Can xlr channels be swapped? at DVinfo.net

Nick Mirro · November 28th, 2012, 06:21 PM

Seems like a no brainer, but this is the first xlr mic I've used, so no brains is about where I am on this :-)

Is there any reason not to switch the XLR inputs to opposite channels and then turn the mic so it faces backwards? That way left stays left but then the mic is closer to my mouth.

The cam is a Canon XA10 and the mic is a stereo Sony ECM-MS2. Thanks.

Richard Crowley · November 28th, 2012, 07:23 PM

As a purely technical question, you are absolutely correct, the channels can be switched to preserve the "soundstage". Or, most video editing software provides a way of doing this after the fact, also, so there is more than one way to accomplish this.

As an artistic question whether that is the right microphone or a proper application, you will have to be the judge of that.

Nick Mirro · November 28th, 2012, 09:00 PM

Thanks. Mic looks funny but it will work for now. Just wanted to make sure there was nothing about the balancing or phase that would be upset. Good news.

Sareesh Sudhakaran · November 28th, 2012, 09:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nick Mirro

Is there any reason not to switch the XLR inputs to opposite channels and then turn the mic so it faces backwards?

No reason at all, but like Richard said: Why not do it in post? A microphone has a defined polar pattern, so you might want to keep it oriented the 'right' way.

Nick Mirro · November 28th, 2012, 10:08 PM

Yes I will definitely be using that. Appreciated! For now I am just trying to get the understand the mic characteristics.

Funny thing, the mic creates a low frequency distortion with voice. Guess I noticed it when moving it closer to my mouth. Don't intend to use it for long for voice, since that is not its purpose. I found that with the current arrangement, the camcorder attenuator is needed to get the sound clean. Then I turn up the volume on playback.

Is that right?

Don Bloom · November 28th, 2012, 10:27 PM

Nick,
Want to learn about audio? Then invest in Ty Fords or Jay Roses book. they can answer all of your questions. not that the guys and gals here can't but those books are great guides to keep handy and read all the time.

Steve House · November 29th, 2012, 06:43 AM

FYI your 'low frequency distortion' is an illustration of a characteristic of directional mics called 'the proximity effect." It is an inherent behavior of all directional mics to a greater or lesser extent. The ECM-MS2 is a mid/side stereo mic that consists of two capsules, a directional cardioid capsule for the 'mid' portion and a figure-8 capsule for the side. When the mic is close to the sound source, the mid cardioid capsule will start to exhibit this proximity effect which manifests itself as a boost in bass response. The closer it is to the source, the more pronounced will be the bass boost.

Nick Mirro · November 29th, 2012, 10:57 AM

Just ordered one of Ty's books in very good condition for 2.99. :-) Thanks for the tip.

Does the low freq distortion apply to lapel type mics? I am obtaining an Azden 3 channel field mixer in the coming weeks in order to add the extra channel. Wondering if I will have to deal with a few possible issues.

Will the 3rd channel for voice mix poorly with the vocal that the stereo Sony picks up?
Are clothing and moving around noises a problem for lapel mics?

Richard Crowley · November 29th, 2012, 11:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nick Mirro

Does the low freq distortion apply to lapel type mics?

"low frequency distortion" isn't really defined well enough for us to understand what you are talking about. IF you are talking about "proximity effect" then most directional mics suffer from varying degrees. But proximity effect is not typically a major issue with lapel mics.

Quote:

Will the 3rd channel for voice mix poorly with the vocal that the stereo Sony picks up?

That depends on the particular situation. Without more specific details, that question is impossible to answer.

Quote:

Are clothing and moving around noises a problem for lapel mics?

Yes, They can be. But there are ways of mitigating the problem.

November 28th, 2012, 06:21 PM	#1
Nick Mirro Regular Crew Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Dallas, Texas Posts: 119	Can xlr channels be swapped? Seems like a no brainer, but this is the first xlr mic I've used, so no brains is about where I am on this :-) Is there any reason not to switch the XLR inputs to opposite channels and then turn the mic so it faces backwards? That way left stays left but then the mic is closer to my mouth. The cam is a Canon XA10 and the mic is a stereo Sony ECM-MS2. Thanks.

November 28th, 2012, 07:23 PM	#2
Richard Crowley Trustee Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Portland, Oregon Posts: 1,238	Re: Can xlr channels be swapped? As a purely technical question, you are absolutely correct, the channels can be switched to preserve the "soundstage". Or, most video editing software provides a way of doing this after the fact, also, so there is more than one way to accomplish this. As an artistic question whether that is the right microphone or a proper application, you will have to be the judge of that.

November 28th, 2012, 09:00 PM	#3
Nick Mirro Regular Crew Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Dallas, Texas Posts: 119	Re: Can xlr channels be swapped? Thanks. Mic looks funny but it will work for now. Just wanted to make sure there was nothing about the balancing or phase that would be upset. Good news.

November 28th, 2012, 10:08 PM	#5
Nick Mirro Regular Crew Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Dallas, Texas Posts: 119	Re: Can xlr channels be swapped? Yes I will definitely be using that. Appreciated! For now I am just trying to get the understand the mic characteristics. Funny thing, the mic creates a low frequency distortion with voice. Guess I noticed it when moving it closer to my mouth. Don't intend to use it for long for voice, since that is not its purpose. I found that with the current arrangement, the camcorder attenuator is needed to get the sound clean. Then I turn up the volume on playback. Is that right?

November 28th, 2012, 10:27 PM	#6
Don Bloom Inner Circle Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 6,609	Re: Can xlr channels be swapped? Nick, Want to learn about audio? Then invest in Ty Fords or Jay Roses book. they can answer all of your questions. not that the guys and gals here can't but those books are great guides to keep handy and read all the time. __________________ What do I know? I'm just a video-O-grafer. Don

November 29th, 2012, 06:43 AM	#7
Steve House Inner Circle Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Hamilton, Ontario, Canada Posts: 5,742	Re: Can xlr channels be swapped? FYI your 'low frequency distortion' is an illustration of a characteristic of directional mics called 'the proximity effect." It is an inherent behavior of all directional mics to a greater or lesser extent. The ECM-MS2 is a mid/side stereo mic that consists of two capsules, a directional cardioid capsule for the 'mid' portion and a figure-8 capsule for the side. When the mic is close to the sound source, the mid cardioid capsule will start to exhibit this proximity effect which manifests itself as a boost in bass response. The closer it is to the source, the more pronounced will be the bass boost. __________________ Good news, Cousins! This week's chocolate ration is 15 grams!

November 29th, 2012, 10:57 AM	#8
Nick Mirro Regular Crew Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Dallas, Texas Posts: 119	Re: Can xlr channels be swapped? Just ordered one of Ty's books in very good condition for 2.99. :-) Thanks for the tip. Does the low freq distortion apply to lapel type mics? I am obtaining an Azden 3 channel field mixer in the coming weeks in order to add the extra channel. Wondering if I will have to deal with a few possible issues. Will the 3rd channel for voice mix poorly with the vocal that the stereo Sony picks up? Are clothing and moving around noises a problem for lapel mics?