Shotgun Mic Help... Thanks!

Alex Geschke · June 2nd, 2003, 10:59 PM

Jeff,

I read the entire thread. Would you still recomend the Schriber over the Canon MD-50 shotgun? I am trying to decide between the two and I don't want to spend over $160.

The main problem with the Canon mic is that you can't use if off the camera. However, the upside is that it is designed for the GL2 and shouldn't have any hiss issues.

In short, I am leaning towards the Schriber, but I'd be really dissapointed if I hook it up and hear a constant hiss.

Either way I suppose you get what you pay for.

Jeff Price · June 3rd, 2003, 09:08 AM

I'm reserving judgement until I talk to NRG, the manufacturers, about the hiss. Otherwise I'm back to thinking about the DM-50. Zotz is recommending the AT (815? 835?) but I'm leery over the additional length. I've thought some about the AT-55 though.

My hesitancy over the DM-50 is that I couldn't use it on my GL-1 so I'd prefer a mic that works on both.

Schriber also makes a shotgun they call the SA-600 but I don't know how its specs match up with the 568.

Jay Enterkin · June 3rd, 2003, 10:08 PM

I don't think you'll ever get rid of the hiss in 'tele' or 'hypercardiod' mode on one of those inexpensive 'switchable' shotgun mics like the Schriber or the ATR-55. I have never seen one that didn't have it.

The least expensive shotgun mic that I have found with decent sound and quality is the Azden SGM-1X. You can pick them up for about $149. No hiss. No ridiculous 'normal' - 'tele' switch. 'Free' shock mount included in price. A pretty decent one, too.

Good luck!

<<<-- Originally posted by Jeff Price : I'm reserving judgement until I talk to NRG, the manufacturers, about the hiss. Otherwise I'm back to thinking about the DM-50. Zotz is recommending the AT (815? 835?) but I'm leery over the additional length. I've thought some about the AT-55 though.

My hesitancy over the DM-50 is that I couldn't use it on my GL-1 so I'd prefer a mic that works on both.

Schriber also makes a shotgun they call the SA-600 but I don't know how its specs match up with the 568. -->>>

Lester DeLeon · June 3rd, 2003, 10:12 PM

I fully agree with Jay, I upgraded to the Azden SGM-1X and got great results at a wedding on Sunday. No hissing, crystal clear audio. I am about to ship back my Schriber SA-568.

I did experience some sound distortion at the reception when standing next to the loud speaker system, with the GL2 built in mic. I think I shoud have turned on MIC ATT....right ??..or maybe I should have kept the SGM-1X and used is as a regular cardioid without the long barrel. Will try this next time. I did play around with the manual audio and tried to lower it, but this just lowered the volume, the distortion was still present at high amplitudes.

Any suggestions here ????

Aaron Rosen · June 3rd, 2003, 10:37 PM

Lester -

What did you hook up the Azden SGM-1X to your GL2 with? This is the mic I am about to buy.

- Ar

Lester DeLeon · June 3rd, 2003, 10:41 PM

I used a beachtek XLR adapter...but I think you can just as easily use an XLR to mini stereo plut...I tested using the cables from the SA-568, that was the only nice thing about the Schriber, it came with cables. And the shock mount on the Azden virtually eliminates camera handling noise

By the way, I have the SGM-2X, not the SGM-1X....sorry about the misprint.

Aaron Rosen · June 3rd, 2003, 10:59 PM

Does your current setup include a preamp (the beachtec)?

I will be using the Canon MA-300. Just want to insure that there will be NO hum and the mic will have enough power.

Lester DeLeon · June 3rd, 2003, 11:06 PM

I don't think so...I have the Beachtek DXA-4P

Aaron Rosen · June 3rd, 2003, 11:16 PM

So does anyone know if the Azden SGM-1X will work?

Jay Enterkin · June 4th, 2003, 07:54 AM

The SGM-1x and SGM-2x run on battery power, not phantom power, so that is not an issue with either mic. I can't speak to 'hum' because I've never used one with a MA-300.

What causes the hum? and under what conditions does it occur?

<<<-- Originally posted by Aaron Rosen : So does anyone know if the Azden SGM-1X will work? -->>>

Jeff Price · June 4th, 2003, 09:16 AM

If you return a Schriber because of hiss make sure you say so! I talked with the people at NRG and they say they have had no complaints about it. Many people are using it with the GL1 and GL2 and the magazine reviews have been favorable. Given that the two I've tried were both manufactured in 2002 in approximately the same time period (look on the back of the inspection card) there may be a defect but they don't think so.

The way it was explained to me, and I may get some of the details wrong, is that the hyper setting really ramps up the amplifier (equivalent to cranking up the gain?). The question NRG posed to me was whether I was loading up the microphone when I heard the hiss - in other words how much sound was being recorded that would overcome the noise. Since most of my efforts had been in quiet rooms there was little loading but I would still expect to be able to do a suitable job in those conditions as well. I agreed to try another day of field testing before returning the microphone.

Schriber apparently has some more shotgun designs in the planning stages. Another option to the SA-568, especially if you aren't ever going to use an XLR with it, is the SA-600. It doesn't have the metal case and the miniplug is hardwired to the mic but it costs quite a bit less. Otherwise they said the specs were about the same.

So, if it doesn't rain I'll try one more time to see if 'loading' the mic makes any real difference.

Joe Sacher · June 4th, 2003, 10:08 AM

How far out in front the camera does the Azden SGM-2X extend in both modes? This sounds like a great mic for the money, but not if you can see it at wide angle.

Lester DeLeon · June 4th, 2003, 10:00 PM

The SGM-2X does not extend into the field of view in either the cardioid or hypercardioid mode. The shockmount, which is made of rubber bands, allows the barrel to be pushed back. So the mic is about the lenght of the camera with the hypercardioid barrel extension, but I can mount it in a way so it does not go into the field of view (even at full wide angle) and at the same time it does not interfere with using the eyepiece. So far I have no complaints. I am thinking of using the mic without the long barrel at my next wedding, I am hoping it does a better job with audio than the built in mic.

Alex Geschke · June 4th, 2003, 11:52 PM

Jeff,

Do you have to use XLR with the Schriber SA-568, or can you plug directly to the mic jack on the camera?

Also, put in a post if you decide to send it back. I still don't know what I'm going to do, but if it is bad enough for you to return I do know it will get crossed off my list.

What good is an awesome image if the sound sucks?

Lester DeLeon · June 4th, 2003, 11:55 PM

The Schriber mic can be used with or without an XLR adapter, but the hiss still exists either way.

June 3rd, 2003, 09:08 AM	#32
Jeff Price Major Player Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Chico, California Posts: 357	I'm reserving judgement until I talk to NRG, the manufacturers, about the hiss. Otherwise I'm back to thinking about the DM-50. Zotz is recommending the AT (815? 835?) but I'm leery over the additional length. I've thought some about the AT-55 though. My hesitancy over the DM-50 is that I couldn't use it on my GL-1 so I'd prefer a mic that works on both. Schriber also makes a shotgun they call the SA-600 but I don't know how its specs match up with the 568. __________________ Jeff Price Flickerflix Nature Videos flickerflix@yahoo.com

June 3rd, 2003, 10:08 PM	#33
Jay Enterkin Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Raleigh/Durham, North Carolina Posts: 33	hiss with inexpensive normal/tele mics I don't think you'll ever get rid of the hiss in 'tele' or 'hypercardiod' mode on one of those inexpensive 'switchable' shotgun mics like the Schriber or the ATR-55. I have never seen one that didn't have it. The least expensive shotgun mic that I have found with decent sound and quality is the Azden SGM-1X. You can pick them up for about $149. No hiss. No ridiculous 'normal' - 'tele' switch. 'Free' shock mount included in price. A pretty decent one, too. Good luck! <<<-- Originally posted by Jeff Price : I'm reserving judgement until I talk to NRG, the manufacturers, about the hiss. Otherwise I'm back to thinking about the DM-50. Zotz is recommending the AT (815? 835?) but I'm leery over the additional length. I've thought some about the AT-55 though. My hesitancy over the DM-50 is that I couldn't use it on my GL-1 so I'd prefer a mic that works on both. Schriber also makes a shotgun they call the SA-600 but I don't know how its specs match up with the 568. -->>> __________________ http://www.wholmmovies.com/ website for the OTHER indie films

June 4th, 2003, 07:54 AM	#40
Jay Enterkin Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Raleigh/Durham, North Carolina Posts: 33	SGM-1x and SGM-2x battery powered The SGM-1x and SGM-2x run on battery power, not phantom power, so that is not an issue with either mic. I can't speak to 'hum' because I've never used one with a MA-300. What causes the hum? and under what conditions does it occur? <<<-- Originally posted by Aaron Rosen : So does anyone know if the Azden SGM-1X will work? -->>> __________________ http://www.wholmmovies.com/ website for the OTHER indie films

June 4th, 2003, 09:16 AM	#41
Jeff Price Major Player Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Chico, California Posts: 357	If you return a Schriber because of hiss make sure you say so! I talked with the people at NRG and they say they have had no complaints about it. Many people are using it with the GL1 and GL2 and the magazine reviews have been favorable. Given that the two I've tried were both manufactured in 2002 in approximately the same time period (look on the back of the inspection card) there may be a defect but they don't think so. The way it was explained to me, and I may get some of the details wrong, is that the hyper setting really ramps up the amplifier (equivalent to cranking up the gain?). The question NRG posed to me was whether I was loading up the microphone when I heard the hiss - in other words how much sound was being recorded that would overcome the noise. Since most of my efforts had been in quiet rooms there was little loading but I would still expect to be able to do a suitable job in those conditions as well. I agreed to try another day of field testing before returning the microphone. Schriber apparently has some more shotgun designs in the planning stages. Another option to the SA-568, especially if you aren't ever going to use an XLR with it, is the SA-600. It doesn't have the metal case and the miniplug is hardwired to the mic but it costs quite a bit less. Otherwise they said the specs were about the same. So, if it doesn't rain I'll try one more time to see if 'loading' the mic makes any real difference. __________________ Jeff Price Flickerflix Nature Videos flickerflix@yahoo.com

June 4th, 2003, 11:52 PM	#44
Alex Geschke Regular Crew Join Date: May 2003 Location: Corona, CA Posts: 37	Jeff, Do you have to use XLR with the Schriber SA-568, or can you plug directly to the mic jack on the camera? Also, put in a post if you decide to send it back. I still don't know what I'm going to do, but if it is bad enough for you to return I do know it will get crossed off my list. What good is an awesome image if the sound sucks? __________________ Luck is where preparation meets opportunity…

June 2nd, 2003, 10:59 PM	#31
Alex Geschke Regular Crew Join Date: May 2003 Location: Corona, CA Posts: 37	Jeff, I read the entire thread. Would you still recomend the Schriber over the Canon MD-50 shotgun? I am trying to decide between the two and I don't want to spend over $160. The main problem with the Canon mic is that you can't use if off the camera. However, the upside is that it is designed for the GL2 and shouldn't have any hiss issues. In short, I am leaning towards the Schriber, but I'd be really dissapointed if I hook it up and hear a constant hiss. Either way I suppose you get what you pay for.

June 3rd, 2003, 10:12 PM	#34
Lester DeLeon Regular Crew Join Date: May 2003 Location: Melville, NY Posts: 28	I fully agree with Jay, I upgraded to the Azden SGM-1X and got great results at a wedding on Sunday. No hissing, crystal clear audio. I am about to ship back my Schriber SA-568. I did experience some sound distortion at the reception when standing next to the loud speaker system, with the GL2 built in mic. I think I shoud have turned on MIC ATT....right ??..or maybe I should have kept the SGM-1X and used is as a regular cardioid without the long barrel. Will try this next time. I did play around with the manual audio and tried to lower it, but this just lowered the volume, the distortion was still present at high amplitudes. Any suggestions here ????

June 3rd, 2003, 10:37 PM	#35
Aaron Rosen Major Player Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: HB, CA - USA Posts: 298	Lester - What did you hook up the Azden SGM-1X to your GL2 with? This is the mic I am about to buy. - Ar

June 3rd, 2003, 10:41 PM	#36
Lester DeLeon Regular Crew Join Date: May 2003 Location: Melville, NY Posts: 28	I used a beachtek XLR adapter...but I think you can just as easily use an XLR to mini stereo plut...I tested using the cables from the SA-568, that was the only nice thing about the Schriber, it came with cables. And the shock mount on the Azden virtually eliminates camera handling noise By the way, I have the SGM-2X, not the SGM-1X....sorry about the misprint.

June 3rd, 2003, 10:59 PM	#37
Aaron Rosen Major Player Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: HB, CA - USA Posts: 298	Does your current setup include a preamp (the beachtec)? I will be using the Canon MA-300. Just want to insure that there will be NO hum and the mic will have enough power.

June 3rd, 2003, 11:06 PM	#38
Lester DeLeon Regular Crew Join Date: May 2003 Location: Melville, NY Posts: 28	I don't think so...I have the Beachtek DXA-4P

June 3rd, 2003, 11:16 PM	#39
Aaron Rosen Major Player Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: HB, CA - USA Posts: 298	So does anyone know if the Azden SGM-1X will work?

June 4th, 2003, 10:08 AM	#42
Joe Sacher Regular Crew Join Date: May 2003 Location: Indianapolis, IN Posts: 177	How far out in front the camera does the Azden SGM-2X extend in both modes? This sounds like a great mic for the money, but not if you can see it at wide angle.

June 4th, 2003, 10:00 PM	#43
Lester DeLeon Regular Crew Join Date: May 2003 Location: Melville, NY Posts: 28	The SGM-2X does not extend into the field of view in either the cardioid or hypercardioid mode. The shockmount, which is made of rubber bands, allows the barrel to be pushed back. So the mic is about the lenght of the camera with the hypercardioid barrel extension, but I can mount it in a way so it does not go into the field of view (even at full wide angle) and at the same time it does not interfere with using the eyepiece. So far I have no complaints. I am thinking of using the mic without the long barrel at my next wedding, I am hoping it does a better job with audio than the built in mic.

June 4th, 2003, 11:55 PM	#45
Lester DeLeon Regular Crew Join Date: May 2003 Location: Melville, NY Posts: 28	The Schriber mic can be used with or without an XLR adapter, but the hiss still exists either way.