Best Mic setup for shooting martial arts at DVinfo.net

Ray Sigmond · August 14th, 2004, 04:13 PM

I will be shooting a martial arts instructional video series; mostly indoors and also some outdoor shooting. The instructor will be talking while performing the action at the same time.

I will be using a Sony VX2100 camera. I currently have a ME66/K6 mic with the Beach Tek DXA-4 Adapter. I was thinking of getting the ME64 to use for indoor shots and using the ME66 for outside.

Due to the fact that a lot of action is taking place, the lavalier mics are kind of clumsy, especially in close quarter action. I was wondering what you guys would reccomend under this type of shooting?

I was tossing areound the idea of getting a CS1 and a DXA-8 or DXA-6.

Douglas Spotted Eagle · August 15th, 2004, 04:33 PM

You might check out the AT 4051, depending on budget. This mic also has interchangeable heads for different situations, but I only have the cardiod and hypercardiod heads. If you have a boom accessible, the 4033, or the 4055 series large diaphragm mics will do well. you should be able to rent these to try out first, as they aren't cheap mics.

Ray Sigmond · August 15th, 2004, 04:50 PM

Thanks for the feedback Douglas. I will take a look at the AT mics, and the interchangeable heads sounds like a great feature.

I also own a Soundelux U195 mic that I use in my recording studio with a Neve 1272 mic pre. But I thought the U195 to possibly be too heavy in the field. Maybe for a boom setup though?

http://www.soundeluxmics.com/products/u195.asp

I also see a lot of people like the Rode NT3 which works on 9V.

Jay Massengill · August 15th, 2004, 05:11 PM

I don't know if I'd risk your studio mic, plus its additional weight would make boom setups more difficult. A static boom setup with a lightweight mic still requires at least two separate 8 pound shot bags as a minimum (one for the short end of the boom and one on the base of the stand).
Since the VX2100 and BeachTek would benefit from a hot mic output, then the ME64 would be a reasonable choice since you already have the K6.
I agree with Douglas that the 4051 and 4053 would sound better. They are also fairly high output, but not as high as the ME64 so you may get slightly more noise out of boosting the VX2100.
I recently tested my AT3031 against my 4053. The 4053 has a wider flatter frequency response, but there's no question the 3031 could hold it's own against it. The 3031 is actually quieter in self noise even when it is boosted slightly to match the gain.
It certainly has performance way ahead of its price of $170.
I don't think the NT3 would have enough "beef" when used as an overhead boom. I like it for dialogue, but that's because it's a little thin on the low end.
A CS-1 would work, but I think it's directional enough that it would need to be actively pointed to follow his talking.
On the other hand an Oktava from the SoundRoom with the hypercardioid head for $192 and the cardioid head on sale for $50 is a great bargain that would certainly get you enough low end punch.
And of course most of these mics we've mentioned do require phantom power, which you wouldn't have unless you went with the DXA-6 or 8 or some other power box.

Ray Sigmond · August 16th, 2004, 02:17 PM

Thanks guys. I wonder if both of you (Douglas and Jay) could give a breif description of your of your microphone arsenal and the applications you use them for?

Regards,

Ray

Douglas Spotted Eagle · August 16th, 2004, 02:31 PM

I'm afraid I'm probably like Bryan; way too many mics to list.
I have several B&K mics, they're my first studio "turn to" mics for quiet instruments, and my AT 4055's are my first studio "turn to" mics for most everything else. From there, I make other decisions.
On the sets, I use the AT 899 for MANY things, loving this micromic to death. Live on stage, when touring with the band, I use the AT 831 for my flutes, using the 7000 series wirelesses, coupled with a variety of mics and instrument inputs.
I love the 4051, great sound on the set as well, plus my ever fave, the 897 shotgun. I prefer this for almost anything outdoors, or even for a large room indoor shoot where I can get close to a wall. I've bounced this off of glass walls at the Mosconi Centre in Frisco on two occasions and love it.
Add to that my Beachtek and Samson mix devices, I'm pretty well set.

Ray Sigmond · August 17th, 2004, 10:06 AM

Douglas, forgive this newbie, but what brand are B&K mics?

:-)

Bryan Beasleigh · August 17th, 2004, 12:32 PM

Brüel & Kjær Pro Audio or DPA as it is known today. Very high end stuff.

Ray Sigmond · August 17th, 2004, 12:36 PM

Thanks Byran

Bryan Beasleigh · August 17th, 2004, 11:03 PM

Ray
For the best VX2000/2100 audio you will need a preamp. The most practicle for your uses will be the Beach DXA-8. It attaches to the camera and gives you balanced inputs, gain, 48volt phantom as well as limiters. Click here for a review with the VX

August 14th, 2004, 04:13 PM	#1
Ray Sigmond Regular Crew Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Edison, NJ Posts: 119	Best Mic setup for shooting martial arts??? I will be shooting a martial arts instructional video series; mostly indoors and also some outdoor shooting. The instructor will be talking while performing the action at the same time. I will be using a Sony VX2100 camera. I currently have a ME66/K6 mic with the Beach Tek DXA-4 Adapter. I was thinking of getting the ME64 to use for indoor shots and using the ME66 for outside. Due to the fact that a lot of action is taking place, the lavalier mics are kind of clumsy, especially in close quarter action. I was wondering what you guys would reccomend under this type of shooting? I was tossing areound the idea of getting a CS1 and a DXA-8 or DXA-6.

August 15th, 2004, 04:33 PM	#2
Douglas Spotted Eagle VASST Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Stockton, UT Posts: 5,648	You might check out the AT 4051, depending on budget. This mic also has interchangeable heads for different situations, but I only have the cardiod and hypercardiod heads. If you have a boom accessible, the 4033, or the 4055 series large diaphragm mics will do well. you should be able to rent these to try out first, as they aren't cheap mics. __________________ Douglas Spotted Eagle/Spot Author, producer, composer Certified Sony Vegas Trainer http://www.vasst.com

August 16th, 2004, 02:31 PM	#6
Douglas Spotted Eagle VASST Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Stockton, UT Posts: 5,648	I'm afraid I'm probably like Bryan; way too many mics to list. I have several B&K mics, they're my first studio "turn to" mics for quiet instruments, and my AT 4055's are my first studio "turn to" mics for most everything else. From there, I make other decisions. On the sets, I use the AT 899 for MANY things, loving this micromic to death. Live on stage, when touring with the band, I use the AT 831 for my flutes, using the 7000 series wirelesses, coupled with a variety of mics and instrument inputs. I love the 4051, great sound on the set as well, plus my ever fave, the 897 shotgun. I prefer this for almost anything outdoors, or even for a large room indoor shoot where I can get close to a wall. I've bounced this off of glass walls at the Mosconi Centre in Frisco on two occasions and love it. Add to that my Beachtek and Samson mix devices, I'm pretty well set. __________________ Douglas Spotted Eagle/Spot Author, producer, composer Certified Sony Vegas Trainer http://www.vasst.com

August 17th, 2004, 12:32 PM	#8
Bryan Beasleigh Trustee Join Date: May 2002 Location: Barrie, Ontario, Canada Posts: 1,922	Brüel & Kjær Pro Audio or DPA as it is known today. Very high end stuff. __________________ Life's journey is not to arrive at the grave safely in a well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, totally worn out, shouting ".......holy smokin rubber lips...what a ride!"

August 17th, 2004, 11:03 PM	#10
Bryan Beasleigh Trustee Join Date: May 2002 Location: Barrie, Ontario, Canada Posts: 1,922	Ray For the best VX2000/2100 audio you will need a preamp. The most practicle for your uses will be the Beach DXA-8. It attaches to the camera and gives you balanced inputs, gain, 48volt phantom as well as limiters. Click here for a review with the VX __________________ Life's journey is not to arrive at the grave safely in a well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, totally worn out, shouting ".......holy smokin rubber lips...what a ride!"

August 15th, 2004, 04:50 PM	#3
Ray Sigmond Regular Crew Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Edison, NJ Posts: 119	Thanks for the feedback Douglas. I will take a look at the AT mics, and the interchangeable heads sounds like a great feature. I also own a Soundelux U195 mic that I use in my recording studio with a Neve 1272 mic pre. But I thought the U195 to possibly be too heavy in the field. Maybe for a boom setup though? http://www.soundeluxmics.com/products/u195.asp I also see a lot of people like the Rode NT3 which works on 9V.

August 15th, 2004, 05:11 PM	#4
Jay Massengill Trustee Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Burlington Posts: 1,976	I don't know if I'd risk your studio mic, plus its additional weight would make boom setups more difficult. A static boom setup with a lightweight mic still requires at least two separate 8 pound shot bags as a minimum (one for the short end of the boom and one on the base of the stand). Since the VX2100 and BeachTek would benefit from a hot mic output, then the ME64 would be a reasonable choice since you already have the K6. I agree with Douglas that the 4051 and 4053 would sound better. They are also fairly high output, but not as high as the ME64 so you may get slightly more noise out of boosting the VX2100. I recently tested my AT3031 against my 4053. The 4053 has a wider flatter frequency response, but there's no question the 3031 could hold it's own against it. The 3031 is actually quieter in self noise even when it is boosted slightly to match the gain. It certainly has performance way ahead of its price of $170. I don't think the NT3 would have enough "beef" when used as an overhead boom. I like it for dialogue, but that's because it's a little thin on the low end. A CS-1 would work, but I think it's directional enough that it would need to be actively pointed to follow his talking. On the other hand an Oktava from the SoundRoom with the hypercardioid head for $192 and the cardioid head on sale for $50 is a great bargain that would certainly get you enough low end punch. And of course most of these mics we've mentioned do require phantom power, which you wouldn't have unless you went with the DXA-6 or 8 or some other power box.

August 16th, 2004, 02:17 PM	#5
Ray Sigmond Regular Crew Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Edison, NJ Posts: 119	Thanks guys. I wonder if both of you (Douglas and Jay) could give a breif description of your of your microphone arsenal and the applications you use them for? Regards, Ray

August 17th, 2004, 10:06 AM	#7
Ray Sigmond Regular Crew Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Edison, NJ Posts: 119	Douglas, forgive this newbie, but what brand are B&K mics? :-)

August 17th, 2004, 12:36 PM	#9
Ray Sigmond Regular Crew Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Edison, NJ Posts: 119	Thanks Byran