Shoot 35 SGBlade First Review

Phil Bloom · February 8th, 2009, 03:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Adriano Apefos

there is chromatic aberration in the footage. you need to see the video in HD, in full screen to see it. these crops from the footage shows the chromatic aberration, the green/blue and yellow/red fringing in the contrast objects:

Could be from any number of things mate, from the combinations of my picture profile settings to the Zoom lenses I was using or even the EX1/ Blade combo. You have to look hard to see it. I find it best not to dwell too much on negatives when there are so many positives...

Dennis Murphy · February 8th, 2009, 12:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Phil Bloom

here is the review and the test short film
Philip Bloom Blog Archive Test film made with Shoot 35 SGBlade

That looks nice. Cheers for taking the time to review!
I'd be interested to see a shot of the blue sky (I'm sure you'll have one in the next 6 months) with the lens at beyond 5.6. My Letus makes a special point of introducing grain in such conditions.

Chris Barcellos · February 12th, 2009, 10:50 AM

Phil- Have you got test footage posted somewhere yet ?

Wayne Kinney · February 12th, 2009, 11:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris Barcellos

Phil- Have you got test footage posted somewhere yet ?

Philip Bloom The Magic Bus Stop: Test Short Made with SGBlade

Chris Barcellos · February 12th, 2009, 11:53 AM

Thanks- nice job on the footage.

Bob Hart · February 13th, 2009, 12:43 AM

Wayne

You definitely seem to have got the apparent resolution well and truly licked. In the hands of the master it certainly looks good.

I certainly recommend you to make an adaptor ring to mount a Nikon f2.8 45mm pancake lens behind your achromat, drag your wares along to the nearest SI2K which has a Nikon f-Mount in its kit and talk the owner into shooting a test for you. You might be delighted or horrified with what you get.

You have to ride the Nikon lens focus like a hawk and the SGBlade will have to be supported on a rods kit, likewise the SI2K, otherwise the Nikon lens will baulk. It is not internally focussed but physically grows longer or shorter with focus movements. The SI2K owner may elect to put the "Mini" head on an umbilical and simply let the lightweight head be supported on the lens and get around the problem that way.

The SI2K has a "loupe" function which gives you an enlarged thumbnail portion within the frame of any part of the shot you want to establish critical focus upon, all-in-all a feature loaded bunch of assist functions which render me into a slavering jealous idiot, unable to afford this indulgence except at the expense of another owner.

My instruction set on dvinfo.net for the SI2K and Letus Extreme production bundle might give you a very rough guide if you decide upon this little adventure.

You will probably have to shoot it at 1920 x 1080 @ 25p to keep it within the means of your post-production suite. I tried ( and failed ) to edit 2048 x 1152 @ 25p on my previously satisfactory computer which is bottom-end for HD but go by. The SI2K can give you cineform .avi files or .mov files.

You will need the Neo or Prospect plug-ins from cineform to make it work or otherwise just be satisfied with seeing the image on the camera monitor screen.

Henry Olonga · February 13th, 2009, 05:19 PM

Nice one mate.I have watched a lot of your stuff over the last few years and applaud your generosity in sharing your work.In yourr opinion how close are the blade and the letus ultimate on the resolution front?Regards
Henry

Phil Bloom · February 14th, 2009, 03:04 PM

The Ultimate is definitely superior Henry.

Michael Maier · February 14th, 2009, 04:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Phil Bloom

The Ultimate is definitely superior Henry.

Well, the Ultimate may well be. I haven't used one but at more than 3 times the price it better really be WAY superior.
But because of my horrible experience with the Letus Extreme I would never give letus $4500 of my money. But judging from the footage I have been seeing online from the Blade it looks to beat the Letus Extreme in sharpness and bokeh, not to mention it has more features, which just the Ultimate has. Blade vs Extreme seems a no brainer. The Blade seems to win by miles.

Phil Bloom · February 14th, 2009, 04:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Michael Maier

Well, the Ultimate may well be. I haven't used one but at more than 3 times the price it better really be WAY superior.
But because of my horrible experience with the Letus Extreme I would never give letus $4500 of my money. But judging from the footage I have been seeing online from the Blade it looks to beat the Letus Extreme in sharpness and bokeh, not to mention it has more features, which just the Ultimate has. Blade vs Extreme seems a no brainer. The Blade seems to win by miles.

Unless you have an EX1 then it doesn't win by miles. Edge sharpness and CA is a problem with Blade.

Dan Chung · February 14th, 2009, 07:50 PM

Phil,

That's not good news for us EX-1 owners, can you elaborate? do you think it is the usual EX-1 related issues? Have you tried it in a non-flip config to see if it improves? or does the CA and edge sharpness issue apply to other cams too?

I would have hoped this adapter at least improved on the Brevis if not rivalling an Ultimate, do you think this is the case?

Dan

Marcel D. Van Someren · February 14th, 2009, 09:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Phil Bloom

Unless you have an EX1 then it doesn't win by miles. Edge sharpness and CA is a problem with Blade.

Philip, I'm a little confused by this statement. In another forum you stated:

Quote:

Originally Posted by philip bloom

I shot some stuff yesterday with Blade and EX1 and didn't notice any CA.

Quote:

Originally Posted by philip bloom

I would say edge sharpness is better on the LEX with EX1 achromat than the blade. But then the blade lets you stop down...edge sharpness is fine with the EX1 and Blade if you stop EX1 down...limiting if you are low light of course. But this is mostly on the really wide lenses...

These statments from the other forum certainly seem to contradict the statement made in this forum regarding CA and, to some extent, regarding edge sharpness.

Bob Hart · February 15th, 2009, 01:25 AM

Adaptors seem these days to be swimming pretty much in the same stream but with some diversity still.

What suits one operator may not suit another.

Pin-sharp is not the be all and end all. It will be interesting to see how the other optional groundglass performs.

I would like to see the SGBlade and Letus Extreme/Ultimate/Elite duke it out on front of SI2K and Ikonoskop digital cinema cameras with really high quality relays.

I understand that the pitch of pixels in current digital cinema camera sensors is five microns. I understand the more or less practical grade of finish on groundglass surfaces for good bokeh rendition is about 5 microns. The manufacturer/vendors might like to correct me on this as I am no longer doing my own building.

So if a really good lens goes on front of a groundglass relay device, the internal optics and relay are of top quality, anti-reflection coatings exist on the shiny side of the groundglass and internal dust excluders, then if properly exposed and focus is meticulously managed, the groundglass relayed image should by my imagining come up to the practical resolution limit of a 4K bayer sensor and certainly should be able to meet the practical resolution limit of a 2K bayer sensor.

Real-world circumstances mean that ideal conditions do not always exist. The trait of a groundglass to amplify under certain lighting conditions, deficiencies in a lens and incorrect focus means that there is less forgiveness if the system is not managed properly.

Phil Bloom · February 15th, 2009, 10:01 AM

Not really. CA has been brought to my attention after writing first statement. I hadn't really noticed it but everyone is going on about it. Edge sharpness is as mentioned. A problem unless you stop down EX1, then it's fine. Otherwise you have issues.

here is blog of my latest tests: Philip Bloom Blog Archive Bexhill-on-sea: Test short made with SGBlade RR2

Michael Maier · February 16th, 2009, 07:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Phil Bloom

Unless you have an EX1 then it doesn't win by miles. Edge sharpness and CA is a problem with Blade.

Well, edge sharpness is a problem with the EX1 and the Extreme too, even with the so called fix kit. Wider lenses still show very soft edges. The next problem is that unless you shoot wide open you always see the grain if you pay attention. The third problem is the build quality. The ugly bokeh is not even that big of a deal next to the above problems.

February 12th, 2009, 10:50 AM	#18
Chris Barcellos Inner Circle Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Elk Grove CA Posts: 6,838	Phil- Have you got test footage posted somewhere yet ? __________________ Chris J. Barcellos

February 12th, 2009, 11:53 AM	#20
Chris Barcellos Inner Circle Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Elk Grove CA Posts: 6,838	Thanks- nice job on the footage. __________________ Chris J. Barcellos

February 13th, 2009, 12:43 AM	#21
Bob Hart Inner Circle Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: PERTH. W.A. AUSTRALIA. Posts: 4,477	Wayne You definitely seem to have got the apparent resolution well and truly licked. In the hands of the master it certainly looks good. I certainly recommend you to make an adaptor ring to mount a Nikon f2.8 45mm pancake lens behind your achromat, drag your wares along to the nearest SI2K which has a Nikon f-Mount in its kit and talk the owner into shooting a test for you. You might be delighted or horrified with what you get. You have to ride the Nikon lens focus like a hawk and the SGBlade will have to be supported on a rods kit, likewise the SI2K, otherwise the Nikon lens will baulk. It is not internally focussed but physically grows longer or shorter with focus movements. The SI2K owner may elect to put the "Mini" head on an umbilical and simply let the lightweight head be supported on the lens and get around the problem that way. The SI2K has a "loupe" function which gives you an enlarged thumbnail portion within the frame of any part of the shot you want to establish critical focus upon, all-in-all a feature loaded bunch of assist functions which render me into a slavering jealous idiot, unable to afford this indulgence except at the expense of another owner. My instruction set on dvinfo.net for the SI2K and Letus Extreme production bundle might give you a very rough guide if you decide upon this little adventure. You will probably have to shoot it at 1920 x 1080 @ 25p to keep it within the means of your post-production suite. I tried ( and failed ) to edit 2048 x 1152 @ 25p on my previously satisfactory computer which is bottom-end for HD but go by. The SI2K can give you cineform .avi files or .mov files. You will need the Neo or Prospect plug-ins from cineform to make it work or otherwise just be satisfied with seeing the image on the camera monitor screen. Last edited by Bob Hart; February 13th, 2009 at 12:46 AM. Reason: added text

February 13th, 2009, 05:19 PM	#22
Henry Olonga Major Player Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: London Posts: 201	Phil Nice one mate.I have watched a lot of your stuff over the last few years and applaud your generosity in sharing your work.In yourr opinion how close are the blade and the letus ultimate on the resolution front?Regards Henry

February 14th, 2009, 03:04 PM	#23
Phil Bloom Trustee Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: London UK Posts: 1,939	The Ultimate is definitely superior Henry. __________________ Philip Bloom Cinematographer, Director, Filmmaker www.philipbloom.net

February 14th, 2009, 07:50 PM	#26
Dan Chung Major Player Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Beijing Posts: 665	Phil, That's not good news for us EX-1 owners, can you elaborate? do you think it is the usual EX-1 related issues? Have you tried it in a non-flip config to see if it improves? or does the CA and edge sharpness issue apply to other cams too? I would have hoped this adapter at least improved on the Brevis if not rivalling an Ultimate, do you think this is the case? Dan

February 15th, 2009, 01:25 AM	#28
Bob Hart Inner Circle Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: PERTH. W.A. AUSTRALIA. Posts: 4,477	Adaptors seem these days to be swimming pretty much in the same stream but with some diversity still. What suits one operator may not suit another. Pin-sharp is not the be all and end all. It will be interesting to see how the other optional groundglass performs. I would like to see the SGBlade and Letus Extreme/Ultimate/Elite duke it out on front of SI2K and Ikonoskop digital cinema cameras with really high quality relays. I understand that the pitch of pixels in current digital cinema camera sensors is five microns. I understand the more or less practical grade of finish on groundglass surfaces for good bokeh rendition is about 5 microns. The manufacturer/vendors might like to correct me on this as I am no longer doing my own building. So if a really good lens goes on front of a groundglass relay device, the internal optics and relay are of top quality, anti-reflection coatings exist on the shiny side of the groundglass and internal dust excluders, then if properly exposed and focus is meticulously managed, the groundglass relayed image should by my imagining come up to the practical resolution limit of a 4K bayer sensor and certainly should be able to meet the practical resolution limit of a 2K bayer sensor. Real-world circumstances mean that ideal conditions do not always exist. The trait of a groundglass to amplify under certain lighting conditions, deficiencies in a lens and incorrect focus means that there is less forgiveness if the system is not managed properly. Last edited by Bob Hart; February 15th, 2009 at 01:40 AM. Reason: added text

February 15th, 2009, 10:01 AM	#29
Phil Bloom Trustee Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: London UK Posts: 1,939	Not really. CA has been brought to my attention after writing first statement. I hadn't really noticed it but everyone is going on about it. Edge sharpness is as mentioned. A problem unless you stop down EX1, then it's fine. Otherwise you have issues. here is blog of my latest tests: Philip Bloom Blog Archive Bexhill-on-sea: Test short made with SGBlade RR2 __________________ Philip Bloom Cinematographer, Director, Filmmaker www.philipbloom.net