All Things Audio -- topics from 2002 thru 2004

Jay Massengill · July 17th, 2004, 01:34 PM

Unbalanced cables should be as short as possible and made from the best quality cable. Wrapping one around a metal or carbon fiber boom makes them even worse for picking up interference and hum. Going from mini to XLR is still unbalanced (unless you use a transformer), it won't help with interference even though it is a more physically secure connection.
You can do what you're asking, but a much better solution will be to get a balanced mic with an XLR connector. Then use a transformer or BeachTek type box to maintain the balanced connection and keep the unbalanced input to the camera very short.
If you have no choice for the moment but to use an unbalanced extension cable, they are available. Radio Shack has cheap ones. Other vendors like www.soundprofessionals, the Remote Audio division of www.trewaudio, www.haveinc and others have better cables at a higher cost.

Matt Blair · July 17th, 2004, 01:35 PM

I was browsing for a wireless lapel. . .and found this one.

I know it's a low price, but it seems to be coming from a wholesaler, so maybe it's justified. . .hmm.

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg...&s=electronics

I need a wireless lapel to film a few sections for two dvds that I'm making for a local band. . .I'm making a small documentary of the work they do to prepare, and things they do the day of the concert.

I'm only making $300 off this. . .but I'm planning on using the lapel mic forever, so I thought of it as more of an investment. I don't want to spend over $100 for one. . .and I think that narrows my choices down a LOT.

I also need it overnighted by Monday to get here in time. . .so I have to add $30 to whatever the selling price is. . .

Darian Haines · July 17th, 2004, 10:06 PM

I own a basic Sony Digital 8 trv 355e camcorder.
I plan to make short films with it.

I don't think i have noticed it before- but when i press the record button there is a slight clicking noise, almost like a SLR camera clicking as you take a picture. It's more noticeable when i go to edit and playback the footage on my computer.

I also have an older analogue camcorder, which does this too
when i was certain it didn't before. It may not be so noticeable if there is plenty of sound.

But i wanted to know if this is normal? or whether there is something wrong with my camera. It's only about 5 months old.
I don't think ive noticed it before, unless this is a new problem.

So if you guys have any advice or ideas on the matter it would be much appreciated.

Thanks

Jay Massengill · July 18th, 2004, 12:02 PM

Check the menu settings. It sounds like a "feature" to let you know audibly that the button was pressed and this should be defeatable.

Jay Massengill · July 19th, 2004, 07:32 AM

Since it seems the price of the K6/ME66 is climbing and more people have phantom power available now, we ought to add the AKG - C568B shotgun to our comparisons. Anybody got one? This seems to be one of the least known mics in this class. I've never even seen one...

Mike Rehmus · July 20th, 2004, 05:46 PM

Noise reduction and more
http://www.tracertek.com/dc_six.htm

Hardware and software - high-end stuff
http://www.independentaudio.com/CDCatalog/HTML/cedar.html

Douglas Spotted Eagle · July 20th, 2004, 06:59 PM

The tracertek stuff isn't bad at all, but sure isn't forge quality on the plug side. I'm pretty biased though, I've been using Forge for almost 14 years now.

Cedar has lost it's cachet. Too much for too little. We tried using it during the Smithsonian repair work, and found that Sony's Noise Redux was far and away faster and better. No where near as complicated, either.

Mark Robbins · July 21st, 2004, 06:21 AM

I'm using Final Cut Pro 4, about to upgrade to HD.
Anyway, is Soundtrack a good audio software to fix, mix and normalize audio like soundforge. or is it just a simple composer not suited for this?
any comments on its usage

Douglas Spotted Eagle · July 21st, 2004, 07:00 AM

No. soundtrack is a music creation tool, more like Acid than sound forge.
If you want to edit audio on the Mac like you do in Sound Forge on the PC, pick up a copy of Bias' PEAK. Similar to Forge, shares some of the same shortcuts. You should have gotten a copy of Peak LE with your FCP bundle..

Matt Gettemeier · July 21st, 2004, 04:53 PM

I just thought I'd give you guys the heads up on a new boom pole by K-Tek. Up till now if you wanted an internally coil cabled pole and you didn't have much cash you had one choice... the Lightwave GT-10C. The normal price on that pole is about $245.

K-Tek has recently introduced the KE-110CC. It's an aluminum pole with internal coil cabling very similar to the Lightwave. The K-Tek is 6.5 ounces lighter, they both share a 30" minimum length, and the Lightwave has an advantage with an extra 6" maximum length. (116" max on the Lightwave, 110" max on the K-Tek)

So I'm not going to say the Lightwave is a poor choice, but I got a chance to check out the new K-Tek and it is incredibly nice. I'm VERY impressed with it.

6.5 ounces may not sound like much, but it's nearly the same weight savings that LOTS of people pay a couple hundred dollars for by going to a carbon fiber or graphite pole... and what's more important is that K-Tek is giving you this significant weight savings in a CHEAPER pole. It's $229 everywhere.

Click HERE for the K-Tek AVALON KE-110CC

BTW The crappy pictures on the K-Tek site don't do this pole justice!

Oh yeah, the K-Tek cabled pole terminates in a Switchcraft XLR jack at the bottom and a Neutrik connector at the mic... both of which are TOP industry standards for quality.

I gotta' give props to Dave Fisk at Coffey Sound for showing me this pole! I still went with the graphite version... but I couldn't believe the price to quality ratio of the aluminum one.

Mike Rehmus · July 22nd, 2004, 10:05 PM

I would tell you that the Light Wave Systems boom pole I have is a bit sad. The locks fall apart.

Stewart McDonald · July 23rd, 2004, 11:38 AM

Do I leave in the AA battery in all the time with this mic?

Thanks

Jay Massengill · July 23rd, 2004, 12:14 PM

If you know it will be more than a day or so between using the mic, take it out. This is more so it doesn't simply get forgotten totally and left in, possibly leaking at a later date.
A new battery will last about 50 days, so a few hours here and there won't matter while you're on a project.
If it's important work put in a fresh one. If you're a stickler for detail then take it out at the end of each day to minimize any chance of leakage or extra drain.
I always inspect and test new batteries to make sure they're actually good and not already leaking. And one of my pet peeves is keeping the batteries and contacts clean. Fingerprints can screw you up at the worst possible times...

Kyle "Doc" Mitchell · July 23rd, 2004, 12:46 PM

Howdy gang:

Situation: I find myself desiring to create a portable/field sound effects recording rig. I've done a little bit of searching on the forums here (as this place has become my default research zone) and have noticed that I think I'd like some up-to-date opinions.

Definitions: I say sound effects to be anything from recording silent ambient noise, to rustling leaves, to car engines revving, to showers spraying, to . . . to . . .

What I'd like to accomplish: In an effort to boost the audio quality of my movies that I make with my XL1 setup, I'm wanting to record extra sound effects in the field after principle shooting. I currently am recording dialogue straight to my camera at 16-bit 48kHz but I want to record sound effects later in at least as equal quality. Oh yeah! And, I want my work flow of taking audio recorded from the field and dumped into my computer to have the path of least resistence -- i.e., easiest way possible!!

Stuff I have:
a.) Beacktek DXA-8 adapter (I use it with my camera)
b.) Senn MKH-60 mic
c.) Senn Me66 mic
d.) Lots 'o cables
e.) PC with okay sound card. Input audio software can be SoundForge or Adobe Audition.
f.) <$400 on a portable, field recording device.

Questions (Yay! The fun stuff!)
1.) What types of mics have you guys used to record sound effects? Do you suggest these mics? Why?
2.) Novice Question: Any reason why I shouldn't use shotgun mics for sound effects recording?
3.) What kinda device/media should I record on? I've read on previous posts about different kinds of portable field recorders that use batteries: Things such as portable DAT and miniDisc recorders. Some of the discussions, even though they are kinda old, seem to be still relevant. Any news on whether or not folks are moving away from DAT and I should be looking at these palm-pilot-made-recorder stuff?
4.) In your experience is the recorder that you've worked with have a pretty good "path of least resistence" to getting your audio into your editors? I'd like to have something easy, so I can run out the door record some sounds, run back inside, snag 'em on my computer and add 'em in the movie.
5.) Big Novice Question: If I get a portable field recorder (say, a DAT or something), am I able to rig up my DXA-8 to use it's pre-amps/limiters without there being any line troubles?
6.) Any questions that I should be asking but I'm not?

Let me know if something needs clarification. And, thanks for the help! You guys rock!

Regards,

Kyle "Doc" Mitchell

Joseph W. Carney Jr · July 28th, 2004, 01:17 PM

Thanks for the advice. I am not so much looking for water proof but something that will hold up to the salt air. I checked otu the AT and athe looks like the one i will go with.

July 17th, 2004, 01:35 PM	#362
Matt Blair New Boot Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: I N D I A N A Posts: 10	Is this a good wireless lapel? I was browsing for a wireless lapel. . .and found this one. I know it's a low price, but it seems to be coming from a wholesaler, so maybe it's justified. . .hmm. http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg...&s=electronics I need a wireless lapel to film a few sections for two dvds that I'm making for a local band. . .I'm making a small documentary of the work they do to prepare, and things they do the day of the concert. I'm only making $300 off this. . .but I'm planning on using the lapel mic forever, so I thought of it as more of an investment. I don't want to spend over $100 for one. . .and I think that narrows my choices down a LOT. I also need it overnighted by Monday to get here in time. . .so I have to add $30 to whatever the selling price is. . . __________________ matt blair matt blair matt blair matt blair matt blair matt balir

July 17th, 2004, 10:06 PM	#363
Darian Haines Tourist Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: New Zealand Posts: 2	Clicking sound heard I own a basic Sony Digital 8 trv 355e camcorder. I plan to make short films with it. I don't think i have noticed it before- but when i press the record button there is a slight clicking noise, almost like a SLR camera clicking as you take a picture. It's more noticeable when i go to edit and playback the footage on my computer. I also have an older analogue camcorder, which does this too when i was certain it didn't before. It may not be so noticeable if there is plenty of sound. But i wanted to know if this is normal? or whether there is something wrong with my camera. It's only about 5 months old. I don't think ive noticed it before, unless this is a new problem. So if you guys have any advice or ideas on the matter it would be much appreciated. Thanks

July 19th, 2004, 07:32 AM	#365
Jay Massengill Trustee Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Burlington Posts: 1,976	Another potential shotgun comparison Since it seems the price of the K6/ME66 is climbing and more people have phantom power available now, we ought to add the AKG - C568B shotgun to our comparisons. Anybody got one? This seems to be one of the least known mics in this class. I've never even seen one...

July 20th, 2004, 05:46 PM	#366
Mike Rehmus Wrangler Join Date: May 2002 Location: Vallejo, California Posts: 4,049	Douglas - What do you think of these products? Noise reduction and more http://www.tracertek.com/dc_six.htm Hardware and software - high-end stuff http://www.independentaudio.com/CDCatalog/HTML/cedar.html __________________ Mike Rehmus Hey, I can see the carrot at the end of the tunnel!

July 20th, 2004, 06:59 PM	#367
Douglas Spotted Eagle VASST Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Stockton, UT Posts: 5,648	The tracertek stuff isn't bad at all, but sure isn't forge quality on the plug side. I'm pretty biased though, I've been using Forge for almost 14 years now. Cedar has lost it's cachet. Too much for too little. We tried using it during the Smithsonian repair work, and found that Sony's Noise Redux was far and away faster and better. No where near as complicated, either. __________________ Douglas Spotted Eagle/Spot Author, producer, composer Certified Sony Vegas Trainer http://www.vasst.com

July 17th, 2004, 01:34 PM	#361
Jay Massengill Trustee Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Burlington Posts: 1,976	Unbalanced cables should be as short as possible and made from the best quality cable. Wrapping one around a metal or carbon fiber boom makes them even worse for picking up interference and hum. Going from mini to XLR is still unbalanced (unless you use a transformer), it won't help with interference even though it is a more physically secure connection. You can do what you're asking, but a much better solution will be to get a balanced mic with an XLR connector. Then use a transformer or BeachTek type box to maintain the balanced connection and keep the unbalanced input to the camera very short. If you have no choice for the moment but to use an unbalanced extension cable, they are available. Radio Shack has cheap ones. Other vendors like www.soundprofessionals, the Remote Audio division of www.trewaudio, www.haveinc and others have better cables at a higher cost.

July 18th, 2004, 12:02 PM	#364
Jay Massengill Trustee Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Burlington Posts: 1,976	Check the menu settings. It sounds like a "feature" to let you know audibly that the button was pressed and this should be defeatable.

July 21st, 2004, 06:21 AM	#368
Mark Robbins New Boot Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Melbourne, Australia Posts: 16	Is Soundtrack (mac) good for audio editing? I'm using Final Cut Pro 4, about to upgrade to HD. Anyway, is Soundtrack a good audio software to fix, mix and normalize audio like soundforge. or is it just a simple composer not suited for this? any comments on its usage

July 21st, 2004, 07:00 AM	#369
Douglas Spotted Eagle VASST Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Stockton, UT Posts: 5,648	No. soundtrack is a music creation tool, more like Acid than sound forge. If you want to edit audio on the Mac like you do in Sound Forge on the PC, pick up a copy of Bias' PEAK. Similar to Forge, shares some of the same shortcuts. You should have gotten a copy of Peak LE with your FCP bundle.. __________________ Douglas Spotted Eagle/Spot Author, producer, composer Certified Sony Vegas Trainer http://www.vasst.com

July 21st, 2004, 04:53 PM	#370
Matt Gettemeier Major Player Join Date: May 2003 Location: St. Louis, Missouri Posts: 936	NEW K-Tek is a nice "cheap" boom pole. I just thought I'd give you guys the heads up on a new boom pole by K-Tek. Up till now if you wanted an internally coil cabled pole and you didn't have much cash you had one choice... the Lightwave GT-10C. The normal price on that pole is about $245. K-Tek has recently introduced the KE-110CC. It's an aluminum pole with internal coil cabling very similar to the Lightwave. The K-Tek is 6.5 ounces lighter, they both share a 30" minimum length, and the Lightwave has an advantage with an extra 6" maximum length. (116" max on the Lightwave, 110" max on the K-Tek) So I'm not going to say the Lightwave is a poor choice, but I got a chance to check out the new K-Tek and it is incredibly nice. I'm VERY impressed with it. 6.5 ounces may not sound like much, but it's nearly the same weight savings that LOTS of people pay a couple hundred dollars for by going to a carbon fiber or graphite pole... and what's more important is that K-Tek is giving you this significant weight savings in a CHEAPER pole. It's $229 everywhere. Click HERE for the K-Tek AVALON KE-110CC BTW The crappy pictures on the K-Tek site don't do this pole justice! Oh yeah, the K-Tek cabled pole terminates in a Switchcraft XLR jack at the bottom and a Neutrik connector at the mic... both of which are TOP industry standards for quality. I gotta' give props to Dave Fisk at Coffey Sound for showing me this pole! I still went with the graphite version... but I couldn't believe the price to quality ratio of the aluminum one.

July 22nd, 2004, 10:05 PM	#371
Mike Rehmus Wrangler Join Date: May 2002 Location: Vallejo, California Posts: 4,049	I would tell you that the Light Wave Systems boom pole I have is a bit sad. The locks fall apart. __________________ Mike Rehmus Hey, I can see the carrot at the end of the tunnel!

July 23rd, 2004, 11:38 AM	#372
Stewart McDonald Regular Crew Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: UK Posts: 130	AT-897 battery question Do I leave in the AA battery in all the time with this mic? Thanks

July 23rd, 2004, 12:14 PM	#373
Jay Massengill Trustee Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Burlington Posts: 1,976	If you know it will be more than a day or so between using the mic, take it out. This is more so it doesn't simply get forgotten totally and left in, possibly leaking at a later date. A new battery will last about 50 days, so a few hours here and there won't matter while you're on a project. If it's important work put in a fresh one. If you're a stickler for detail then take it out at the end of each day to minimize any chance of leakage or extra drain. I always inspect and test new batteries to make sure they're actually good and not already leaking. And one of my pet peeves is keeping the batteries and contacts clean. Fingerprints can screw you up at the worst possible times...

July 23rd, 2004, 12:46 PM	#374
Kyle "Doc" Mitchell Doconomus Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Raleigh, NC, USA Posts: 100	What to include in a Sound Effects (SF/X) Recording Rig? Howdy gang: Situation: I find myself desiring to create a portable/field sound effects recording rig. I've done a little bit of searching on the forums here (as this place has become my default research zone) and have noticed that I think I'd like some up-to-date opinions. Definitions: I say sound effects to be anything from recording silent ambient noise, to rustling leaves, to car engines revving, to showers spraying, to . . . to . . . What I'd like to accomplish: In an effort to boost the audio quality of my movies that I make with my XL1 setup, I'm wanting to record extra sound effects in the field after principle shooting. I currently am recording dialogue straight to my camera at 16-bit 48kHz but I want to record sound effects later in at least as equal quality. Oh yeah! And, I want my work flow of taking audio recorded from the field and dumped into my computer to have the path of least resistence -- i.e., easiest way possible!! Stuff I have: a.) Beacktek DXA-8 adapter (I use it with my camera) b.) Senn MKH-60 mic c.) Senn Me66 mic d.) Lots 'o cables e.) PC with okay sound card. Input audio software can be SoundForge or Adobe Audition. f.) <$400 on a portable, field recording device. Questions (Yay! The fun stuff!) 1.) What types of mics have you guys used to record sound effects? Do you suggest these mics? Why? 2.) Novice Question: Any reason why I shouldn't use shotgun mics for sound effects recording? 3.) What kinda device/media should I record on? I've read on previous posts about different kinds of portable field recorders that use batteries: Things such as portable DAT and miniDisc recorders. Some of the discussions, even though they are kinda old, seem to be still relevant. Any news on whether or not folks are moving away from DAT and I should be looking at these palm-pilot-made-recorder stuff? 4.) In your experience is the recorder that you've worked with have a pretty good "path of least resistence" to getting your audio into your editors? I'd like to have something easy, so I can run out the door record some sounds, run back inside, snag 'em on my computer and add 'em in the movie. 5.) Big Novice Question: If I get a portable field recorder (say, a DAT or something), am I able to rig up my DXA-8 to use it's pre-amps/limiters without there being any line troubles? 6.) Any questions that I should be asking but I'm not? Let me know if something needs clarification. And, thanks for the help! You guys rock! Regards, Kyle "Doc" Mitchell

July 28th, 2004, 01:17 PM	#375
Joseph W. Carney Jr New Boot Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Boca Raton, Florida Posts: 14	Thanks! Thanks for the advice. I am not so much looking for water proof but something that will hold up to the salt air. I checked otu the AT and athe looks like the one i will go with.