What to buy for 700 frequency replacement?

[Paul Cronin]

I have to replace my trusty two Samson UHF Micro 32 wireless systems due to the new 700 Frequency restrictions starting this weekend.

The last two times with this system I had problems with new interference in cities, so it is time to replace this system. I will sell the system to someone in Europe since they do not have the same problem/restrictions. It really works well when it is legal.

I need two wireless lavs, and at times one handheld and one lav. I have looked into the new Sony Digital drop in for my F800 but this restricts use to only that camera. And at times I will use it on my EX1 and other cameras so better to have system I can move between cameras.

Question:
So what to buy to replace it?

[Don Bloom]

Well if $ is no object then I'd go with the Lectro digitals but if money is a concern you might look into the Audio Technica 18XX. It's a dual channel diversity receiver, you can get 2 body paks and a plug in (that's what I have) and you're all set. They run 655 to 680 mhz, the receiver allows you to mix mic 1 and 2 at the receiver or of course you can run them seperately. You WILL have to replace the stock mics as they really arent any good but Countryman and I think Sanken have connections that'll work. The receiver uses miniXLR connections TA3F and the cables are only 18 inches but it's easy enough to make onger cables if you need to although because of the smaller connection to the receiver the cables are quite thin, not a standard XLR thickness but I can atest to the fact they are quite sturdy. I've had the unit for over 2 years and haven't had any problems with the unit or cables. You can also adjust the levels on the receiver although it isn't quite as precise as control on the camera.
There are some people that say it's got too much floor noise but honestly I haven't really noticed it and when it does show it's ugly head it's quite easy to remove in post. A little EQ and it's done.
Overall, for the money I don't think you can go wrong.

[Paul Cronin]

Hi Don,

I thought you might jump in and set me on the right track. The Lectro is cheaper then the Sony but both are more money then the sound is worth in my opinion.

I will check with Charles at Abel Cine Tech about the Audio Technica 18xx and two body packs. I know you said 1821 in a previous post is that the best option? And Countryman or Sanken mics.

I would think 18" cables are OK, my current ones are 29" and always seemed long.

[Don Bloom]

Hi Paul,
IIRC the 1821 comes with 2 body paks but there are other designations that offer 2 plugins or 1 body pak and 1 plugin so I might be wrong on the designator number. When I got mine I got 2 body paks and bought the plugin seperately but in any case the money for all of them not counting the mics was about $1500 or so. The mics of course are a different horse. I use the Countryman EMWs with shelved response and have been quite happy with them although the pattern is a bit wider than I would really like but overall very happy with them. If I had had more cash flow I might have either gotten the B3s or Sanken COS-11s but as we all know this business is a money pit so we do what we can with what we got. ;-)

If you do get the AT unit and need any help with the units let me know.

[Paul Cronin]

Don interesting how some of the reviews rave about the 1821 and some say the floor noise is just not worth it. Either way I have Charles checking on the 1821 and also Sennheiser Evolution G3 100 Series - Wireless Microphone Combo.

The business is a money pit and the manufactures are going to make sure it stays that way, so the big boys can keep their bonus checks coming.

I will post what I buy and my thoughts on its performance.

Thank you for your quick responses.

[Paul Cronin]

Don, have you ever used the Sennheiser EW 112P G3 Portable Camera Mount Set? Not sure if the AT1821 is worth $700 more then two of the Sennheiser 112 G3 systems?

[Don Bloom]

Paul,
I haven't used them but I'm curious as to how you got the number $700 more?

2 Senns that you described are $600 each, thats $1200 the AT 1821 with 2 body paks is $1165 at B&H (after you add to cart for lower price) so they're really about ths same money. Now I'm not taking into account the plugin transmitter of handheld mic nor any replaement mics for the body paks but based on base price only, it seems like a push. Now you need to decide which you prefer. ;-)

[Paul Cronin]

Thanks Don I thought you might have tried them at some point.

As for pricing I priced the AT1821 and two countryman mics since they are needed at $1550 no plug in transmitter. You are right I had not add to the cart for the additional discount but it is still a $600 difference since two 112 G3 are $950 with discount.

I will make my choice but was just wondering if the AT1821 is that much better sound? Will do a little more research then decide.

[Don Bloom]

That just seems like a lot of bucks difference but I guess it is. Which Countryman mics did you add in and did you add them into the Senns? There are less expensive options for mics made by AT. It just seems like a hugh money difference. As for sound difference, I honestly can't say. I have used the Senn G1s a long time ago and they did sound pretty good but the main reason I went with the AT is simplicity. I unit 2 mics. As for the floor noise I think some people that complained were looking for $4000 sound for $1200 and the noise really is very minimal at least to my ears.
Well good luck in you choice, I'm sure you can't go wrong in either case.

[Paul Cronin]

I forget which mic I priced I am not by the info. I did not add mics to the Senns I was told they do not need it.

Agree I am not expecting the sound I would get from Lectro or Sony but most won't notice. And if the sound is that critical there will be a sound person on the set.

I think I might go for the Senns and save the bucks. One unit on the back of the camera is a nice idea but the money difference is just too much.

[Rick Reineke]

Pros and Cons to both systems in how your going to be using them Paul.
In my opinion the G3 has a nicer and more informative user interface and is 'a little' quieter, however having two receivers in a single housing is handy. The AT has a HP out, the 112's receiver doesn't, if that's an issue.
I would suggest downloading the user manuals which could offer additional info, such as ease of scan/frequency selection, mic gain adj., ect., ect., ect.
I agree with Don, "I'm sure you can't go wrong in either case"
If money is an issue, I believe both system come with 'usable quality' mics so you could purchase better mics at a later date.

[Paul Cronin]

Thanks Rick for the input. I have looked through both manuals and feel the G3 will work for me.

[Greg Bellotte]

No matter what you end up purchasing, take the time to learn how to get the best out of it. Learn and understand things like squelch, pilot tone, gain structure, frequency selection, etc. If you are hoping that buying a wireless will just keep you from having to run 20 feet of audio cable you will be sorely disappointed at some point. Most of the trouble I see with wireless is user error. Sorry to sound preachy, but I think a little education goes a long way with wireless. Good luck with you new mics!

[Paul Cronin]

Thanks Greg,

Yes a bit preachy but I get you point. I am trained in Marine radios, SSB, and others so I agree people should always dial in their gear not just wireless. Squelch, tone, gain, and frequency for each given location is a must. This can take 5 min or 30 min depending on location.

As for being more then 20' with out a wire well I have to disagree on that one. I have used my current wireless system on the water in chase boats more then 50 times with the other end on a boat up to 300' away with great success. But again it is knowing your gear and it limitations.

Thanks for the post education is always the way to go.