Best Audio Equipment For HMC150

[Anthony Nguyen]

Hey guys i just recently joined this site and have learned so much. I recently just bought a new Panasonic Hmc150 and Im now looking to buy some audio equipment for the cam. I have a budget of around 1000 to spend. I always usually film indoors and occasionally will film outside. What would be a good mic to buy for the camera? I have also read up about mixers but not entirely sure if its worth buying. Any info would be appreciated.

[Kevin Walsh]

Hi Anthony and welcome to the forum. Take a look at the stickies at the top of "All things Audio" there is one called "Audio Forum Frequently Asked Questions" This may have the answer to your question.
If not, try to be as specific as possible about what types of things you will be shooting. (Outdoor wedding, Corporate training video with a voice over, Documentary on the NYC transit system etc.) IMHO buying audio equipment is much harder than picking out a new camera, so the more you learn before you drop that thousand bucks the happier you will be.

[Anthony Nguyen]

I mainly shoot short films. I was thinking on buying a shotgun but dont really know which would be the right one to buy. Maybe there are some suggestions on here.

[Michael Nistler]

Hi Anthony,

I don't poke in these threads much lately but wanted to give a quickie response. For short films, I imagine you won't want to confine yourself to close shots. So no shotgun or other on-camera mic will meet your needs. When you do medium and wide shots, you need to either cable or use wireless/lavalier to mics to record decent audio from your subject (google audio proximity effect, etc to learn more).

Happy trails, Michael

[Anthony Nguyen]

So I was looking at Sennheiser ME66 Shotgun mics and i think im deciding to get this. Do you guys think it would be better to invest in a mixer like sd302 or get the shotgun mic first?

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/73100-REG/Sennheiser_ME66_K6_COMBO_ME66_K6_Super_Cardioid_Mic.html

[Garrett Low]

Hi Anthony,

By "short films" what type of films do you mean? narrative or documentaries? Unfortunately there isn't one mic that will work for all situations. I also shoot films as well as event videos.

When shooting films I usually rely on the sound guy to bring all the sound gear but I do have an ME66 which I use when needed. As Michael mentioned, if at all possible you do not want to have the mic on the camera. You'll also need a boom pole (and of course a boom operator on your shoots).

I'd disagree with Michael on the Lav mic though. I just did a shoot this last weekend and our sound man described wireless lavs as the "Devil's spawn". There's a couple reasons, one is they are almost impossible to hide and not have them pick up some noise from some clothes rubbing against it. Also, with wireless, you always run the risk of picking up some interference. going wireless is the last resort for film making. Typically you'll have on or more mics on booms wired.

As far as the mixer, the SD302 is an excellent mixer but it will do you no good if you don't have a mic to plug into it. So get the mic, boom pole and a good 25' and 50' cable first. Another thing, you as the camera operator will not be able to also mix levels while shooting. So the mixer will most likely have better mic preamps than your camera but it is not essential.

You'll also need some kind of wind protection if you shoot outdoors. At the very least the foam windscreen is a good thing to have on. At the least I keep the foam on so I don't pick up wind noise on mic moves (yes that has happened to me in rapid paced scenes). It also is a lot easier to notice when you get a mic dip. Black mics against a dark background sometimes sneak by during production and then when you see it in post you just start cursing yourself for not noticing it during filming.

The ME66 is a good mic and pretty much a go to for a lot of independent film makers. If you can stretch a little I really like the sound from the Rode NTG-3 or if you can swing a lot the Senn MKH-416 is one of the industry standbys. I've gotten to work with this mic on numerous projects and can say it is a vast improvement over other mics I've used.

No matter what mic you use though, the key is mic placement. You need a good boom op who knows what they're doing to get good sound. I've even heard a Schoeps sound bad in the wrong hands.

Garrett

[Anthony Nguyen]

Hey Garret thanks for your insight. I think i might decide to get the Senn MKH-416 or the Rode NTG-3. I found a MKH-416 for 899 used so i might just go with that. I will be having a sound guy with me all the time so i wouldn't have to worry about that. Would you happen to know any good places that maybe i can find better deals for the MKH-416? So basically what i would basically need is a boom pole and wind protection foam to buy also right? As far as the mixer, i think i might just save my money and buy it in the near future. (Unless out of nowhere the prices drop significantly =D)

[Robert Turchick]

I bought the BH kit for the NTG-3 and couldn't be happier. right under your budget too.

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/573977-REG/Rode__NTG_3_Basic_Shotgun_Microphone.html
If you want to take it to the next level, add the sound devices mm-1 which will allow your boom operator to have level control, limiter and headphones.

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/292989-REG/Sound_Devices_MM1_MM_1_Single_Channel_Portable.html
I have used this rig with great results many times.

To make it even more fun, I have a Sennheiser g2 wireless system that I can use with the rode/mm-1/boom pole to give me wireless boom pole. Total freedom and sounds GREAT!

[Garrett Low]

Anthony,

The foam wind protection is good for indoors and outdoors if you have no wind or very little. If you have any wind you'll need a furry (dead cat) and if it's really windy you'll need a blimp with furry. Finding a good used 416 is pretty hard. Like I said, for a lot of sound people it's one of their standard mics and sound equipment, unlike cameras, don't get changed out very often. I've been looking for a good deal on a used 416 for awhile now and haven't found any. I'm not in a rush because, as I mentioned, I usually leave all sound equipment up to who ever the sound guy is for the project.

Unfortunately you just missed a great deal from Rode. I think it was if you bought an NTG-3 they'd throw in their blimp system for a $1; then one of the DVinfo sponsors (I think it was Texas Tapeworks) also was willing to throw in a boom pole, or something like that. I was actually very tempted but I already had a boom and blimp so I didn't jump on it. So, deals do pop up but I haven't seen one on any SD stuff.

Garrett

[Michael Nistler]

Rehi Anthony,

Yes, I really love my 416T with rycote windjammer and zeppelin. Great if you can afford it, otherwise the NTG-3 or others are nice alternatives. And my Oktava MK-012A's are favorites where a hypercardiod condensor is required.

While I don't disagree with Garrett's assertion that wireless units have limitations, every event shooter, film audio engineer, etc owns many of them and knows how/when to use them. For instance, it's the only solution when you're doing a wide shot where a boom microphone would be in the frame (assuming ADR is not feasible).

Since you want to do it right, I recommend that instead of listening to anecdotal remarks from us in the peanut gallery, you should by an affordable training DVD or two on audio capture. Here's a trailer on Barry Green and Matt Gettemeier's excellent "Sound for Film and Television" DVD:

YouTube - Sound for Film and Television Instructional DVD from Barry Green and WBS

Google the DVD and you'll find numerous order sources. And regardless of "Devil Spawn" misleading remarks made by others, they'll teach you How/What/When/Where/Why to use wireless lavalier mics. FYI if you're interested, a few years ago I did some field tests on my Sennheiser wireless mics in response to an outspoken pundit in another audio forum. Here's my link where you can hear the audio with wireless distances over 200 yards:

Wireless Transceiver Lavalier Testing

Good luck with your audio capture!

Michael

[Garrett Low]

I admit it Michael, I do own and use my wireless mics. Like you said, there are times when you just can't get by with anything else.

It wouldn't be the first thing I'd reach for but I have to say it has gotten me through some pretty seemingly impossible situations.

Garrett

[Steve Oakley]

shotguns in most indoor shooting = extra ambient noise. you want a cardiod or hypercaroid. for your budget a audix SC1 (?) or AKG CK93 would do better.... even outdoors a hyper would work well.

as others have pointed out, a decent boom pole, shockmount, cables are all part of the package. you're looking more at $2k-$3k for mid level gear depending on what you pick. BTW good audio gear will last your next couple of cameras. cameras are practically disposable, good audio gear lasts.... except the new digital mics & mixers are starting to appear, as is AES in on some cameras