Acoustic Theory at DVinfo.net

Jon Fairhurst · July 8th, 2015, 05:23 PM

I'm interested in recommendations on books/papers/websites on acoustically treating rooms.

I'm remodeling a daylight basement as a multipurpose AV, music, whatever room. It's roughly 25 x 15 x 8, which isn't far from dimensions of 3x2x1, which would be terrible. At least it's not a perfect cube...

I've just added a wood floor. The room has some small windows and a sliding glass door. With the bookshelves removed it's a real echo box.

I've purchased some Corning 703 panels and will use burlap covering as a design element in the room. I will also be building in some new bookshelves, which work great as diffusers and bass traps - simply pull the books out from the back a bit to leave space and stagger them to diffuse the sound.

The thing about the 703 panels is that I'm not sure how many would be optimal. Use none and the room is too live. Surround yourself in them and it's too dead. So what's the correct balance?

Anyway, this is for a residential room and it's a budget, DIY project. I don't need perfection here, but I'd rather be a bit more informed so that I'm not just randomly adding treatment and saying, "hey, that sounds better. Well, maybe..."

Thanks in advance!

Jim Michael · July 8th, 2015, 07:30 PM

Lots of info here https://www.gearslutz.com/board/stud...look-here.html

Andrew Smith · July 9th, 2015, 06:07 AM

This is also worth a watch: Studio Rescue | Do you need your studio rescued?

Andrew

Andrew Smith · July 9th, 2015, 06:12 AM

.. and here, too.

Andrew

Paul Cronin · July 10th, 2015, 07:45 AM

Jon, I had the same thought years ago and found, Auralex Acoustics | Total Sound Control

They helped me design a room 8' x 15' that is so dry you feel your voice ends 6" from the mouth. My reason for the sound proof dry room was so I can play my drums and not bug the neighbors. It took years before my closest neighbor knew I was playing.

I built it myself over a week. It is so heavy I needed to reinforce the structure under it. Soundproof floor, moving soundproof walls and ceiling with their 1/8" material and standard building materials, base traps in the corners, mid-range foam on the walls and ceiling and diffusers on the ceiling. Not cheap, but you can go many levels and I am sure not have to go to the extreme I went. For me when I am in they’re with a bass guitar and rhythm guitar we need all the extremes I went through on the build. A must is hearing protection if you exceed 80db.

And since then I have used it to record not just music but narrative, interviews, and it is a dream to use. You have full control over the sound and if you ever want to know which is the better mic, this room will show it quickly.

I suggest you go to their site and read a lot of the free info and then contact them directly. They are dialed.

Auralex Acoustics | Total Sound Control

Hope this helps.

Seth Bloombaum · July 10th, 2015, 11:21 AM

Jon, I'm interested to know where you sourced 703 in the area? I've recently heard that Pure Distribution has it, though I tried a few years ago to find it locally and wasn't able to find it except in cut panels via UPS/Freight... which seemed much to costly. A local-ish source would be much appreciated if you have it!

I've seen Live End / Dead End (LEDE) applied in studios as an end of the room that is pretty dead, the other end live and diffuse. Peformers/instruments are then placed to one end or the other to balance by ear. I've seen the same techniques applied in control rooms / mixing rooms, dead at the front, live and diffuse behind.

Frequency diffusion is accomplished via QRD Diffusors (see here and here).

Jon Fairhurst · July 10th, 2015, 02:45 PM

Thanks all!

Seth, I purchased my materials online. Yeah, shipping costs nearly as much as the material. Oh well.

BTW, I posted the same question over at V I Control (the go-to forum for film composers), and got some additional detailed answers. One poster offered a large list of books. Rather than copy his post here, I'll copy one, key sentence:

> "Where to start? That is a bit tougher, but I guess Sound System Engineering (Don Davis), Project Studios (Philip Newell), Studio Acoustics (Michael Rettinger), Building a Recording Studion (Jeff Cooper) and Audio System Design and Installation (Philip Giddings) would be my first pass."

Great stuff!

Fran Guidry · July 17th, 2015, 03:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Seth Bloombaum

Jon, I'm interested to know where you sourced 703 in the area? ...

Commercial/Mechanical/HVAC insulation suppliers have it, they are kinda under the radar but around.

I found a thread from a few years ago on Gearslutz:

https://www.gearslutz.com/board/so-m...-portland.html

Fran

Jon Fairhurst · July 21st, 2015, 11:58 AM

Thanks Fran! I expect to need more panels and it will really help the bottom line to get a local supply.

FWIW, here are some photos of the room in progress...

Jon Fairhurst - Remodeling Photos

Seth Bloombaum · July 21st, 2015, 01:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jon Fairhurst

...I expect to need more panels and it will really help the bottom line to get a local supply...

I tried to go through all the HVAC suppliers in the Portland area a couple years ago, and ended up having to switch to loose rockwool rather than panels. I was making traps, so the product was fine. Couldn't find 703 over the counter. There was a new supplier just being set up in Seattle at that time.

But then I visited a college studio here, and got to talking with the systems engineer. He'd sourced it from Pure Distribution in NW industrial Portland. Haven't had to check that out yet, but I'm hopeful that will turn out to be a good lead.

Maybe you'll get there first, Jon. If so, do let me know!

Regarding HVAC suppliers; large jobs order on lengthy timelines, small jobs typically use soft materials for wrapping ductwork which is more readily available.

What I'd love to try is rockwool panels. They're competitive with 703/704, but no outgassing of formaldehyde, which is a component of the glue used to make the fiberglass rigid in 703. The smell dissipates after a while...

And yes. It's ridiculous to have to UPS half-panels or quarter-panels for a medium or large treatment. I'm not willing to pay the freight! It's like shipping 2x4s, but let's cut them down to fit in a UPS truck...

July 8th, 2015, 05:23 PM	#1
Jon Fairhurst Inner Circle Join Date: May 2006 Location: Camas, WA, USA Posts: 5,513	Acoustic Theory I'm interested in recommendations on books/papers/websites on acoustically treating rooms. I'm remodeling a daylight basement as a multipurpose AV, music, whatever room. It's roughly 25 x 15 x 8, which isn't far from dimensions of 3x2x1, which would be terrible. At least it's not a perfect cube... I've just added a wood floor. The room has some small windows and a sliding glass door. With the bookshelves removed it's a real echo box. I've purchased some Corning 703 panels and will use burlap covering as a design element in the room. I will also be building in some new bookshelves, which work great as diffusers and bass traps - simply pull the books out from the back a bit to leave space and stagger them to diffuse the sound. The thing about the 703 panels is that I'm not sure how many would be optimal. Use none and the room is too live. Surround yourself in them and it's too dead. So what's the correct balance? Anyway, this is for a residential room and it's a budget, DIY project. I don't need perfection here, but I'd rather be a bit more informed so that I'm not just randomly adding treatment and saying, "hey, that sounds better. Well, maybe..." Thanks in advance! __________________ Jon Fairhurst

July 8th, 2015, 07:30 PM	#2
Jim Michael Major Player Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 895	Re: Acoustic Theory Lots of info here https://www.gearslutz.com/board/stud...look-here.html

July 9th, 2015, 06:07 AM	#3
Andrew Smith Equal Opportunity Offender Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Brisbane, Australia Posts: 3,066	Re: Acoustic Theory This is also worth a watch: Studio Rescue \| Do you need your studio rescued? Andrew

July 9th, 2015, 06:12 AM	#4
Andrew Smith Equal Opportunity Offender Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Brisbane, Australia Posts: 3,066	Re: Acoustic Theory .. and here, too. Studio Rescue: Episode 1 - YouTube Andrew

July 10th, 2015, 07:45 AM	#5
Paul Cronin Inner Circle Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Rhode Island Posts: 4,048	Re: Acoustic Theory Jon, I had the same thought years ago and found, Auralex Acoustics \| Total Sound Control They helped me design a room 8' x 15' that is so dry you feel your voice ends 6" from the mouth. My reason for the sound proof dry room was so I can play my drums and not bug the neighbors. It took years before my closest neighbor knew I was playing. I built it myself over a week. It is so heavy I needed to reinforce the structure under it. Soundproof floor, moving soundproof walls and ceiling with their 1/8" material and standard building materials, base traps in the corners, mid-range foam on the walls and ceiling and diffusers on the ceiling. Not cheap, but you can go many levels and I am sure not have to go to the extreme I went. For me when I am in they’re with a bass guitar and rhythm guitar we need all the extremes I went through on the build. A must is hearing protection if you exceed 80db. And since then I have used it to record not just music but narrative, interviews, and it is a dream to use. You have full control over the sound and if you ever want to know which is the better mic, this room will show it quickly. I suggest you go to their site and read a lot of the free info and then contact them directly. They are dialed. Auralex Acoustics \| Total Sound Control Hope this helps. __________________ Paul Cronin www.paulcroninstudios.com Last edited by Paul Cronin; July 10th, 2015 at 11:33 AM.

July 10th, 2015, 11:21 AM	#6
Seth Bloombaum Inner Circle Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Portland, Oregon Posts: 3,420	Re: Acoustic Theory Jon, I'm interested to know where you sourced 703 in the area? I've recently heard that Pure Distribution has it, though I tried a few years ago to find it locally and wasn't able to find it except in cut panels via UPS/Freight... which seemed much to costly. A local-ish source would be much appreciated if you have it! I've seen Live End / Dead End (LEDE) applied in studios as an end of the room that is pretty dead, the other end live and diffuse. Peformers/instruments are then placed to one end or the other to balance by ear. I've seen the same techniques applied in control rooms / mixing rooms, dead at the front, live and diffuse behind. Frequency diffusion is accomplished via QRD Diffusors (see here and here). __________________ 30 years of pro media production. Vegas user since 1.0. Webcaster since 1997. Freelancer since 2000. College instructor since 2001.

July 10th, 2015, 02:45 PM	#7
Jon Fairhurst Inner Circle Join Date: May 2006 Location: Camas, WA, USA Posts: 5,513	Re: Acoustic Theory Thanks all! Seth, I purchased my materials online. Yeah, shipping costs nearly as much as the material. Oh well. BTW, I posted the same question over at V I Control (the go-to forum for film composers), and got some additional detailed answers. One poster offered a large list of books. Rather than copy his post here, I'll copy one, key sentence: > "Where to start? That is a bit tougher, but I guess Sound System Engineering (Don Davis), Project Studios (Philip Newell), Studio Acoustics (Michael Rettinger), Building a Recording Studion (Jeff Cooper) and Audio System Design and Installation (Philip Giddings) would be my first pass." Great stuff! __________________ Jon Fairhurst

July 21st, 2015, 11:58 AM	#9
Jon Fairhurst Inner Circle Join Date: May 2006 Location: Camas, WA, USA Posts: 5,513	Re: Acoustic Theory Thanks Fran! I expect to need more panels and it will really help the bottom line to get a local supply. FWIW, here are some photos of the room in progress... Jon Fairhurst - Remodeling Photos __________________ Jon Fairhurst