All Things Audio -- topics from 2002 thru 2004

Jay Massengill · June 8th, 2004, 06:12 PM

The K6 module and most of the capsules that go with it are very sensitive. Generally you'd set the menu choice to -50db for sensitive mics but that may not be enough attenuation for loud situations with hot mics.
If you are recording in a quiet situation or you switch to a lower sensitivity mic, you can set it to -60db for additional gain.

Jeff Toogood · June 9th, 2004, 07:10 AM

Anybody know where I can get a reasonably cheap on-camera shock mount for my GL2?

Bryan Beasleigh · June 9th, 2004, 08:19 PM

There are only so many shock mounts in production and they range from $40 to several hundred Canadian. The biggie is going to getting it without getting killed by shipping or brokerage.

You could look at some US sites but you'll be paying big bucks for shipping and/or brokerage. the cheapest way is US post, the brokerage fee is only $5 at canada post and the shipping would be around $12.

Essentially you have the beyer dynamic at around $30 US, followed by the sennheiser at $30 and $50 US. These include a shoe mount.

The AT 8415 is $50 US or $75 canadian and the shoe adapter is another $10-14 US or 419 canadian.

You tell us your budget before i spend any more time. Meanwhile look at B&H in NY or DVshop.ca in Toronto.

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=NavBar&A=search&Q=&ci=1449

http://www.dvshop.ca/audio/mounts.html

Douglas Spotted Eagle · June 10th, 2004, 11:07 PM

SMPTE show in NYC next week at the Marriott Marquis hotel, Tuesday from 2:30 to (I think) 9:00 p.m.. Check out one of the most professional-oriented events in NYC. Usually a very cool show.
http://www.smpteny.com/smpteny/
Wish I could attend....enjoyed meeting a few of you in our NYC VASST.

Kevin King · June 13th, 2004, 11:03 PM

I'm a video editor. I got AA with the Adobe Video Collection about 4 months ago, and have been using it as my primary audio editor during this time. I am still very frustrated and highly inefficient using the program.

I have read the entire owner's manual cover to cover at least two times, and have spent hours looking over the help files, and still, I can't make this program do anything simply or quickly. The manual/files spends pages talking about the difference between destructive/non-destructive editing (which I understand perfectly), then jumps straight into Bandwidths, FFT's, Impulses and Bandpasses?!?!? I have no sound mastering background, so most of the terminology is a foregn language.

I need to do very simple things for video editing such as:

1. Limiting white noise from high gain on mics.

2. Limiting the hum of vehicle traffic in the background.

3. Dealing w/ verbal audio tracks where several people are speaking at different levels - the minister, bride, and groom, all at different levels and distances from the mics. I spend hours getting all the levels somewhat constant. Can I just say "average the clips at x db and the clips at y db, and normalize them all to 90%"? The manual never addresses this simple stuff.

4. Clicks/Pops - This is supposed to be such a wiz-bang tool, but I've never gotten it to work predictably. Often in my audio, there are obvious short, high spikes in the wave form. I'd LOVE to say "if it's over x db, and less than y diraction, consider it a click and fix it" - but no, I have to spend umpteen hours highlighting EACH spike, calling up the click/pop, and selecting "repair single click". I use the auto settings, but they either have no effect, or massively distort the entire clip.

5. Simple fades to different levels in wave edit. I have a quiet section that gets loud, then gets quiet again. I want to smoothly fade up, then back down, much like changing the levels keyframes in the multitrack, but I can't do this in wave edit. I have to select where i want it to ramp down, goto "amplitude", select the proper dB start and end, apply the effect, highlight the center perfectly, then highlight where I want to ramp back up and do the reverse - and if I'm off by so much as a couple samples in the highlight, there's an audiable click. Aufghglkdf!!!!!

I could go on and on. AA is obviously an extremely powerful program, and thus I want to keep using it. However, it is so horribly inefficient for what I use it for. Editing a ceremony with 3 mics takes me about 12 hours - about 5 of which is time spent jacking around with clips in AA.

I've tried so hard to learn this app and am so overwhealmed by it that I just don't know where to start. Can someone please direct me to some tutorials that address some of these simple tasks????

Douglas Spotted Eagle · June 14th, 2004, 07:14 AM

You're in luck. Ron Dabb's book on Audition addresses some specifics like this, although they're not exactly the same.
CMPBooks.com will have it, so will Amazon. Look for old Cool Edit Pro tut's too.

http://www.bbctraining.com/onlineCourse.asp?tID=2292&cat=2772

http://www.mp3-faq.org/tips/cepcass.htm

http://freewebhosting.hostdepartment.com/h/howtorecordaband/drums.html

Hope these help. I'm pretty familiar with Ron's book, I edited it, and there is lots of real-world experience in there.

Kevin Kimmell · June 18th, 2004, 08:22 AM

Hi there...

I'm going to be shooting some footage that will basically consist of two cameras and spontaneous action by people at live concerts/festivals.

Our cameras are Canon GLs (a 1 and a 2). I'm currently working on the best way to handle lighting and sound with the least amount of equipment and the least amount of need for extra power sources as we'll be driving around on a golf cart and randomly stopping to record and interview.

I've got the rudimentary lighting scheme pretty well figured out with flashlights and a possbile 12-volt to invertor setup.

Now I'm thinking about sound. My plan is to run a shockmounted AT822 Stereo mic directly into the GL2's mini port and a boom/stand mounted AT897 into the XLR box connected to the GL1. I'm trying to avoid needing to power a mixer and figure I can grab the best sound in post (or mix them if they both sound good).

I'm basically hoping for comments on this setup to see what you all think. Suggestions welcome for the sound setup and any additional ideas for "decent" lighting solutions.

Thanks,
Kevin

Douglas Spotted Eagle · June 18th, 2004, 09:32 PM

Sounds like you have the audio issues well under control. The mics are good mics, not sure about your flashlight setup, and not sure why you couldn't just use small softboxes running on 12volt dc, clamped to your golf cart. But, that's more a lighting forum question. The audio rig will/should work well. Make sure you have good windscreens of some sort if you're gonna be outdoors.

Mike Szabo · June 27th, 2004, 08:36 PM

I'm not on the level of most of you guys financially. I buy my equipment out of my own pocket and can't afford the best equipment.

That being said, I needed a shotgun mic to get better sound on my new Panasonic AG-DVC30. If you have to money to drop down on XLR adapters and higher end microphones then this doesn't concern you. I bought the Azden ECZ-990 because it was cheap and did what I needed it to do. If you are like me and are looking at buying one let me tell you a little about it:

*It is small, fits nicely on the bracket. It won't creep into shots like some longer shotgun mics.

*It has 2 settings, long and short. Long is more directional, short is better for picking up ambient sound.

*It has a pretty long, curly cord. It might get in the way if you are having to switch to and from handheld use.

*It did a much better job in boosting the levels of audio than the on-camera mic.

*I went outdoors and shot with it, and there was a very light wind blowing. It didn't do too well. The wind was flooding the audio and the levels were maxing out. Luckily the AGDVC-30 has a wind screen function built into the camera, once I turned that on the problem went away. It could possibly be fixed by a good windscreen, not sure though.

All in all, it's a decent mic for $50. If I could afford better I would get something else, but it gets the job done.

Bryan Beasleigh · June 27th, 2004, 10:34 PM

I too buy my own equipment, most here do.

I'm glad things worked out for you. So long as it does the job that's all you need. What is the diameter of the mic, you may be able to buy a cheapo wind screen that'll make life easier outside.

Douglas Spotted Eagle · June 28th, 2004, 08:20 PM

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg...glance&s=books

Thought I'd pass the info along. Very useful book, for Forge users and anyone on the PC editing audio. There is one chapter that is just dedicated to audio prep, so it's also somewhat useful for Peak users.

Kevin Galliford · June 29th, 2004, 09:48 AM

Hey,
You guys probably get tons of posts like this, but I tried searching, but I need your advice.

I have a GL2, and Im looking to but a Wireless system, both a Handheld, and a Lapel mic's.

I dont want to spent over 400.00 what do you recomend? I have a Azden WMPro now, but I'm selling it and going to get a better set.

I was thinking about 100LT? Or an Audiotechnica Pro-88w but their vhf ;-(. series. I guess I should go with UHV vs VHF is that a good choice?

Please help me out!

Mike Rehmus · June 29th, 2004, 09:13 PM

Very difficult to buy that much new equipment with your budget.

I'd not try VHF at all.

Best option might be something like the Sennheiser 100 kit with a lav and a plug-on transmitter. Then you would need a metal-body microphone to plug into. But the price will be about $500 plus the microphone.

I have a 100 setup that includes the lav, the plug-on and the Senn handheld microphone with integrated transmitter. Gotta say I like the plug-on because I can chose just about any microphone I want. It's just more flexible.

John C. Thompson · June 30th, 2004, 07:36 AM

Hey guys,

I am trying to make a decision on a wireless mic setup using 2 lapel mics and one receiver. Im looking at the Azden 221-LT. I think it is a new system? It consists of the 221R receiver and the 31LT lav with a bodypack. Im just wondering if anyone has used this system or should I just go with the WR22-Pro and 2 WL/T Pros? Any suggestions?

Chris Gray · July 3rd, 2004, 11:38 AM

I have a TRV80 with Azden SGMX short shotgun mounted on the camera. During normal to moderately loud scenes the sound is quite good. However, with loud sounds (such as yelling during a dramatic scene) there is a lot of distortion. To my knowledge the TRV80 doesn't have audio recording level adjustment, so I have to rely on the the unit's automatic capabilities.

Is this the microphone's fault or the camcorder (I noticed the same effect when hooking up the Azden to an older D8 camcorder, the TRV720).

I suspect it is the automatic level controls being overwhelmed, but can anyone confirm this?

June 9th, 2004, 07:10 AM	#317
Jeff Toogood Major Player Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: St.Thomas, Ontario, CANADA Posts: 428	Cheap On-Camera shock mount? Anybody know where I can get a reasonably cheap on-camera shock mount for my GL2? __________________ Toogood Studios

June 9th, 2004, 08:19 PM	#318
Bryan Beasleigh Trustee Join Date: May 2002 Location: Barrie, Ontario, Canada Posts: 1,922	There are only so many shock mounts in production and they range from $40 to several hundred Canadian. The biggie is going to getting it without getting killed by shipping or brokerage. You could look at some US sites but you'll be paying big bucks for shipping and/or brokerage. the cheapest way is US post, the brokerage fee is only $5 at canada post and the shipping would be around $12. Essentially you have the beyer dynamic at around $30 US, followed by the sennheiser at $30 and $50 US. These include a shoe mount. The AT 8415 is $50 US or $75 canadian and the shoe adapter is another $10-14 US or 419 canadian. You tell us your budget before i spend any more time. Meanwhile look at B&H in NY or DVshop.ca in Toronto. http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=NavBar&A=search&Q=&ci=1449 http://www.dvshop.ca/audio/mounts.html __________________ Life's journey is not to arrive at the grave safely in a well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, totally worn out, shouting ".......holy smokin rubber lips...what a ride!"

June 10th, 2004, 11:07 PM	#319
Douglas Spotted Eagle VASST Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Stockton, UT Posts: 5,648	SMPTE in NYC SMPTE show in NYC next week at the Marriott Marquis hotel, Tuesday from 2:30 to (I think) 9:00 p.m.. Check out one of the most professional-oriented events in NYC. Usually a very cool show. http://www.smpteny.com/smpteny/ Wish I could attend....enjoyed meeting a few of you in our NYC VASST. __________________ Douglas Spotted Eagle/Spot Author, producer, composer Certified Sony Vegas Trainer http://www.vasst.com

June 13th, 2004, 11:03 PM	#320
Kevin King Regular Crew Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Phoenix, AZ Posts: 88	Adobe Audition - For idiots and video guys?? Help?? I'm a video editor. I got AA with the Adobe Video Collection about 4 months ago, and have been using it as my primary audio editor during this time. I am still very frustrated and highly inefficient using the program. I have read the entire owner's manual cover to cover at least two times, and have spent hours looking over the help files, and still, I can't make this program do anything simply or quickly. The manual/files spends pages talking about the difference between destructive/non-destructive editing (which I understand perfectly), then jumps straight into Bandwidths, FFT's, Impulses and Bandpasses?!?!? I have no sound mastering background, so most of the terminology is a foregn language. I need to do very simple things for video editing such as: 1. Limiting white noise from high gain on mics. 2. Limiting the hum of vehicle traffic in the background. 3. Dealing w/ verbal audio tracks where several people are speaking at different levels - the minister, bride, and groom, all at different levels and distances from the mics. I spend hours getting all the levels somewhat constant. Can I just say "average the clips at x db and the clips at y db, and normalize them all to 90%"? The manual never addresses this simple stuff. 4. Clicks/Pops - This is supposed to be such a wiz-bang tool, but I've never gotten it to work predictably. Often in my audio, there are obvious short, high spikes in the wave form. I'd LOVE to say "if it's over x db, and less than y diraction, consider it a click and fix it" - but no, I have to spend umpteen hours highlighting EACH spike, calling up the click/pop, and selecting "repair single click". I use the auto settings, but they either have no effect, or massively distort the entire clip. 5. Simple fades to different levels in wave edit. I have a quiet section that gets loud, then gets quiet again. I want to smoothly fade up, then back down, much like changing the levels keyframes in the multitrack, but I can't do this in wave edit. I have to select where i want it to ramp down, goto "amplitude", select the proper dB start and end, apply the effect, highlight the center perfectly, then highlight where I want to ramp back up and do the reverse - and if I'm off by so much as a couple samples in the highlight, there's an audiable click. Aufghglkdf!!!!! I could go on and on. AA is obviously an extremely powerful program, and thus I want to keep using it. However, it is so horribly inefficient for what I use it for. Editing a ceremony with 3 mics takes me about 12 hours - about 5 of which is time spent jacking around with clips in AA. I've tried so hard to learn this app and am so overwhealmed by it that I just don't know where to start. Can someone please direct me to some tutorials that address some of these simple tasks????

June 14th, 2004, 07:14 AM	#321
Douglas Spotted Eagle VASST Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Stockton, UT Posts: 5,648	You're in luck. Ron Dabb's book on Audition addresses some specifics like this, although they're not exactly the same. CMPBooks.com will have it, so will Amazon. Look for old Cool Edit Pro tut's too. http://www.bbctraining.com/onlineCourse.asp?tID=2292&cat=2772 http://www.mp3-faq.org/tips/cepcass.htm http://freewebhosting.hostdepartment.com/h/howtorecordaband/drums.html Hope these help. I'm pretty familiar with Ron's book, I edited it, and there is lots of real-world experience in there. __________________ Douglas Spotted Eagle/Spot Author, producer, composer Certified Sony Vegas Trainer http://www.vasst.com

June 8th, 2004, 06:12 PM	#316
Jay Massengill Trustee Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Burlington Posts: 1,976	The K6 module and most of the capsules that go with it are very sensitive. Generally you'd set the menu choice to -50db for sensitive mics but that may not be enough attenuation for loud situations with hot mics. If you are recording in a quiet situation or you switch to a lower sensitivity mic, you can set it to -60db for additional gain.

June 18th, 2004, 08:22 AM	#322
Kevin Kimmell Major Player Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Akron, OH Posts: 209	Help w/mobile setup for golf-cart interviews Hi there... I'm going to be shooting some footage that will basically consist of two cameras and spontaneous action by people at live concerts/festivals. Our cameras are Canon GLs (a 1 and a 2). I'm currently working on the best way to handle lighting and sound with the least amount of equipment and the least amount of need for extra power sources as we'll be driving around on a golf cart and randomly stopping to record and interview. I've got the rudimentary lighting scheme pretty well figured out with flashlights and a possbile 12-volt to invertor setup. Now I'm thinking about sound. My plan is to run a shockmounted AT822 Stereo mic directly into the GL2's mini port and a boom/stand mounted AT897 into the XLR box connected to the GL1. I'm trying to avoid needing to power a mixer and figure I can grab the best sound in post (or mix them if they both sound good). I'm basically hoping for comments on this setup to see what you all think. Suggestions welcome for the sound setup and any additional ideas for "decent" lighting solutions. Thanks, Kevin

June 18th, 2004, 09:32 PM	#323
Douglas Spotted Eagle VASST Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Stockton, UT Posts: 5,648	Sounds like you have the audio issues well under control. The mics are good mics, not sure about your flashlight setup, and not sure why you couldn't just use small softboxes running on 12volt dc, clamped to your golf cart. But, that's more a lighting forum question. The audio rig will/should work well. Make sure you have good windscreens of some sort if you're gonna be outdoors. __________________ Douglas Spotted Eagle/Spot Author, producer, composer Certified Sony Vegas Trainer http://www.vasst.com

June 27th, 2004, 08:36 PM	#324
Mike Szabo New Boot Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Palm Beach Gardens, FL Posts: 9	About the Azden ECZ-990 I'm not on the level of most of you guys financially. I buy my equipment out of my own pocket and can't afford the best equipment. That being said, I needed a shotgun mic to get better sound on my new Panasonic AG-DVC30. If you have to money to drop down on XLR adapters and higher end microphones then this doesn't concern you. I bought the Azden ECZ-990 because it was cheap and did what I needed it to do. If you are like me and are looking at buying one let me tell you a little about it: It is small, fits nicely on the bracket. It won't creep into shots like some longer shotgun mics. It has 2 settings, long and short. Long is more directional, short is better for picking up ambient sound. It has a pretty long, curly cord. It might get in the way if you are having to switch to and from handheld use. It did a much better job in boosting the levels of audio than the on-camera mic. *I went outdoors and shot with it, and there was a very light wind blowing. It didn't do too well. The wind was flooding the audio and the levels were maxing out. Luckily the AGDVC-30 has a wind screen function built into the camera, once I turned that on the problem went away. It could possibly be fixed by a good windscreen, not sure though. All in all, it's a decent mic for $50. If I could afford better I would get something else, but it gets the job done.

June 27th, 2004, 10:34 PM	#325
Bryan Beasleigh Trustee Join Date: May 2002 Location: Barrie, Ontario, Canada Posts: 1,922	I too buy my own equipment, most here do. I'm glad things worked out for you. So long as it does the job that's all you need. What is the diameter of the mic, you may be able to buy a cheapo wind screen that'll make life easier outside. __________________ Life's journey is not to arrive at the grave safely in a well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, totally worn out, shouting ".......holy smokin rubber lips...what a ride!"

June 28th, 2004, 08:20 PM	#326
Douglas Spotted Eagle VASST Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Stockton, UT Posts: 5,648	Instant Sound Forge book now shipping http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg...glance&s=books Thought I'd pass the info along. Very useful book, for Forge users and anyone on the PC editing audio. There is one chapter that is just dedicated to audio prep, so it's also somewhat useful for Peak users. __________________ Douglas Spotted Eagle/Spot Author, producer, composer Certified Sony Vegas Trainer http://www.vasst.com

June 29th, 2004, 09:48 AM	#327
Kevin Galliford Regular Crew Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: USA Posts: 139	Wireless System Hey, You guys probably get tons of posts like this, but I tried searching, but I need your advice. I have a GL2, and Im looking to but a Wireless system, both a Handheld, and a Lapel mic's. I dont want to spent over 400.00 what do you recomend? I have a Azden WMPro now, but I'm selling it and going to get a better set. I was thinking about 100LT? Or an Audiotechnica Pro-88w but their vhf ;-(. series. I guess I should go with UHV vs VHF is that a good choice? Please help me out!

June 29th, 2004, 09:13 PM	#328
Mike Rehmus Wrangler Join Date: May 2002 Location: Vallejo, California Posts: 4,049	Very difficult to buy that much new equipment with your budget. I'd not try VHF at all. Best option might be something like the Sennheiser 100 kit with a lav and a plug-on transmitter. Then you would need a metal-body microphone to plug into. But the price will be about $500 plus the microphone. I have a 100 setup that includes the lav, the plug-on and the Senn handheld microphone with integrated transmitter. Gotta say I like the plug-on because I can chose just about any microphone I want. It's just more flexible. __________________ Mike Rehmus Hey, I can see the carrot at the end of the tunnel!

June 30th, 2004, 07:36 AM	#329
John C. Thompson New Boot Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Detroit Posts: 15	Azden Wireless Choices ?? Hey guys, I am trying to make a decision on a wireless mic setup using 2 lapel mics and one receiver. Im looking at the Azden 221-LT. I think it is a new system? It consists of the 221R receiver and the 31LT lav with a bodypack. Im just wondering if anyone has used this system or should I just go with the WR22-Pro and 2 WL/T Pros? Any suggestions? __________________ Johnny T. GL2, PC Vegas 5.0 + DVD, Photoshop 7.0 Nikon D100 Digital still pro setup Shooting nature, live music, sports, portraits

July 3rd, 2004, 11:38 AM	#330
Chris Gray New Boot Join Date: May 2004 Location: Toronto, Ontario Posts: 10	Distortion with loud sounds I have a TRV80 with Azden SGMX short shotgun mounted on the camera. During normal to moderately loud scenes the sound is quite good. However, with loud sounds (such as yelling during a dramatic scene) there is a lot of distortion. To my knowledge the TRV80 doesn't have audio recording level adjustment, so I have to rely on the the unit's automatic capabilities. Is this the microphone's fault or the camcorder (I noticed the same effect when hooking up the Azden to an older D8 camcorder, the TRV720). I suspect it is the automatic level controls being overwhelmed, but can anyone confirm this?