. As you say, I should have shot the guys face (my father) @F2.8 or higher. I am happy with the new GG though. The light loss is very low indeed, and the amount of diffussion/bokeh seems nice. There is no flickering with the new GG even at 1/2000th shutter speed. Its professionally made for me, both the disk cut and finished. The revision 1 disks were hand finished by myself. __________________ Thanks, Wayne.

September 11th, 2006, 03:25 PM	#6
Wayne Kinney Major Player Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Brighton, East Sussex, UK Posts: 938	Thanks for the kind words. Yes the r1 was £400 and the r2 is £450. __________________ Thanks, Wayne.

September 11th, 2006, 03:43 PM	#9
Wayne Kinney Major Player Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Brighton, East Sussex, UK Posts: 938	Thanks David. It was not all shot @F1.4. The video show what the aperture setting was in each shot, some @F4. One shot you see me stopping down from wide to F4. __________________ Thanks, Wayne.

September 11th, 2006, 01:14 PM	#2
Theodoros Chliapas Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Greece Posts: 58	It's shaaarp! Wayne, as far as i can see the improvement from the previous model is VERY BIG! It's sharp. It's very sharp! Actually is one of the sharpest footages with a 35mm adapter i've seen. Even at wide open aperture on the lens, it seems that the sharpness don't care :) To be honest, i can't find something bad in that footage. I think that my upcoming hvx will need this great thing!! Great work Wayne!!

September 11th, 2006, 03:05 PM	#5
Thomas Richter Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Frankfurt, Germany Posts: 181	Awesome. I had laid an eye on your adaptor for a while now but I am happy that I waited. This is absolutely awesome. I am now seriously considering to stop my experiments with other gear (the Canon ee-s is good, but I can't get an achromat setup to work ;-). Please take this as a compliment to your excellent work. Are we still at 450 quid? I fear not.

September 11th, 2006, 03:26 PM	#7
Thomas Richter Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Frankfurt, Germany Posts: 181	Holey shamoley. I'll start saving instantaneously. I wish I hadn't booked that stupid stupid holiday ...

September 11th, 2006, 03:41 PM	#8
David Delaney Trustee Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Niagara Ontario Canada Posts: 1,121	Wayne, Looks great. I think that is some fine footage. I am surprised you didn't stop down on the lens though and shot it all at 1.4...

September 11th, 2006, 07:34 PM	#10
Kyle Edwards Major Player Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: LI, NY Posts: 274	That footage looks great, really sharp. Did you try any other lenses with the FX1 setup (besides the 50mm & 85mm)?

September 11th, 2006, 09:32 PM	#11
Dennis Wood Major Player Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Ontario, Canada Posts: 916	Nice bokeh! It's pretty bad when you start noticing the number of aperture blades on spec highlights during a focus rack:-) F4 on that 85mm is not bad to get some decent aperture discs showing up. I've found that full open (as many like to use them) does not look good at all.

September 11th, 2006, 09:57 PM	#12
Bob Hart Inner Circle Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: PERTH. W.A. AUSTRALIA. Posts: 4,476	"I've found that full open (as many like to use them) does not look good at all."----------------- A local industry professional expresses a preference not to have the SLR lenses fully open, but to be able to use the range f4 to f8. This enables focus to hold for dynamic situations where a wide-open lens would be almost impossible to control for focus, eg., tracking ahead of a person walking fast, periodically stopping and describing things, yet allow some softness of background.

September 11th, 2006, 10:06 PM	#13
Dennis Wood Major Player Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Ontario, Canada Posts: 916	Bob, I've been chasing my 3 year old around all week with an adapter and stabilizer. Shallow DOF is useless in that situation :-) As I'm sure you've already found out, the sharpest images come with a mix of both 35mm lens and video cam aperture...generally from f2.8 to f4 or so. Wayne's got it right shooting at f4.

September 12th, 2006, 03:28 AM	#14
Wayne Kinney Major Player Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Brighton, East Sussex, UK Posts: 938	Thanks for your comments. Kyle: Yes I have 3 more clips to post today, shot with: 24mm F2 28mm F1.8 50mm F1.4 85mm F1.8 All exterior shots. Just need to finish the lens info then upload. Dennis: Yes i'm very happy with the way the GG renders the highlights and bokeh. As we all know it’s tough to get good bokeh and low lightloss. I think I’ve hit the compromise just right. That’s why I love your 'swappable diffuser' option on the Brevis. __________________ Thanks, Wayne.

September 12th, 2006, 05:52 AM	#15
Bob Hart Inner Circle Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: PERTH. W.A. AUSTRALIA. Posts: 4,476	Dennis and Wayne. If you have a spare copy of the fine groundglass, try melting parrafin wax onto the groundglass face, fine pieces shaved off with a fine grater onto the GG, slowly cooked up in bottom of a frypan until it melts and spreads, no hotter, let it set and cool, then boil it off in a pot of water and dishwash detergent, then cleaned with Preen the great unstainer, then rinsed off in warm water with hands only, rubbed on with raw detergent, then rinsed off again with hands again, not cloth or tissue and then allowed to dry on its own. I'm getting a freak result with a AO5 GG which I think may have a fine residue of wax in the very bottom of the pits and valleys but the ridges and peaks are clean. I can close this thing down to f16 and there is no flicker, but moving smooth objects get grain, fixed objects do not - very confusing. I am using a CD-R sized glass spinning disk at about 1500rpm. At f16, with camcorder settings adjusted for correct exposure, a very slight improvement in contrast and colour seems to happen. However, high contrast edges like street poles against bright blue sky gain quite a thick lighter coloured outline. Conditions, camcorder and adaptor settings:- 1-30pm, clear bright sky, sun at 60 degrees to one side shining towards but mainly across image plane. Adaptor. AO5 disk glass CD-R sized @ 1500 rpm. SLR lens. Nikon f1.8 85mm set at f16. Camcorder. Sony FX1. 7+ Century Optics acromatic dioptre. 2 x rigth-angle prisms. Zoom at about 45mm for 28mm wide 16:9 frame off GG. Shutter 1/50th sec. ND off. AE slow auto. Gain setting 0db. Aperture manual for best image.