Effective Range of Sennheiser ME64 at DVinfo.net

Kevin Penhorwood · April 19th, 2007, 06:00 AM

I am trying to increase my sound kit and need an indoor mic. Currently I have both the ME66 and ME67 but have been doing a lot of recording in a room with concrete floors, concrete block walls and no carpet or furniture. Obviously my current mics are not great for this environment even with sound blankets up.

Anyway, since I am using the K6 modules I thought maybe a ME64 might be an inexpensive route to go for awhile. I know it's not a Hyper-Cardioid but thought it has got to be better than a shotgun in this case. My question is can I boom this mic and how close would I have to get it to the talent to get good sound? Or, should I just wait and go with something like an AT4073 or AT4053 for indoor recording?

Anyone have any experience with the ME64 on a boom?

Thanks,

Peter Jefferson · April 19th, 2007, 06:57 AM

the 64 is indeed cardoid, and its much shorter than the ME66... it doesnt have teh kind of pickup range of the 66 but is perfectly sufficient for on cam or boom work.
In fact, i had natural audio on cam from abotu 8 metres away and every word could be heard.. this was at a beachside car park with a rycote softie
as for this mic on a boom.. i use a rycote pistol grip with a lightwave pole and for decent sound were usually about 2 metres or so.. maybe closer.. depends on the subject and the framing i guess..
We always plant wireless lapels on our subjects anyway, and this allows for a more confined recording as we only adjust levels and mic sensitivity based on proximity then tweak in post..

Kevin Penhorwood · April 19th, 2007, 08:21 AM

Thanks Peter for the reply.

How is the rear and side noise rejection of the ME64. Since I am working in such a reflective room I am trying to find something that will help with the echo sound so my audio doesn't sound like it was recorded in a cave. (of course it's pretty much is a cave).

Thanks,

Steve Leverich · April 19th, 2007, 11:08 AM

Kevin, I don't know that there is a mic that CAN make that room sound good - anything you use will still pick up the crappy acoustics and there's no practical way to fix that AFTER - only thing I know of that'll help is more blankets, some rockwool insulation batts placed diagonally across corners, maybe more of the rockwool suspended from the ceiling - you need to kill the echo, and a mic won't help that... Steve

Kevin Penhorwood · April 20th, 2007, 06:45 AM

Yeah Steve, it is definitely a tough environment to get good sound in. Hopefully with a mic that is not a shotgun and the sound blankets we can at least reduce the hollowness/echo of the sound a little.

Thanks!!

Ty Ford · April 20th, 2007, 06:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kevin Penhorwood

Yeah Steve, it is definitely a tough environment to get good sound in. Hopefully with a mic that is not a shotgun and the sound blankets we can at least reduce the hollowness/echo of the sound a little.

Thanks!!

Sucky room. a 4053a or cmc641 would help. And more sound blankets, and carpet.

Why the cell block location?

The mic should be not further than 18 inches from the mouth of th eperson speaking, for anywhere near best reaults.

Regards,

Ty Ford

Kevin Penhorwood · April 23rd, 2007, 05:37 AM

Thanks Ty,

Yeah, I thought maybe I should blow some of the budget on the 4053a. 18 inches doesn't give much room for a wide shot though and I don't have a wireless system yet. Well, we will do what we can.

We needed a space to be able to set up multiple backdrops and a green screen plus have a painted concrete industrial look for the client. We found a descent size old warehouse that gave us the space and look we want. Since we only have it for 30 days I don't want to spend too much budget bringing carpet etc. in.

We cater to the low budget corporate crowd so they get what they pay for I guess but of course I want to do the best we can. I see a good wireless lav system in my future.

Thanks,

Ty Ford · April 23rd, 2007, 05:52 AM

Don't boom from the side. Boom more from the front. If the talent isn't moving much, lock the boom down by lashing it to an arm on a C-stand.

I use a 16 foot k-tek boom and either a Schoeps cmc641 or a Sennheiser 416.

If you're micing from above, make sure you have some carpet down.

Regards,

Ty Ford

Kevin Penhorwood · April 24th, 2007, 05:21 AM

Thanks Ty,

I should be getting the mic soon (AT4053a). I got some old carpet to put around and a few more sound blankets. We shoot at the end of this week so hopefully I wil have a day or two to play around and get things setup right.

Again, thanks for the help!!

Ty Ford · April 24th, 2007, 07:04 AM

No Prob.

Take a lav with you and compare. You'll learn something. I always try to if I'm in a tough situation. I was in a locker room for a shoot and found the lav actually worked better because I couldn't get close enough with the boom mic.

Sometimes situations will surprise you.

Regards,

Ty Ford

Alessandro Machi · April 24th, 2007, 03:24 PM

I'd also significantly pad down the mike level since the sennheisers seem to put out a hot signal anyways, of course I'm assuming you don't have some autogain function somewhere in the audio chain that will then overcompensate because you lowered the mike level.

Lavaliers could actually sound better in that environment, especially if you pad them down properly as well. Just pre-determine how much head sweep your talent will be doing and avoid the ultra directional lavs. If you know at some point you will be purchashing lavs anyways, two wireless sennheisers (forgot the model number) should be worth the approximately thousand dollar investment. Although I upgraded the lav mike and that seems to make quite a difference, (although the original is quite acceptable) but those little buggers cost over 200 bucks, yikes.

Kevin Penhorwood · April 25th, 2007, 05:58 AM

Thanks Alessandro,

I actually got my AT4053a last night so I am going to play with it a bit in the environment. Unfortunately I doubt that I will be able to get a wireless before the shoot in a day. That is something I will definitely add to my kit soon if I am going to be doing this a lot.

I agree about the Senns being hot. I rarely use the ME66 because of that. I do however like the ME67, it is not as hot and is very directional. It also seems to have better sound (to me anyway) than the ME66. I have never used other mics so I will be interested on how the AT handles compared to the lower end Senns I have been using.

Thanks,

Kevin,

Ty,

By the way I liked your book, it is something I carry around with me.

Ty Ford · April 25th, 2007, 06:19 AM

Ken,

Thanks so much. part of the thought behind the cover design was to make it durable enough to stick in a run bag.

I'm looking for ways to take the book on the road. maybe later this year.

Regards,

Ty Ford

April 19th, 2007, 06:00 AM	#1
Kevin Penhorwood Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Columbus, OH Posts: 82	Effective Range of Sennheiser ME64 I am trying to increase my sound kit and need an indoor mic. Currently I have both the ME66 and ME67 but have been doing a lot of recording in a room with concrete floors, concrete block walls and no carpet or furniture. Obviously my current mics are not great for this environment even with sound blankets up. Anyway, since I am using the K6 modules I thought maybe a ME64 might be an inexpensive route to go for awhile. I know it's not a Hyper-Cardioid but thought it has got to be better than a shotgun in this case. My question is can I boom this mic and how close would I have to get it to the talent to get good sound? Or, should I just wait and go with something like an AT4073 or AT4053 for indoor recording? Anyone have any experience with the ME64 on a boom? Thanks,

April 23rd, 2007, 05:52 AM	#8
Ty Ford Inner Circle Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Baltimore, MD USA Posts: 2,337	Don't boom from the side. Boom more from the front. If the talent isn't moving much, lock the boom down by lashing it to an arm on a C-stand. I use a 16 foot k-tek boom and either a Schoeps cmc641 or a Sennheiser 416. If you're micing from above, make sure you have some carpet down. Regards, Ty Ford __________________ Ty Ford's Audio Bootcamp Field Guide Ty Ford's Audio Video Blog

April 24th, 2007, 07:04 AM	#10
Ty Ford Inner Circle Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Baltimore, MD USA Posts: 2,337	No Prob. Take a lav with you and compare. You'll learn something. I always try to if I'm in a tough situation. I was in a locker room for a shoot and found the lav actually worked better because I couldn't get close enough with the boom mic. Sometimes situations will surprise you. Regards, Ty Ford __________________ Ty Ford's Audio Bootcamp Field Guide Ty Ford's Audio Video Blog

April 24th, 2007, 03:24 PM	#11
Alessandro Machi Major Player Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Los Angeles, Ca USA Posts: 553	I'd also significantly pad down the mike level since the sennheisers seem to put out a hot signal anyways, of course I'm assuming you don't have some autogain function somewhere in the audio chain that will then overcompensate because you lowered the mike level. Lavaliers could actually sound better in that environment, especially if you pad them down properly as well. Just pre-determine how much head sweep your talent will be doing and avoid the ultra directional lavs. If you know at some point you will be purchashing lavs anyways, two wireless sennheisers (forgot the model number) should be worth the approximately thousand dollar investment. Although I upgraded the lav mike and that seems to make quite a difference, (although the original is quite acceptable) but those little buggers cost over 200 bucks, yikes. __________________ https://alexlogic.blogspot.com/ Los Angeles Emmy Winner (yes, used a video edit controller and loved doing so.)

April 25th, 2007, 06:19 AM	#13
Ty Ford Inner Circle Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Baltimore, MD USA Posts: 2,337	Ken, Thanks so much. part of the thought behind the cover design was to make it durable enough to stick in a run bag. I'm looking for ways to take the book on the road. maybe later this year. Regards, Ty Ford __________________ Ty Ford's Audio Bootcamp Field Guide Ty Ford's Audio Video Blog

April 19th, 2007, 06:57 AM	#2
Peter Jefferson Inner Circle Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Aus Posts: 3,884	the 64 is indeed cardoid, and its much shorter than the ME66... it doesnt have teh kind of pickup range of the 66 but is perfectly sufficient for on cam or boom work. In fact, i had natural audio on cam from abotu 8 metres away and every word could be heard.. this was at a beachside car park with a rycote softie as for this mic on a boom.. i use a rycote pistol grip with a lightwave pole and for decent sound were usually about 2 metres or so.. maybe closer.. depends on the subject and the framing i guess.. We always plant wireless lapels on our subjects anyway, and this allows for a more confined recording as we only adjust levels and mic sensitivity based on proximity then tweak in post..

April 19th, 2007, 08:21 AM	#3
Kevin Penhorwood Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Columbus, OH Posts: 82	Thanks Peter for the reply. How is the rear and side noise rejection of the ME64. Since I am working in such a reflective room I am trying to find something that will help with the echo sound so my audio doesn't sound like it was recorded in a cave. (of course it's pretty much is a cave). Thanks,

April 19th, 2007, 11:08 AM	#4
Steve Leverich Regular Crew Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Albany Oregon Posts: 173	Kevin, I don't know that there is a mic that CAN make that room sound good - anything you use will still pick up the crappy acoustics and there's no practical way to fix that AFTER - only thing I know of that'll help is more blankets, some rockwool insulation batts placed diagonally across corners, maybe more of the rockwool suspended from the ceiling - you need to kill the echo, and a mic won't help that... Steve

April 20th, 2007, 06:45 AM	#5
Kevin Penhorwood Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Columbus, OH Posts: 82	Yeah Steve, it is definitely a tough environment to get good sound in. Hopefully with a mic that is not a shotgun and the sound blankets we can at least reduce the hollowness/echo of the sound a little. Thanks!!

April 23rd, 2007, 05:37 AM	#7
Kevin Penhorwood Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Columbus, OH Posts: 82	Thanks Ty, Yeah, I thought maybe I should blow some of the budget on the 4053a. 18 inches doesn't give much room for a wide shot though and I don't have a wireless system yet. Well, we will do what we can. We needed a space to be able to set up multiple backdrops and a green screen plus have a painted concrete industrial look for the client. We found a descent size old warehouse that gave us the space and look we want. Since we only have it for 30 days I don't want to spend too much budget bringing carpet etc. in. We cater to the low budget corporate crowd so they get what they pay for I guess but of course I want to do the best we can. I see a good wireless lav system in my future. Thanks,

April 24th, 2007, 05:21 AM	#9
Kevin Penhorwood Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Columbus, OH Posts: 82	Thanks Ty, I should be getting the mic soon (AT4053a). I got some old carpet to put around and a few more sound blankets. We shoot at the end of this week so hopefully I wil have a day or two to play around and get things setup right. Again, thanks for the help!!

April 25th, 2007, 05:58 AM	#12
Kevin Penhorwood Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Columbus, OH Posts: 82	Thanks Alessandro, I actually got my AT4053a last night so I am going to play with it a bit in the environment. Unfortunately I doubt that I will be able to get a wireless before the shoot in a day. That is something I will definitely add to my kit soon if I am going to be doing this a lot. I agree about the Senns being hot. I rarely use the ME66 because of that. I do however like the ME67, it is not as hot and is very directional. It also seems to have better sound (to me anyway) than the ME66. I have never used other mics so I will be interested on how the AT handles compared to the lower end Senns I have been using. Thanks, Kevin, Ty, By the way I liked your book, it is something I carry around with me.