wireless boom issues at DVinfo.net

Josh Bass · December 14th, 2005, 07:56 PM

I have the Sennheiser G2 EVolution 100 system, and an ME66/K6 shotgun, and attempted to make a wireless boom today. It worked, but was very very noisy--I mean signal noise, not noise from actual. . uh. . .things.

I tried lowering the sensitivity on the transmitter, turning gain on camera and on my Beachteck DXA whatever XLR adapter (the one for the XL1s), tried it with and without the rycote softie, etc. Still very noisy.

Even when right next to my mouth, I wasn't getting much level. I had the attenuator in the XL1s off, had audio 1 set to "mic", had the switches on the beachtek set to mic, still same issue.

Now, I had to buy a 16ft XLR female to 14/" male cable, and then a 1/4" female to 1/8" male adapter, in order to hook the ME66 up to the transmitter. Is that too much stuff in the way? I went to radio shack and it was all they had, hence why I got it.

Anyway. . .what'd I do wrong? Thanks.

Guy Cochran · December 14th, 2005, 08:34 PM

Have you heard the SKP 100 wireless XLR plug on transmitter?

There is a short video in our "DVeStore Theatre" showing the SKP 100 with the ME66 hooked up to the XL1S and it sounds great.

Ty Ford · December 14th, 2005, 08:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Josh Bass

I have the Sennheiser G2 EVolution 100 system, and an ME66/K6 shotgun, and attempted to make a wireless boom today. It worked, but was very very noisy--I mean signal noise, not noise from actual. . uh. . .things.

I tried lowering the sensitivity on the transmitter, turning gain on camera and on my Beachteck DXA whatever XLR adapter (the one for the XL1s), tried it with and without the rycote softie, etc. Still very noisy.

Even when right next to my mouth, I wasn't getting much level. I had the attenuator in the XL1s off, had audio 1 set to "mic", had the switches on the beachtek set to mic, still same issue.

Now, I had to buy a 16ft XLR female to 14/" male cable, and then a 1/4" female to 1/8" male adapter, in order to hook the ME66 up to the transmitter. Is that too much stuff in the way? I went to radio shack and it was all they had, hence why I got it.

Anyway. . .what'd I do wrong? Thanks.

"The K6 powering module is the heart of this Sennheiser professional modular microphone system and can be powered either by its internal 'AA' size 1.5 V battery or by different condenser microphone modules to provide a wide variety of polar patterns."

Were you using a fresh battery?

Ty Ford

Josh Bass · December 14th, 2005, 10:40 PM

I may not have been. I know it was a working battery, don't know how far into its lifespan it was. Does that make a huge difference?

Ty Ford · December 15th, 2005, 04:57 AM

Few things run properly without the required power; including the wireless plugin module.

You can starve a mic into distotion, for example, by only providing it with 12 V Phantom when what it needs is 48 V phantom.

Regards,

Ty Ford

Josh Bass · December 15th, 2005, 05:45 AM

I'm not sure what you mean. . .I had batteries in the transmitter/receiver, and a battery in the ME66. It wasn't trying to run on phantom. Don't even know if it can with that setup.

If the battery was somewhat old, that's one thing, but I wasn't trying to do anything crazy.

Steve House · December 15th, 2005, 08:02 AM

I'd check the adapters going from the XLR cable to the Sennheiser transmetter to make sure everything is proper. I don't know about the Senn but check to see if the transmitter input is balanced or unbalanced? Are the converters to XLR to 1/4" and 1/4" to 1/8" using TS or TRS connectors? Are they wired properly for connecting a blanced mic to whatever input the tranmitter wants?

Josh Bass · December 15th, 2005, 02:04 PM

Is that info found in the manual for the G2 system?

Steve House · December 15th, 2005, 06:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Josh Bass

Is that info found in the manual for the G2 system?

Found it on page 91 o0f the manual I downloaded from the Sennheiser web site. There's a chart of connector assignments on the page. Says the mic input on the transmitter is expecting an unbalanced input.

Have you considered getting the plug-on transmitter module and connecting it directly to the ME66?

Jay Massengill · December 15th, 2005, 07:48 PM

I also think it was the cables you were using for the connection to the transmitter, probably causing phase cancellation between pins 2 and 3 of the mic. The cable should be wired so that those two opposite signals aren't being combined when sent to the transmitter input.

Guy Cochran · December 15th, 2005, 07:54 PM

Instead, cruise back over to Radio snak and get a 1/8" mini to RCA adapter. Feed the ME66/K6 to the BeachTek.
Feed the RCA's out of the BeachTek via the 1/8" mini to RCA adapter into the Sennheiser transmitter.

Now use the included 1/8" to 1/8" cable to plug the Sennheiser Receiver into where you would normally plug the XL1S stock mic.

Steve House · December 16th, 2005, 04:56 AM

Regarding adapters - In addition to the wiring of the adapter the miniplug connector on the trasmitter is a threaded jack and a conventional Radio Shack plug might not make good contact.

Trew Audio has a purpose built adapter for XLR specifically to a Sennheiser transmitter, part number CASENSK100XM48. See ..

http://www.trewaudio.com/catalog/items/item456.htm

Josh Bass · December 16th, 2005, 08:03 AM

Thanks. If I can find the $#@! receipt, I'll probably just return that stuff.

Robert Martens · December 16th, 2005, 11:34 AM

Okay, stupid question time! Audio is not my specialty (hell, neither is video), but have you tried using a different frequency? You said you're getting lots of noise, maybe the area you're shooting in has some interference on or around the one you started with...?

Not sure if that makes sense, but I do believe it's possible with wireless equipment.

Jay Massengill · December 16th, 2005, 01:36 PM

That is a possibility, you could test it out with your regular lav element attached to the transmitter and get everything working as normal through the receiver, the BeachTek and into the camera.
You'd need to adjust the transmitter input gain when switching between the lav and the ME66, but that would at least eliminate all the variables except the mic, the cables into the transmitter, and the transmitter input gain.
You could test the ME66 wired directly into your BeachTek, set to mic level, but probably dropping the rotary control down a click or two. Of course there will be a difference in level between the mic directly into the BeachTek and the receiver into the BeachTek at whatever output gain you have set on the receiver.
After that, the only thing left is the cable between the mic and transmitter, and fine tuning the gain settings.
If you still can't get a signal, I think it's definitely phase cancellation in your adapter cable. Consult that manual that Steve mentioned to find the right wiring.

December 14th, 2005, 07:56 PM	#1
Josh Bass Slash Rules! Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Houston, Texas Posts: 5,472	wireless boom issues I have the Sennheiser G2 EVolution 100 system, and an ME66/K6 shotgun, and attempted to make a wireless boom today. It worked, but was very very noisy--I mean signal noise, not noise from actual. . uh. . .things. I tried lowering the sensitivity on the transmitter, turning gain on camera and on my Beachteck DXA whatever XLR adapter (the one for the XL1s), tried it with and without the rycote softie, etc. Still very noisy. Even when right next to my mouth, I wasn't getting much level. I had the attenuator in the XL1s off, had audio 1 set to "mic", had the switches on the beachtek set to mic, still same issue. Now, I had to buy a 16ft XLR female to 14/" male cable, and then a 1/4" female to 1/8" male adapter, in order to hook the ME66 up to the transmitter. Is that too much stuff in the way? I went to radio shack and it was all they had, hence why I got it. Anyway. . .what'd I do wrong? Thanks. __________________ The Bass' camerawork The Bass on IMDB

December 14th, 2005, 08:34 PM	#2
Guy Cochran DVCreators.Net Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Seattle, WA Posts: 892	Have you heard the SKP 100 wireless XLR plug on transmitter? There is a short video in our "DVeStore Theatre" showing the SKP 100 with the ME66 hooked up to the XL1S and it sounds great. __________________ Guy Cochran DVinfo Sponsor, Cool Gear - DVeStore!

December 14th, 2005, 10:40 PM	#4
Josh Bass Slash Rules! Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Houston, Texas Posts: 5,472	I may not have been. I know it was a working battery, don't know how far into its lifespan it was. Does that make a huge difference? __________________ The Bass' camerawork The Bass on IMDB

December 15th, 2005, 04:57 AM	#5
Ty Ford Inner Circle Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Baltimore, MD USA Posts: 2,337	Few things run properly without the required power; including the wireless plugin module. You can starve a mic into distotion, for example, by only providing it with 12 V Phantom when what it needs is 48 V phantom. Regards, Ty Ford __________________ Ty Ford's Audio Bootcamp Field Guide Ty Ford's Audio Video Blog

December 15th, 2005, 05:45 AM	#6
Josh Bass Slash Rules! Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Houston, Texas Posts: 5,472	I'm not sure what you mean. . .I had batteries in the transmitter/receiver, and a battery in the ME66. It wasn't trying to run on phantom. Don't even know if it can with that setup. If the battery was somewhat old, that's one thing, but I wasn't trying to do anything crazy. __________________ The Bass' camerawork The Bass on IMDB

December 15th, 2005, 08:02 AM	#7
Steve House Inner Circle Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Hamilton, Ontario, Canada Posts: 5,742	I'd check the adapters going from the XLR cable to the Sennheiser transmetter to make sure everything is proper. I don't know about the Senn but check to see if the transmitter input is balanced or unbalanced? Are the converters to XLR to 1/4" and 1/4" to 1/8" using TS or TRS connectors? Are they wired properly for connecting a blanced mic to whatever input the tranmitter wants? __________________ Good news, Cousins! This week's chocolate ration is 15 grams!

December 15th, 2005, 02:04 PM	#8
Josh Bass Slash Rules! Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Houston, Texas Posts: 5,472	Is that info found in the manual for the G2 system? __________________ The Bass' camerawork The Bass on IMDB

December 15th, 2005, 07:48 PM	#10
Jay Massengill Trustee Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Burlington Posts: 1,976	I also think it was the cables you were using for the connection to the transmitter, probably causing phase cancellation between pins 2 and 3 of the mic. The cable should be wired so that those two opposite signals aren't being combined when sent to the transmitter input.

December 15th, 2005, 07:54 PM	#11
Guy Cochran DVCreators.Net Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Seattle, WA Posts: 892	Instead, cruise back over to Radio snak and get a 1/8" mini to RCA adapter. Feed the ME66/K6 to the BeachTek. Feed the RCA's out of the BeachTek via the 1/8" mini to RCA adapter into the Sennheiser transmitter. Now use the included 1/8" to 1/8" cable to plug the Sennheiser Receiver into where you would normally plug the XL1S stock mic. __________________ Guy Cochran DVinfo Sponsor, Cool Gear - DVeStore!

December 16th, 2005, 04:56 AM	#12
Steve House Inner Circle Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Hamilton, Ontario, Canada Posts: 5,742	Regarding adapters - In addition to the wiring of the adapter the miniplug connector on the trasmitter is a threaded jack and a conventional Radio Shack plug might not make good contact. Trew Audio has a purpose built adapter for XLR specifically to a Sennheiser transmitter, part number CASENSK100XM48. See .. http://www.trewaudio.com/catalog/items/item456.htm __________________ Good news, Cousins! This week's chocolate ration is 15 grams!

December 16th, 2005, 08:03 AM	#13
Josh Bass Slash Rules! Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Houston, Texas Posts: 5,472	Thanks. If I can find the $#@! receipt, I'll probably just return that stuff. __________________ The Bass' camerawork The Bass on IMDB

December 16th, 2005, 11:34 AM	#14
Robert Martens Major Player Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Miller Place, NY Posts: 820	Okay, stupid question time! Audio is not my specialty (hell, neither is video), but have you tried using a different frequency? You said you're getting lots of noise, maybe the area you're shooting in has some interference on or around the one you started with...? Not sure if that makes sense, but I do believe it's possible with wireless equipment.

December 16th, 2005, 01:36 PM	#15
Jay Massengill Trustee Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Burlington Posts: 1,976	That is a possibility, you could test it out with your regular lav element attached to the transmitter and get everything working as normal through the receiver, the BeachTek and into the camera. You'd need to adjust the transmitter input gain when switching between the lav and the ME66, but that would at least eliminate all the variables except the mic, the cables into the transmitter, and the transmitter input gain. You could test the ME66 wired directly into your BeachTek, set to mic level, but probably dropping the rotary control down a click or two. Of course there will be a difference in level between the mic directly into the BeachTek and the receiver into the BeachTek at whatever output gain you have set on the receiver. After that, the only thing left is the cable between the mic and transmitter, and fine tuning the gain settings. If you still can't get a signal, I think it's definitely phase cancellation in your adapter cable. Consult that manual that Steve mentioned to find the right wiring.