Tascam P2 Time Code Settings Questions at DVinfo.net

Glenn Davidson · January 16th, 2007, 01:38 PM

I now have my Tascam HD-P2 and it is pretty sweet. I am a little confused by all the time code settings. I plan on using it for a multi-cam shoot with TC. Here are the menu selctions I have made so far:

Clock Source: LTC
Frame Rate: (should match cam, probably 29.97/ND)
Freewheel: Infinite
Jam Sync: On
Trigger Mode: Auto
Trigger on Frame: Off

What settings do you use? Any words of wisdom from P2 users would be appreciated.

Steve House · January 16th, 2007, 01:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Glenn Davidson

I now have my Tascam HD-P2 and it is pretty sweet. I am a little confused by all the time code settings. I plan on using it for a multi-cam shoot with TC. Here are the menu selctions I have made so far:

Clock Source: LTC
Frame Rate: (should match cam, probably 29.97/ND)
Freewheel: Infinite
Jam Sync: On
Trigger Mode: Auto
Trigger on Frame: Off

What settings do you use? Any words of wisdom from P2 users would be appreciated.

What's your source of external code?

Glenn Davidson · January 16th, 2007, 02:02 PM

Hi Steve... External TC will be from Sony 135 DV cam.

Jay Massengill · January 16th, 2007, 02:29 PM

I always use drop-frame code so that long programs equal real time.

Glenn Davidson · January 16th, 2007, 02:46 PM

Thanks Jay. Good advice. 29.97 drop frame is the standard for NTSC right?

The Tascam has various Rate Pull Up/Pull Down. Is this selected in the camera along with the Frame rate. Does 29.97/DF have a corresponding Pull Up/Down Rate.

Other Questions: Jam Sync means the action of getting the initial TC from the Camera, correct?

More details..This project will be a continuous 90 minute shoot and I will be tied into the Time Code for the whole time.

I really appreciate being able to run this setup past you guys. I want to get all the settings dialed in BEFORE I get to the venue.

Glenn Davidson · January 17th, 2007, 12:37 AM

I think I should set the Tascam to the camera's frame rate (29.97 DF), lock it at 48 kHz, Jam it a good solid LTC connection and let it FreeWheel, if it wants to. Wish me luck, I might need it. Thanks!

Steve House · January 17th, 2007, 05:34 AM

For video where the camera can generate TC, audio timecode normally chases video (the reverse of the normal film workflow where audio is usually the timecode master). Get together with the camera operator and set the Tascam to whatever the camera is set to, most likely 29.97 drop frame and 48kHz sample rate. Also check on whether they're using continuous-run or record-run and if they're open to your input ask them to use record run if they're not already doing so. If it's possible, the best option is external code record-run with camera rolling before audio. Camera rolls, then you roll audio and call speed after you see the timecode on the recorder start to move, verifying you're getting valid code from the camera. Sync the audio sample clock either to the incoming LTC or if you can get video from the camera, sync to the incoming video. Letting the sample clock freewheel is fine for shorter takes but drift can be a problem over longer ones and since you have the ability to slave the audio clock to the camera's frame rate to eliminate that variable you might as well use it when you can.

Pull up and pull down is used when the video is destined for 24fps film or is being shot at one frame rate but destined to be converted to another rate in post.

Glenn Davidson · January 17th, 2007, 01:54 PM

Steve, your last post is very helpful. Still a couple more questions.

Does 'record run' mean the TC is generated every time video starts recording?

I am also having trouble understanding the relationship between Jam Sync and FreeWheel. On the Tascam, with Jam Sync ON FreeWheel defaults to INFINITE and is unchangable. With Jam Sync OFF FreeWheel can be selected from 1 to 20 frames.

This seems to indicate that audio operators will periodically 'Jam' to the sync and then disconnect and the FreeWheel TC continues. So, Jam Sync off is for continuous TC connection, with Freewheel only taking over on TC dropouts. In my case since i will be constantly connected to TC from the video, I do not need to FreeWheel, so JAM should be OFF. Am a on the right track?

Steve House · January 17th, 2007, 03:24 PM

Yes, you've got it. "Jam Sync" means the internal TC clock in the recorder is set to match when it gets a signal from an external source. You set the clocks, then disconnect the two devices and the recorder continues counting on its own with its code hopefully in step to that in the master device. With it set to external code, the recorder continuously slaves to the external clock and when the external signal stops or is disconnected, the recorder's clock stops also. The freewheeling options are so if you're using external code but something happens to interupt the signal, after a defined wait the internal clock will pick up and continue counting on its own rather than stopping.

So External Jam On means that it is runnng on internal but the internal clock is continuously being reset by the external source. External Jam Off means that external controls the internal, not just resets it but actually drives it. And the freewheeling options are what the internal clock should do if it loses its external drive.

"Continuous run" means the recorders clock keeps going whether you're rolling or not. The clock might be set to time-of-day or it might be started at 00:00:00;00 (hh:mm:ss:ff) at the start of the day. Let's say it's set to zeros at 8am. Take 1, lasting 5 minutes rolls at 9am. The file's TC header will start at 01:00:00;00.and will end at 01:05:00;00. We have an hour to get ready for the next setup and then Take 2 rolls at 10am. Its TC header will be 02:00:00;00 and ends at 02:05:00;00.

"Record-run" means the code only advances while the recorder is rolling. So we set the clock to 00;00;00;00 at 8am. We roll the first take at 9am. It will start at 00:00:00:00 (not 01:00:00:00 because it wasn't counting for the hour we weren't rolling after we set the clock) and end at 00:05:00;00. We have our hour gap and roll on take 2 at 10am. It's header will show it starts at 00:05:00;00 and ends at 00:10:00:00.

So with continuous run our last take ends at 02:10:00:00 while with record run our last take ends at 00:10:00:00 Big difference! In a camera, record-run will usually reset to zeros whenever the tape is ejected or the camera is powered down.

Glenn Davidson · January 17th, 2007, 04:21 PM

Excellent! Thanks guys.

January 16th, 2007, 01:38 PM	#1
Glenn Davidson Major Player Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Nevada City, California Posts: 499	Tascam P2 Time Code Settings Questions I now have my Tascam HD-P2 and it is pretty sweet. I am a little confused by all the time code settings. I plan on using it for a multi-cam shoot with TC. Here are the menu selctions I have made so far: Clock Source: LTC Frame Rate: (should match cam, probably 29.97/ND) Freewheel: Infinite Jam Sync: On Trigger Mode: Auto Trigger on Frame: Off What settings do you use? Any words of wisdom from P2 users would be appreciated.

January 17th, 2007, 05:34 AM	#7
Steve House Inner Circle Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Hamilton, Ontario, Canada Posts: 5,742	For video where the camera can generate TC, audio timecode normally chases video (the reverse of the normal film workflow where audio is usually the timecode master). Get together with the camera operator and set the Tascam to whatever the camera is set to, most likely 29.97 drop frame and 48kHz sample rate. Also check on whether they're using continuous-run or record-run and if they're open to your input ask them to use record run if they're not already doing so. If it's possible, the best option is external code record-run with camera rolling before audio. Camera rolls, then you roll audio and call speed after you see the timecode on the recorder start to move, verifying you're getting valid code from the camera. Sync the audio sample clock either to the incoming LTC or if you can get video from the camera, sync to the incoming video. Letting the sample clock freewheel is fine for shorter takes but drift can be a problem over longer ones and since you have the ability to slave the audio clock to the camera's frame rate to eliminate that variable you might as well use it when you can. Pull up and pull down is used when the video is destined for 24fps film or is being shot at one frame rate but destined to be converted to another rate in post. __________________ Good news, Cousins! This week's chocolate ration is 15 grams!

January 17th, 2007, 03:24 PM	#9
Steve House Inner Circle Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Hamilton, Ontario, Canada Posts: 5,742	Yes, you've got it. "Jam Sync" means the internal TC clock in the recorder is set to match when it gets a signal from an external source. You set the clocks, then disconnect the two devices and the recorder continues counting on its own with its code hopefully in step to that in the master device. With it set to external code, the recorder continuously slaves to the external clock and when the external signal stops or is disconnected, the recorder's clock stops also. The freewheeling options are so if you're using external code but something happens to interupt the signal, after a defined wait the internal clock will pick up and continue counting on its own rather than stopping. So External Jam On means that it is runnng on internal but the internal clock is continuously being reset by the external source. External Jam Off means that external controls the internal, not just resets it but actually drives it. And the freewheeling options are what the internal clock should do if it loses its external drive. "Continuous run" means the recorders clock keeps going whether you're rolling or not. The clock might be set to time-of-day or it might be started at 00:00:00;00 (hh:mm:ss:ff) at the start of the day. Let's say it's set to zeros at 8am. Take 1, lasting 5 minutes rolls at 9am. The file's TC header will start at 01:00:00;00.and will end at 01:05:00;00. We have an hour to get ready for the next setup and then Take 2 rolls at 10am. Its TC header will be 02:00:00;00 and ends at 02:05:00;00. "Record-run" means the code only advances while the recorder is rolling. So we set the clock to 00;00;00;00 at 8am. We roll the first take at 9am. It will start at 00:00:00:00 (not 01:00:00:00 because it wasn't counting for the hour we weren't rolling after we set the clock) and end at 00:05:00;00. We have our hour gap and roll on take 2 at 10am. It's header will show it starts at 00:05:00;00 and ends at 00:10:00:00. So with continuous run our last take ends at 02:10:00:00 while with record run our last take ends at 00:10:00:00 Big difference! In a camera, record-run will usually reset to zeros whenever the tape is ejected or the camera is powered down. __________________ Good news, Cousins! This week's chocolate ration is 15 grams!

January 16th, 2007, 02:02 PM	#3
Glenn Davidson Major Player Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Nevada City, California Posts: 499	Hi Steve... External TC will be from Sony 135 DV cam.

January 16th, 2007, 02:29 PM	#4
Jay Massengill Trustee Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Burlington Posts: 1,976	I always use drop-frame code so that long programs equal real time.

January 16th, 2007, 02:46 PM	#5
Glenn Davidson Major Player Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Nevada City, California Posts: 499	Thanks Jay. Good advice. 29.97 drop frame is the standard for NTSC right? The Tascam has various Rate Pull Up/Pull Down. Is this selected in the camera along with the Frame rate. Does 29.97/DF have a corresponding Pull Up/Down Rate. Other Questions: Jam Sync means the action of getting the initial TC from the Camera, correct? More details..This project will be a continuous 90 minute shoot and I will be tied into the Time Code for the whole time. I really appreciate being able to run this setup past you guys. I want to get all the settings dialed in BEFORE I get to the venue.

January 17th, 2007, 12:37 AM	#6
Glenn Davidson Major Player Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Nevada City, California Posts: 499	I think I should set the Tascam to the camera's frame rate (29.97 DF), lock it at 48 kHz, Jam it a good solid LTC connection and let it FreeWheel, if it wants to. Wish me luck, I might need it. Thanks!

January 17th, 2007, 01:54 PM	#8
Glenn Davidson Major Player Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Nevada City, California Posts: 499	Steve, your last post is very helpful. Still a couple more questions. Does 'record run' mean the TC is generated every time video starts recording? I am also having trouble understanding the relationship between Jam Sync and FreeWheel. On the Tascam, with Jam Sync ON FreeWheel defaults to INFINITE and is unchangable. With Jam Sync OFF FreeWheel can be selected from 1 to 20 frames. This seems to indicate that audio operators will periodically 'Jam' to the sync and then disconnect and the FreeWheel TC continues. So, Jam Sync off is for continuous TC connection, with Freewheel only taking over on TC dropouts. In my case since i will be constantly connected to TC from the video, I do not need to FreeWheel, so JAM should be OFF. Am a on the right track?

January 17th, 2007, 04:21 PM	#10
Glenn Davidson Major Player Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Nevada City, California Posts: 499	Excellent! Thanks guys.