Advice mic for indoors interview at DVinfo.net

Carlos Manuel · May 13th, 2009, 05:58 AM

Hi all,

I've read a couple or threads here but still has some questions.

What I will do:
-interviews (60minute style) shooted indors in the person's home
-I will put the mic on a tripod, above the head and out of the visual range.

Right now I have a wireless lapel mic. The sound is ok but I don't like to see the mic on the image.

QUESTIONS:
- should I get a cardioid or a super cardioid ?
___I want the voice but not the echo or reverb from the room.

- I can go until $1000 / $1300.

- What model do you recommend?

Thanks
Carlos Manuel

Stuart Graham · May 13th, 2009, 06:15 AM

A supercardioid microphone is probably what you're after as they are more directional than a cardioid.

If you only want the speaker's voice a shotgun microphone might be best as they are very directional.

The Rode NTG-3 is highly rated and well priced. I'm thinking of getting one myself.

Carlos Manuel · May 13th, 2009, 08:13 AM

Thanks Stuart,

For around the same cost of the Rode NTG-3, there is also
Sanken CS1
Sony ECM-678
Audio-Technica AT4073a
Sennheiser K6/ME66 / ME67
Sennheiser 416
...

Do you have tested any of them?
I will not record voice for feature film or singers.
I want to have deep voice and do not see the lapel mic.

Will I note a major difference from a $700 to a $1100 cardioid or supercardioid ?
Thanks again

Oren Arieli · May 13th, 2009, 09:14 AM

I'll take a $100 microphone 5 inches from the audio source over a $1000 microphone 5 feet from the source. Echo will be determined more by room size and furnishings than the microphone used (but you can minimize echos with a closer mic placement). There are also techniques for using a wireless lav under the clothing (you have to make a protective loop that will eliminate rubbing noise). This will give you better bass at the expense of some mid/high frequencies. Shotgun mics will give you the worst bass response (only because they are typically further from the audio source).

Karl Lohninger · May 13th, 2009, 10:21 AM

Carlos, because you're putting your microphone right (on top) outside the frame line it really doesn't matter if you use a cardiod or hyper cardiod.

Which microphone to buy also depends what other situations you might have to deal with. If it's only for sit-down interviews any halfway decent mike will do. If you want to get value for your money think getting a used one. AKG 460/480 series i.e. with a (hyper) cardiod or are excellent quality. But really, a Octave would do too in this situation.

My opinion: buy used and buy good quality. You're going to save a lot and you're going to have excellent resale value - in other words you're not going to lose a single dime should you decide to sell your 'quality' microphone. Try this with a Samson ;-)

I, personally, am not a friend on Sennheisers K6/me66 series. A 416 is an excellent mike and besides being one of the best boom microphones are also used for voice-over BUT generally in interior situations have to be handled with care and I would not recommend it for beginners - how good they're sounding depends a lot on the room.

For the amount of money you're willing to spend you'd get a nice Schoeps (used that is) or find a Sennheiser MKH 50. Almost all mikes you mentioned seem to fall under the category 'shotgun' and for interiors that would not be my first choice.

Stuart Graham · May 13th, 2009, 10:51 AM

Hi carlos

I have some good links for reading up on microphones:

General info on different types of mics, pickup patterns and how mics work:
Microphone - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Help choosing the right type of mic and lots of mic reviews:
As I Hear It - Choosing the Right Microphone

The ten commandments for high quality audio capture:
sync.sound.cinema: The Fifteen [drops tablet]...Ten! Ten Commandments of Sound for Picture! (Part One)
- one of these commandments is to avoid using Lavalier mics except where absolutely necessary.

Also regarding audio capture in rooms see post 9 here:
http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/all-thing...icrophone.html
- although I find this a bit confusing as Wikipedia shows that a hypercardioid mic does have rear pickup. According to Wikipedia cardioid mics are the only ones without rear pickup.

These links might help you decide what type of microphone you need. With hindsight a shotgun or super cardioid mic is possibly not the best idea, as Karl said. These pick up a lot of sound from directly behind the mic as well as in front. This would be a problem if you mount the mic on a boom and there are airconditioning units running in the ceiling, or if you decide to eat a bag of crisps while the interview is in progress. And these directional mics might pick up echo quite well.

As Oren said you want to keep the mic as close to the person speaking as possible - preferably mounted on an overhead boom out of shot - I think you can get stands so you won't have to hold it. Or you could mount it below the person on a stand, again as close as possible without getting in shot.

John S. Cooper · May 13th, 2009, 12:21 PM

It´s also important to adjust the mic angle. It should point towards the mouth of he/she who speaks

Carlos Manuel · May 15th, 2009, 08:14 AM

Thanks all for the comments.

I've searched around and have 2 options at a resonable price.

- Rode NTG-3 in second hand (don't know yet the price)
- New SanKen CS-1

For those who know the mic's / have used them, what's your advice?

Again, I need the mic to shoot interviews at the person's home (like 60 Minutes).

Carlos

Karl Lohninger · May 15th, 2009, 11:02 AM

Carlos, shouldn't you know by now that a microphone like the Rode NTG-3 is NOT the right choice....are you listening at all? The Sanken CS-1 - well, if you have to, go for it, it's not the best choice either. But hey, a man's gotta do what a man's gotta do ;-)

Carlos Manuel · May 15th, 2009, 11:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Karl Lohninger

The Sanken CS-1 - well, if you have to, go for it, it's not the best choice either.

Thank's Karl for your support.

I've read in your other message where you say: For the amount of money you're willing to spend you'd get a nice Schoeps (used that is) or find a Sennheiser MKH 50. Almost all mikes you mentioned seem to fall under the category 'shotgun' and for interiors that would not be my first choice.

Please, tell me the model of Shoeps that you advise me.
What whould be your first choice?

I have a "small" problem. I don't know anyone that wants to sell any mic and I'm quite afraid of buying mic's on E-Bay.
The NTG-3 belongs to a person who plans to sell it and buy a CMIT5U.
It's the best I can get. But I don't know the exact moment of that change.

I'm Sorry Karl.

MKH50 is priced aroud $1,400. - too much
MKH416 is around 1,050 - It's my limit.
SanKen CS-1 is around $820 - it's ok for me
SanKEn CS-3E is around $1,400 - again out of my limit.

Thanks for all

Sacha Rosen · May 15th, 2009, 12:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Carlos Manuel

Thank's Karl for your support.

I've read in your other message where you say: For the amount of money you're willing to spend you'd get a nice Schoeps (used that is) or find a Sennheiser MKH 50. Almost all mikes you mentioned seem to fall under the category 'shotgun' and for interiors that would not be my first choice.

Please, tell me the model of Shoeps that you advise me.
What whould be your first choice?

I have a "small" problem. I don't know anyone that wants to sell any mic and I'm quite afraid of buying mic's on E-Bay.
The NTG-3 belongs to a person who plans to sell it and buy a CMIT5U.
It's the best I can get. But I don't know the exact moment of that change.

I'm Sorry Karl.

MKH50 is priced aroud $1,400. - too much
MKH416 is around 1,050 - It's my limit.
SanKen CS-1 is around $820 - it's ok for me
SanKEn CS-3E is around $1,400 - again out of my limit.

Thanks for all

For a Schoeps there are 3 types of bodies, CMC 4, CMC5, CMC 6... All the bodies are similar except the 4 is older and can only be powered by T power because of this you can find used ones for quite a lot cheaper. The CMC5 is phantom powered and the CMC6 can be powered by either. Once you have the CMC body you can then choose a capsule, typically for booming you would want a Mk4 (cardioid) or a Mk41(HyperCard). The great thing about these mics is that you can mix and match different capsules as well as Cuts, actve cables, plants and so on. There are other differences in the body's but any Schoeps is a great mic!

Carlos Manuel · May 15th, 2009, 12:29 PM

Sacha,

I've looked on B&H and the $1,939 is out of my possible range ($1,000 top)

Schoeps | Colette Series Microphone Set | CMC641 SET | B&H Photo

Thank's
Carlos

Sacha Rosen · May 15th, 2009, 01:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Carlos Manuel

Sacha,

I've looked on B&H and the $1,939 is out of my possible range ($1,000 top)

Schoeps | Colette Series Microphone Set | CMC641 SET | B&H Photo

Thank's
Carlos

you could find one used probably for around 1000-1200 and the value would not really drop too much.

Mark Boyer · May 15th, 2009, 04:06 PM

Most all of the location sound pros use a lavaliere on a indoor interview. If it is a movie set they might also use a boomed shotgun mic. If there is more than one being interviewed the a mixer and a second or third lavaliere is used. If they are interviewing audience members then a hand held mic for the interviewer is used (he is wired with a lavalier).

Also you need to hide your lavalier so it remains unseen. Booming from a stand is not recomended, if your subject moves your audio will have variable levels, A body mounted lavalier moves with the subject and holds a constant volume.

Chris Swanberg · May 15th, 2009, 06:27 PM

I'm late to the party on this one, but I would not recommend a shotgun for interior use.

Either a lav or something like the Schoeps style is the way to go. I cannot afford the Scheops, so instead bought a Oktava MK-012 with three capsules and had it modded to improve response. For under $300 I invested in the mic, capsules and modding, it is a pretty darned good performer on an interior boom. It is kind of my "go to" mic indoors.

They can be bought new for slightly more than $300 - I'd still pay to mod a new one, so you'd be investing around $500 if you went that route... I bought mine on E-bay and modded it later. You do need to know what you are buying, as there was a period of knock-off cheap chinese fakes. New from a dealer might be the best way to go if you choose this wy. A number of places sell them, such as:

Oktava MK-012 condenser microphone. Oktava-online - only genuine Russian made studio microphones

or:

www.oktavausa.com

Chris

ps. A comparison with other similarly priced mics is here: http://homerecording.about.com/od/mi...reatmics_3.htm

May 13th, 2009, 05:58 AM	#1
Carlos Manuel Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 76	Advice mic for indoors interview Hi all, I've read a couple or threads here but still has some questions. What I will do: -interviews (60minute style) shooted indors in the person's home -I will put the mic on a tripod, above the head and out of the visual range. Right now I have a wireless lapel mic. The sound is ok but I don't like to see the mic on the image. QUESTIONS: - should I get a cardioid or a super cardioid ? ___I want the voice but not the echo or reverb from the room. - I can go until $1000 / $1300. - What model do you recommend? Thanks Carlos Manuel

May 13th, 2009, 06:15 AM	#2
Stuart Graham Major Player Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Selby UK Posts: 274	A supercardioid microphone is probably what you're after as they are more directional than a cardioid. If you only want the speaker's voice a shotgun microphone might be best as they are very directional. The Rode NTG-3 is highly rated and well priced. I'm thinking of getting one myself. __________________ Stuart Graham www.magentapictures.com

May 13th, 2009, 10:51 AM	#6
Stuart Graham Major Player Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Selby UK Posts: 274	Hi carlos I have some good links for reading up on microphones: General info on different types of mics, pickup patterns and how mics work: Microphone - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia Help choosing the right type of mic and lots of mic reviews: As I Hear It - Choosing the Right Microphone The ten commandments for high quality audio capture: sync.sound.cinema: The Fifteen [drops tablet]...Ten! Ten Commandments of Sound for Picture! (Part One) - one of these commandments is to avoid using Lavalier mics except where absolutely necessary. Also regarding audio capture in rooms see post 9 here: http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/all-thing...icrophone.html - although I find this a bit confusing as Wikipedia shows that a hypercardioid mic does have rear pickup. According to Wikipedia cardioid mics are the only ones without rear pickup. These links might help you decide what type of microphone you need. With hindsight a shotgun or super cardioid mic is possibly not the best idea, as Karl said. These pick up a lot of sound from directly behind the mic as well as in front. This would be a problem if you mount the mic on a boom and there are airconditioning units running in the ceiling, or if you decide to eat a bag of crisps while the interview is in progress. And these directional mics might pick up echo quite well. As Oren said you want to keep the mic as close to the person speaking as possible - preferably mounted on an overhead boom out of shot - I think you can get stands so you won't have to hold it. Or you could mount it below the person on a stand, again as close as possible without getting in shot. __________________ Stuart Graham www.magentapictures.com

May 13th, 2009, 08:13 AM	#3
Carlos Manuel Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 76	Thanks Stuart, For around the same cost of the Rode NTG-3, there is also Sanken CS1 Sony ECM-678 Audio-Technica AT4073a Sennheiser K6/ME66 / ME67 Sennheiser 416 ... Do you have tested any of them? I will not record voice for feature film or singers. I want to have deep voice and do not see the lapel mic. Will I note a major difference from a $700 to a $1100 cardioid or supercardioid ? Thanks again

May 13th, 2009, 09:14 AM	#4
Oren Arieli Major Player Join Date: May 2007 Location: San Jose, California Posts: 919	I'll take a $100 microphone 5 inches from the audio source over a $1000 microphone 5 feet from the source. Echo will be determined more by room size and furnishings than the microphone used (but you can minimize echos with a closer mic placement). There are also techniques for using a wireless lav under the clothing (you have to make a protective loop that will eliminate rubbing noise). This will give you better bass at the expense of some mid/high frequencies. Shotgun mics will give you the worst bass response (only because they are typically further from the audio source).

May 13th, 2009, 10:21 AM	#5
Karl Lohninger Regular Crew Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 82	Carlos, because you're putting your microphone right (on top) outside the frame line it really doesn't matter if you use a cardiod or hyper cardiod. Which microphone to buy also depends what other situations you might have to deal with. If it's only for sit-down interviews any halfway decent mike will do. If you want to get value for your money think getting a used one. AKG 460/480 series i.e. with a (hyper) cardiod or are excellent quality. But really, a Octave would do too in this situation. My opinion: buy used and buy good quality. You're going to save a lot and you're going to have excellent resale value - in other words you're not going to lose a single dime should you decide to sell your 'quality' microphone. Try this with a Samson ;-) I, personally, am not a friend on Sennheisers K6/me66 series. A 416 is an excellent mike and besides being one of the best boom microphones are also used for voice-over BUT generally in interior situations have to be handled with care and I would not recommend it for beginners - how good they're sounding depends a lot on the room. For the amount of money you're willing to spend you'd get a nice Schoeps (used that is) or find a Sennheiser MKH 50. Almost all mikes you mentioned seem to fall under the category 'shotgun' and for interiors that would not be my first choice.

May 13th, 2009, 12:21 PM	#7
John S. Cooper Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: London. GB Posts: 29	It´s also important to adjust the mic angle. It should point towards the mouth of he/she who speaks

May 15th, 2009, 08:14 AM	#8
Carlos Manuel Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 76	Thanks all for the comments. I've searched around and have 2 options at a resonable price. - Rode NTG-3 in second hand (don't know yet the price) - New SanKen CS-1 For those who know the mic's / have used them, what's your advice? Again, I need the mic to shoot interviews at the person's home (like 60 Minutes). Carlos

May 15th, 2009, 11:02 AM	#9
Karl Lohninger Regular Crew Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 82	Carlos, shouldn't you know by now that a microphone like the Rode NTG-3 is NOT the right choice....are you listening at all? The Sanken CS-1 - well, if you have to, go for it, it's not the best choice either. But hey, a man's gotta do what a man's gotta do ;-)

May 15th, 2009, 12:29 PM	#12
Carlos Manuel Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 76	Sacha, I've looked on B&H and the $1,939 is out of my possible range ($1,000 top) Schoeps \| Colette Series Microphone Set \| CMC641 SET \| B&H Photo Thank's Carlos

May 15th, 2009, 04:06 PM	#14
Mark Boyer Regular Crew Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Bothell Washington Posts: 174	Most all of the location sound pros use a lavaliere on a indoor interview. If it is a movie set they might also use a boomed shotgun mic. If there is more than one being interviewed the a mixer and a second or third lavaliere is used. If they are interviewing audience members then a hand held mic for the interviewer is used (he is wired with a lavalier). Also you need to hide your lavalier so it remains unseen. Booming from a stand is not recomended, if your subject moves your audio will have variable levels, A body mounted lavalier moves with the subject and holds a constant volume.

May 15th, 2009, 06:27 PM	#15
Chris Swanberg Major Player Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Sacramento, CA Posts: 904	I'm late to the party on this one, but I would not recommend a shotgun for interior use. Either a lav or something like the Schoeps style is the way to go. I cannot afford the Scheops, so instead bought a Oktava MK-012 with three capsules and had it modded to improve response. For under $300 I invested in the mic, capsules and modding, it is a pretty darned good performer on an interior boom. It is kind of my "go to" mic indoors. They can be bought new for slightly more than $300 - I'd still pay to mod a new one, so you'd be investing around $500 if you went that route... I bought mine on E-bay and modded it later. You do need to know what you are buying, as there was a period of knock-off cheap chinese fakes. New from a dealer might be the best way to go if you choose this wy. A number of places sell them, such as: Oktava MK-012 condenser microphone. Oktava-online - only genuine Russian made studio microphones or: www.oktavausa.com Chris ps. A comparison with other similarly priced mics is here: http://homerecording.about.com/od/mi...reatmics_3.htm