Filming Seminar this week. at DVinfo.net

Jason Selmes · November 9th, 2009, 03:44 PM

hi guys.

I need a little help with something.

I am fliming a speaking seminar gig next weekend and am wondering how i should record the audio for it.

as far as i am aware there will be no microphones or anything as it will only be a small bunch of people like 20-30.

I was thinking of running the speakers with my sennheiseer g3 lav mics but since i also have my shotgun on my camera aswell would you guys run the on camera shotgun for ambient noise? This way i have ausio coming from both channels.

The other option would be running my ntg-2 via XLR cable onto the stage connected to a mic stand for the MC to use when introducing speakers through channel 1 then having the speakers rigged up with the LAV G3 via channel 2?

"OR"

disconnecting all shotguns and running the G3 ONLY as the speakers are speaking

How do you guys normally do it?

Im just getting familair with Premeiere pro so is it possible to run the G3 via channel 2 hen duplicate to channel one in post so its not coming through 1 side of the headphones??

thanks guys i hope this all makes sense

Don Bloom · November 9th, 2009, 04:46 PM

kill the on board mics. use only the lavs on the presenters back to your camera unless you're using a mixer then pull the feed from that.

I can nly speak for my clients but I KNOW they aren't interested in the background noise only what the presenter is saying.

For instance, this week i'm doing a small seminar (45 to 60 people) 1 presenter with a powerpoint presentation. They don't want to pay for a mixer and there is no PA system so I'm putting a wireless lav on the presenter back to my A camera. I'll lock down another camera for the PPT presentation and use a splitter cable to run the audio to my B camera that way when I change tapes I still get audio no matter which camera I'm changing tapes in.
IMO they want the presenter, not the audience unless there's a Q&A period but that's a whole different thing.

Jason Selmes · November 9th, 2009, 05:24 PM

thanks for the advice ithink you might be right...

jason

Jay Massengill · November 10th, 2009, 11:43 AM

Anytime you're recording outside the studio, you need a backup mic so that no matter what happens you can get some useable sound until a problem can be fixed.
For example, a recent presenter wearing a small recorder in their jacket pocket with lav mic also attached to the jacket became unfocused when the air conditioning wasn't working and took their jacket off and laid it aside with the mic covered. Without a good-sounding backup mic, there would have been no useable audio for that presenter.
Since your situation will not have any audible PA system, then the presenters won't be aware of any problem that may be happening with their audio. So they will happily cruise along with their presentation while you may be pulling your hair out.
If there is more than one presenter without a break, you need to consider having two lav systems on different frequencies so that the recording can procede without interruption.
It's also a good idea to have a "home base" podium with a wired mic that can be used if there are wireless problems or if there are many remarks given sporadically by the MC.
Basically be ready for anything, because it's more likely than not that something unexpected will happen. But you have to balance this with simplicity if you are a one-person operation with limited equipment.
It's very important to talk with the presenters ahead of time and especially mention that they will not hear themselves over the mics that you've set up.
Also very important to find out from the client what their expectations are for any Q&A that may happen.
As always, the room you're recording in and your distance from the subject will influence whether a shotgun mic will sound useable as backup or too odd sounding to be acceptable.
A high-sensitivity, low-noise cardioid mic like an AT3031 or AT4021 can usually pull in something useable if you have a good mic preamp and all other primary mics like your wireless lavs aren't in position.
You have to be flexible and ready for the unexpected, but your equipment, experience and the recording situation will determine how you can be best prepared for that.

Don Bloom · November 10th, 2009, 03:41 PM

yes, I forgot to mention that on my B camera I always use a hypercaroid as a just in case mic. Of course a set of headphones is right at the top of the list. Got 'em? Use 'em!

(I also keep a 2nd bodypak with lav as well as extra fresh batteries right at hand-just in case!)

Paul Cascio · November 11th, 2009, 06:17 PM

Another thing to consider is if there will be questions from the audience. If so, you're going to need a way to capture those questions. Doesn't need to be quality audio, but you need to know what the questions are so you can at least caption them with subtitles.

Don Bloom · November 11th, 2009, 08:41 PM

Yep,today was a perfect example of seminars not going the way they were planned. Presenter had a great voice, audio was killer. Camera locked down on screen for PPT presentation great framing exposure set...his laptop died. On the spot. So he winged it until another laptop appeared and THEN he went back and sorta covered with the slides what he had already covered without the slides. TO cover myself I asked for a copy of the ppt. No proelm he says, I'll email it to you. He did. As soon as I got to the office it was there except it's a PPTX-it was done in Citrix and I can't open it. Ahhh, thank goodness my sons laptop has Citrix and he can open it convert it to straight PPT. Whew. Now back to the audio. The presenter did running questions instead of a Q&A time so guess what, no mic. Thankfully it was a small room and only about 45 people so the hypercaroid, while nowhere as good as a mic in front of their face, did a decent job. Great? No. Workable in post, yep. So it'll take about 30 minutes longer to edit than I planned. A touch here, a boost there, a tweak here and there and it'll be fine.
Moral of the story, the best laid plans....you know the rest!

Steve House · November 12th, 2009, 03:44 AM

FYI - the pptx extension indicates the presentation was prepared using PowerPoint 2007. If you don't have access to a copy, Miscrosoft has a "2007 Compatibility Pack" add-in available for free download that enables Office 2003 products to open 2007 formatted files.

Don Bloom · November 12th, 2009, 05:38 AM

Steve, thanks, all the PPTX files I've seen I never knew that. I always assumed it was because it was done on a Citrix system. I always had my son open them,convert them and send them back. He's a computer geek works for a major cell phone company (server team -desktop support before that) so he's got all the neato programs and he NEVER told me about it being 2007. I wokr work with 2003since I don't use it much it's not really been an issue. I will DL the package you recommended and then beat my 32 year old son like I own him for not telling me about it. ;-) Better, I will steal his Harley and hold it for ransom!

Steve House · November 12th, 2009, 07:52 AM

Yep - just FYI, Office 2007 went to an XML based file format and add "x" to the file extension from the Office 2003 equivalent program to distinguish them. So "docx" "xlsx" etc.

Eric Bakko · November 12th, 2009, 10:23 AM

You will be in safe territory with this advice.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Don Bloom

kill the on board mics. use only the lavs on the presenters back to your camera unless you're using a mixer then pull the feed from that.

I can nly speak for my clients but I KNOW they aren't interested in the background noise only what the presenter is saying.

For instance, this week i'm doing a small seminar (45 to 60 people) 1 presenter with a powerpoint presentation. They don't want to pay for a mixer and there is no PA system so I'm putting a wireless lav on the presenter back to my A camera. I'll lock down another camera for the PPT presentation and use a splitter cable to run the audio to my B camera that way when I change tapes I still get audio no matter which camera I'm changing tapes in.
IMO they want the presenter, not the audience unless there's a Q&A period but that's a whole different thing.

November 9th, 2009, 03:44 PM	#1
Jason Selmes Regular Crew Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Sydney Australia Posts: 97	Filming Seminar this week. hi guys. I need a little help with something. I am fliming a speaking seminar gig next weekend and am wondering how i should record the audio for it. as far as i am aware there will be no microphones or anything as it will only be a small bunch of people like 20-30. I was thinking of running the speakers with my sennheiseer g3 lav mics but since i also have my shotgun on my camera aswell would you guys run the on camera shotgun for ambient noise? This way i have ausio coming from both channels. The other option would be running my ntg-2 via XLR cable onto the stage connected to a mic stand for the MC to use when introducing speakers through channel 1 then having the speakers rigged up with the LAV G3 via channel 2? "OR" disconnecting all shotguns and running the G3 ONLY as the speakers are speaking How do you guys normally do it? Im just getting familair with Premeiere pro so is it possible to run the G3 via channel 2 hen duplicate to channel one in post so its not coming through 1 side of the headphones?? thanks guys i hope this all makes sense

November 9th, 2009, 04:46 PM	#2
Don Bloom Inner Circle Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 6,609	kill the on board mics. use only the lavs on the presenters back to your camera unless you're using a mixer then pull the feed from that. I can nly speak for my clients but I KNOW they aren't interested in the background noise only what the presenter is saying. For instance, this week i'm doing a small seminar (45 to 60 people) 1 presenter with a powerpoint presentation. They don't want to pay for a mixer and there is no PA system so I'm putting a wireless lav on the presenter back to my A camera. I'll lock down another camera for the PPT presentation and use a splitter cable to run the audio to my B camera that way when I change tapes I still get audio no matter which camera I'm changing tapes in. IMO they want the presenter, not the audience unless there's a Q&A period but that's a whole different thing. __________________ What do I know? I'm just a video-O-grafer. Don

November 10th, 2009, 03:41 PM	#5
Don Bloom Inner Circle Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 6,609	yes, I forgot to mention that on my B camera I always use a hypercaroid as a just in case mic. Of course a set of headphones is right at the top of the list. Got 'em? Use 'em! (I also keep a 2nd bodypak with lav as well as extra fresh batteries right at hand-just in case!) __________________ What do I know? I'm just a video-O-grafer. Don

November 11th, 2009, 06:17 PM	#6
Paul Cascio Trustee Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Bristol, CT (Home of EPSN) Posts: 1,192	Another thing to consider is if there will be questions from the audience. If so, you're going to need a way to capture those questions. Doesn't need to be quality audio, but you need to know what the questions are so you can at least caption them with subtitles. __________________ Paul Cascio www.pictureframingschool.com

November 11th, 2009, 08:41 PM	#7
Don Bloom Inner Circle Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 6,609	Yep,today was a perfect example of seminars not going the way they were planned. Presenter had a great voice, audio was killer. Camera locked down on screen for PPT presentation great framing exposure set...his laptop died. On the spot. So he winged it until another laptop appeared and THEN he went back and sorta covered with the slides what he had already covered without the slides. TO cover myself I asked for a copy of the ppt. No proelm he says, I'll email it to you. He did. As soon as I got to the office it was there except it's a PPTX-it was done in Citrix and I can't open it. Ahhh, thank goodness my sons laptop has Citrix and he can open it convert it to straight PPT. Whew. Now back to the audio. The presenter did running questions instead of a Q&A time so guess what, no mic. Thankfully it was a small room and only about 45 people so the hypercaroid, while nowhere as good as a mic in front of their face, did a decent job. Great? No. Workable in post, yep. So it'll take about 30 minutes longer to edit than I planned. A touch here, a boost there, a tweak here and there and it'll be fine. Moral of the story, the best laid plans....you know the rest! __________________ What do I know? I'm just a video-O-grafer. Don

November 9th, 2009, 05:24 PM	#3
Jason Selmes Regular Crew Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Sydney Australia Posts: 97	thanks for the advice ithink you might be right... jason

November 10th, 2009, 11:43 AM	#4
Jay Massengill Trustee Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Burlington Posts: 1,976	Anytime you're recording outside the studio, you need a backup mic so that no matter what happens you can get some useable sound until a problem can be fixed. For example, a recent presenter wearing a small recorder in their jacket pocket with lav mic also attached to the jacket became unfocused when the air conditioning wasn't working and took their jacket off and laid it aside with the mic covered. Without a good-sounding backup mic, there would have been no useable audio for that presenter. Since your situation will not have any audible PA system, then the presenters won't be aware of any problem that may be happening with their audio. So they will happily cruise along with their presentation while you may be pulling your hair out. If there is more than one presenter without a break, you need to consider having two lav systems on different frequencies so that the recording can procede without interruption. It's also a good idea to have a "home base" podium with a wired mic that can be used if there are wireless problems or if there are many remarks given sporadically by the MC. Basically be ready for anything, because it's more likely than not that something unexpected will happen. But you have to balance this with simplicity if you are a one-person operation with limited equipment. It's very important to talk with the presenters ahead of time and especially mention that they will not hear themselves over the mics that you've set up. Also very important to find out from the client what their expectations are for any Q&A that may happen. As always, the room you're recording in and your distance from the subject will influence whether a shotgun mic will sound useable as backup or too odd sounding to be acceptable. A high-sensitivity, low-noise cardioid mic like an AT3031 or AT4021 can usually pull in something useable if you have a good mic preamp and all other primary mics like your wireless lavs aren't in position. You have to be flexible and ready for the unexpected, but your equipment, experience and the recording situation will determine how you can be best prepared for that.

November 12th, 2009, 03:44 AM	#8
Steve House Inner Circle Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Hamilton, Ontario, Canada Posts: 5,742	FYI - the pptx extension indicates the presentation was prepared using PowerPoint 2007. If you don't have access to a copy, Miscrosoft has a "2007 Compatibility Pack" add-in available for free download that enables Office 2003 products to open 2007 formatted files. __________________ Good news, Cousins! This week's chocolate ration is 15 grams!

November 12th, 2009, 05:38 AM	#9
Don Bloom Inner Circle Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 6,609	Steve, thanks, all the PPTX files I've seen I never knew that. I always assumed it was because it was done on a Citrix system. I always had my son open them,convert them and send them back. He's a computer geek works for a major cell phone company (server team -desktop support before that) so he's got all the neato programs and he NEVER told me about it being 2007. I wokr work with 2003since I don't use it much it's not really been an issue. I will DL the package you recommended and then beat my 32 year old son like I own him for not telling me about it. ;-) Better, I will steal his Harley and hold it for ransom! __________________ What do I know? I'm just a video-O-grafer. Don

November 12th, 2009, 07:52 AM	#10
Steve House Inner Circle Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Hamilton, Ontario, Canada Posts: 5,742	Yep - just FYI, Office 2007 went to an XML based file format and add "x" to the file extension from the Office 2003 equivalent program to distinguish them. So "docx" "xlsx" etc. __________________ Good news, Cousins! This week's chocolate ration is 15 grams!