New method for spinning real Ground Glass

Wayne Kinney · September 16th, 2005, 02:12 PM

Craig,
Yes this thread is the most up to date information on my method.

I would love to see someone else try this to. I have a few tricks and modification up my sleeve, but thats for the commercial version. I'll get some more 'adjusted' shots in soon.

Thanks,
Wayne.

Keith Wakeham · September 16th, 2005, 04:58 PM

Hey Wayne, you've come a long way in a short time and its awesome. Glad its working out. I'm downloading the video now to take a look at it.

Glad that method of cutting the glass worked out as well.

Bill Porter · September 17th, 2005, 12:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Craig Bellaire

WOW Finally
Someone did it with REAL glass..

Not to take anything away from Wayne's accomplishment, which I applaud, but didn't Nick Bartleet do it with glass months ago?

Good job, Wayne, looks terrific!

Wayne Kinney · September 17th, 2005, 01:23 AM

Thanks Bill,

Nick's design was a little different, spinning a small peice of glass inside a bearing, but this means thats the glass in the centre of the frame is moving very slowley and in theory the dead centre of the glass is not moving at all. While Nicks design has other physical bennefits (smallers size adapter, doesnt suffer from gyro effect), this part of Nicks design always concerned me and you would need a very clean ground glass but more worrying you would need much higher RPM to dissolve the grain perhaps meaning more noise?

The main concern with my method was gyro effect and the glass shattering under sudden movement. Well, under a few controlled and safe tests, with the glass spinning faster then would be needed, I put the glass under extreme movements and harsh sudden turns (movements you would never dream of putting your camcorder through), and the glass held up fine. I put this down to my design having a much smaller diameter disk then a CD, therefore being much stronger and having smaller gyroeffect.

As I say, im working on a commercial version, that comes with 15mm rod support. Which will feature:

1:15mm adjustable rod support
2:Nikon style lens mount.
3:Adjustable GG speed control via rotary knob.
4:Full 36x24mm frame
5:1 - 2 stops light loss.

The unit will be availible in under a month.

Thanks,
Wayne.

Thanks,
Wayne.

Craig Bellaire · September 17th, 2005, 05:53 AM

Any Idea of possible cost and also what strength of Acromat? 100X 50X... I have a PDX 10 and have only been able to use a 100X and gert it to work properly... Also what kind of case. RAdio shack Box or a better design... Thanks

Wayne Kinney · September 17th, 2005, 07:13 AM

Hi,
I am going to offer an introductory price of £125-£150. Still finalising the price.

One thing to keep in mind is it wont come with macro/acromat. It will come with 58mm thread size, so the buyer will provide his/her own macro, then screw the adpater onto his/her own macro. The case will be the black ABS plastic project box. Would people perfer a glossy or matte finish?

I see this as a better option anyway, as it gives the buyer the freedom to choose the macro/acromat that best suits their camcorder and personal preference. I will provide exact distance between filter thread and GG so potential buyers test if they need a macro or not by trying to frame and focus on a 36x24mm frame from that distance.

Im currectly finalising the design, more info to follow.

Thanks,
Wayne.

Glen Hurd · September 17th, 2005, 11:15 PM

Great job, Wayne! Looks real good.
Doesn't look like you have any vignetting problems either. Did you use a PCX lens with that, or straight from GG to video cam?
You've been pretty focused on getting to this point, and it looks like you're outta the woods. (By the way, what's it like? :)

G

Wayne Kinney · September 18th, 2005, 04:08 AM

Thanks Glen,
There is a bit vignetting in the far corners, you can see that mostly in the last 3 shots, but i know why it is and have adjusted it all now. Yes i was using a pcx lens as in my other thread http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthread.php?t=50884

Yes Glen, it feels good that i have got there, and the results are better then i could have hoped for, both in terms of picture quality, and how robust the glass mechanism is.

Give me a couple of weeks, and the commercial version will hopfully be available.

Thanks,
Wayne.

Kurt August · September 18th, 2005, 05:06 AM

The footage looks very nice. Is it perhaps possible to post a full frame of the last shot, the one with the pepper? Just curious how sharp it really.is.

Wayne Kinney · September 18th, 2005, 05:38 AM

Hi Kurt, thanks.

Here are 2 full frames from the pepper shot.

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/wayne.k...ullframe01.jpg

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/wayne.k...ullframe02.jpg

Please remember that it was shot with a cheap 1 chip/ccd panny, an nvds30 like here: http://www.skala.nl/usr_img/webshop/19/PA-NVDS30.jpg

You can see the slight vignetting i was talking about, which is now resolved.

I'll try and get some more footage up soon, but i have ran out of webspace. I only have 55mb;)

Thanks,
Wayne

Bill Porter · September 18th, 2005, 08:48 AM

Wayne,

I have a massive amount of space available if you want a host. It's a very fast server. I host files for a couple of other dvinfo folks and my ISP never complains. So far it's been typically hundreds of views of 50-ish meg files with no problems (!)

Wayne Kinney · September 18th, 2005, 08:52 AM

Bill, that is very very helpful of you. Yes i would love it if you could host my video files for me. Could you please host the video i have already posted and give me the new link, if you would be so kind?

Is it possible for me to upload video's to your server directly, maybe via ftp?

Please let me know my friend, and thanks again!!!

Wayne.

Bill Porter · September 18th, 2005, 09:00 AM

Happy to help.

http://tinyurl.com/cgazu

I don't know how to make other accounts so just let me know if you need more files uploaded and we'll figure something out.

Wayne Kinney · September 18th, 2005, 09:12 AM

Thanks Bill,
I'll send you an email when i get my next video ready for upload:D..Thanks again!!!

Wayne.

Bill Porter · September 18th, 2005, 09:27 AM

You're welcome. Glad to help another member, of a community that has helped me a lot.

September 17th, 2005, 05:53 AM	#50
Craig Bellaire Major Player Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Rochester, NY Posts: 422	Cost Any Idea of possible cost and also what strength of Acromat? 100X 50X... I have a PDX 10 and have only been able to use a 100X and gert it to work properly... Also what kind of case. RAdio shack Box or a better design... Thanks __________________ Craig Bellaire www.VerticalVideoSolutions.com

September 18th, 2005, 05:06 AM	#54
Kurt August Regular Crew Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Belgium Posts: 94	Full frame The footage looks very nice. Is it perhaps possible to post a full frame of the last shot, the one with the pepper? Just curious how sharp it really.is.

September 16th, 2005, 02:12 PM	#46
Wayne Kinney Major Player Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Brighton, East Sussex, UK Posts: 938	Craig, Yes this thread is the most up to date information on my method. I would love to see someone else try this to. I have a few tricks and modification up my sleeve, but thats for the commercial version. I'll get some more 'adjusted' shots in soon. Thanks, Wayne.

September 16th, 2005, 04:58 PM	#47
Keith Wakeham Major Player Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: St. John's, NL, Canada Posts: 416	Hey Wayne, you've come a long way in a short time and its awesome. Glad its working out. I'm downloading the video now to take a look at it. Glad that method of cutting the glass worked out as well.

September 17th, 2005, 01:23 AM	#49
Wayne Kinney Major Player Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Brighton, East Sussex, UK Posts: 938	Thanks Bill, Nick's design was a little different, spinning a small peice of glass inside a bearing, but this means thats the glass in the centre of the frame is moving very slowley and in theory the dead centre of the glass is not moving at all. While Nicks design has other physical bennefits (smallers size adapter, doesnt suffer from gyro effect), this part of Nicks design always concerned me and you would need a very clean ground glass but more worrying you would need much higher RPM to dissolve the grain perhaps meaning more noise? The main concern with my method was gyro effect and the glass shattering under sudden movement. Well, under a few controlled and safe tests, with the glass spinning faster then would be needed, I put the glass under extreme movements and harsh sudden turns (movements you would never dream of putting your camcorder through), and the glass held up fine. I put this down to my design having a much smaller diameter disk then a CD, therefore being much stronger and having smaller gyroeffect. As I say, im working on a commercial version, that comes with 15mm rod support. Which will feature: 1:15mm adjustable rod support 2:Nikon style lens mount. 3:Adjustable GG speed control via rotary knob. 4:Full 36x24mm frame 5:1 - 2 stops light loss. The unit will be availible in under a month. Thanks, Wayne. Thanks, Wayne.

September 17th, 2005, 07:13 AM	#51
Wayne Kinney Major Player Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Brighton, East Sussex, UK Posts: 938	Hi, I am going to offer an introductory price of £125-£150. Still finalising the price. One thing to keep in mind is it wont come with macro/acromat. It will come with 58mm thread size, so the buyer will provide his/her own macro, then screw the adpater onto his/her own macro. The case will be the black ABS plastic project box. Would people perfer a glossy or matte finish? I see this as a better option anyway, as it gives the buyer the freedom to choose the macro/acromat that best suits their camcorder and personal preference. I will provide exact distance between filter thread and GG so potential buyers test if they need a macro or not by trying to frame and focus on a 36x24mm frame from that distance. Im currectly finalising the design, more info to follow. Thanks, Wayne.

September 17th, 2005, 11:15 PM	#52
Glen Hurd Regular Crew Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Burlington, NJ Posts: 59	Great job, Wayne! Looks real good. Doesn't look like you have any vignetting problems either. Did you use a PCX lens with that, or straight from GG to video cam? You've been pretty focused on getting to this point, and it looks like you're outta the woods. (By the way, what's it like? :) G

September 18th, 2005, 04:08 AM	#53
Wayne Kinney Major Player Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Brighton, East Sussex, UK Posts: 938	Thanks Glen, There is a bit vignetting in the far corners, you can see that mostly in the last 3 shots, but i know why it is and have adjusted it all now. Yes i was using a pcx lens as in my other thread http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthread.php?t=50884 Yes Glen, it feels good that i have got there, and the results are better then i could have hoped for, both in terms of picture quality, and how robust the glass mechanism is. Give me a couple of weeks, and the commercial version will hopfully be available. Thanks, Wayne.

September 18th, 2005, 05:38 AM	#55
Wayne Kinney Major Player Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Brighton, East Sussex, UK Posts: 938	Hi Kurt, thanks. Here are 2 full frames from the pepper shot. http://homepage.ntlworld.com/wayne.k...ullframe01.jpg http://homepage.ntlworld.com/wayne.k...ullframe02.jpg Please remember that it was shot with a cheap 1 chip/ccd panny, an nvds30 like here: http://www.skala.nl/usr_img/webshop/19/PA-NVDS30.jpg You can see the slight vignetting i was talking about, which is now resolved. I'll try and get some more footage up soon, but i have ran out of webspace. I only have 55mb;) Thanks, Wayne

September 18th, 2005, 08:48 AM	#56
Bill Porter Major Player Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Ventura, California, USA Posts: 751	Wayne, I have a massive amount of space available if you want a host. It's a very fast server. I host files for a couple of other dvinfo folks and my ISP never complains. So far it's been typically hundreds of views of 50-ish meg files with no problems (!)

September 18th, 2005, 08:52 AM	#57
Wayne Kinney Major Player Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Brighton, East Sussex, UK Posts: 938	Bill, that is very very helpful of you. Yes i would love it if you could host my video files for me. Could you please host the video i have already posted and give me the new link, if you would be so kind? Is it possible for me to upload video's to your server directly, maybe via ftp? Please let me know my friend, and thanks again!!! Wayne.

September 18th, 2005, 09:00 AM	#58
Bill Porter Major Player Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Ventura, California, USA Posts: 751	Happy to help. http://tinyurl.com/cgazu I don't know how to make other accounts so just let me know if you need more files uploaded and we'll figure something out.

September 18th, 2005, 09:12 AM	#59
Wayne Kinney Major Player Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Brighton, East Sussex, UK Posts: 938	Thanks Bill, I'll send you an email when i get my next video ready for upload:D..Thanks again!!! Wayne.

September 18th, 2005, 09:27 AM	#60
Bill Porter Major Player Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Ventura, California, USA Posts: 751	You're welcome. Glad to help another member, of a community that has helped me a lot.