What do you do with one good mic?

Barry Rivadue · March 18th, 2004, 07:59 AM

Thanks for the "light stand" advice; I can see that handling stereo is an inherently different proposition than booming for dialogue. :D

Alessandro Machi · March 18th, 2004, 08:59 PM

<<<-- Originally posted by Bryan Beasleigh :

This week, my VX2000 has been modified do the audio in is input directly into the cameras analog to digital converter, through the VTR RCA input terminals. It's on it's way back to me as of monday.

Now i have a really fine audio chain and one really good mic, I could use the Oktavas with it but never the ME66. (shudder)-->>>

Could explain what you are talking about? What mod did you do and why can't you use the ME66?

<<<-- Originally posted by Bryan Beasleigh :
For the time being, that's the way it will work but i'll need either a short shotgun or another Schoeps to round out the system.

Any thoughts from the group, I'm all ears. I'm mainly into dialog between 2 to 4 people in a documentary setting. I also get involved with social events and military reneactment and cerimony.
-->>>

When two people are being interviewed and they are both on camera, go with one mike if you can. Otherwise you have to constantly ride the mikes up and down depending on who's talking.

You usually can find a "sweet spot" where both will sound good. If one person is off camera asking the questions, then definitely go with two mikes, one for each person.

You can devote a whole forum on the strategies of miking 3 & 4 people.

Frank Granovski · March 18th, 2004, 09:14 PM

Alessandro Machi wrote:

Quote:

Could explain what you are talking about? What mod did you do and why can't you use the ME66?

Bryan?

Bryan Beasleigh · March 18th, 2004, 11:13 PM

Well the mod I did is all over this forum, as a matter of fact the gist of the mod was in the quotes you posted. It shouldn't take much effort to find the whole storey and links.

The ME66 is a very harsh mic and has horrible off axis coloration. I don't like it at all.

So far as two mics, it's very easily done. One on the main group and one on the single person away from the first mics pattern. Quite often I'll speak from behind the camera
Record each mic on it's own track and cut the best audio in for each scene. I could use lavoliers but I don't want to. It's also possible to use a stereo configuration and sum to mono. that way you wind up with an irregular or oval pattern

I was asking an equipment question and not about technique.

Alessandro Machi · March 18th, 2004, 11:21 PM

Harsh?

What an interesting word to use. I've found it spectacular for doing Voiceover work, Live Video Opera recording either as the floor mikes or on camera, Interviews, and for mounting on camera in general.

Perhaps if you padded it down you'd get better results. The Mike is way too sensitive.

Bryan Beasleigh · March 18th, 2004, 11:49 PM

Could you assume that I may not like the mic. A pad is not the answer to everything although I do aggree the mic is far too hot.

I used to run it through a passive beach, which is amongst other things an adjustable pad.

I listen to loud machine rooms with everything from recip to screw compressors every day and enjoy decent audio when I'm not being subjected to high levels of noise polution.

Like everything else we grow and keep progressing up the audio chain. I'm older than dirt and deserve it ;-)

Read the links about the modification, I hope you'll understand.
Listen to Kens comparison of an ME66 and an MKH416.

Alessandro Machi · March 19th, 2004, 12:01 AM

When you say passive Beach, do you mean Beachtek?

I'm not saying the ME-66 is the best mike out there, but when combined with the built in power supply it is incredibly versatile.

You haven't experienced the ME-66's total potential if you don't pad it at least 10 DB for normal sounds and between 15-20 DB for loud environments.

Frank Granovski · March 19th, 2004, 12:15 AM

Alessandro, give it a rest. Yes, Bryan has had a ME66 for a number of years, and has experienced it's total potential. I suggest also to read some of Bryan's earlier posts in this forum.

Quote:

You haven't experienced the ME-66's total potential if you don't pad it at least 10 DB for normal sounds and between 15-20 DB for loud environments.

Bryan Beasleigh · March 19th, 2004, 12:15 AM

Alessandro
There are better mics out there. The Beach has a fixed 50 db pad as well as 2 10 db adjustable pads. The pre modified VX2000 needed the hot output of the K6/ME66 to get a high enough input so the lousy preamps would get noisy.

Please leave it alone. You aren't the only person in the world to use an ME66 or pads

My Oktavas have a 10 db pad in the kit, that fits between the capsule and mic preamp. My 302 and PMD670 have pads in the input stages before the preamps.

Be happy, Let me be happy with what floats my boast.

Alessandro Machi · March 19th, 2004, 02:37 AM

<<<-- Originally posted by Alessandro Machi : When you say passive Beach, do you mean Beachtek?

I'm not saying the ME-66 is the best mike out there, but when combined with the built in power supply it is incredibly versatile.

You haven't experienced the ME-66's total potential if you don't pad it at least 10 DB for normal sounds and between 15-20 DB for loud environments. -->>>

I clearly stated up above that the ME-66 is not necessarily the best mike out there.

If you did not like the ME-66 based on your overall set-up, then you may have made a wise decision, for you. But if you extrapolate that position and claim the ME-66 is not a good microphone in general because of a specific camera limitation you aren't effectively helping others or being fair to the ME-66 product.

Bryan Beasleigh · March 19th, 2004, 03:39 PM

To get back on topic, I'm thinking of either getting a short shotgun for those times when i don't want to or can't use the schoeps. The Mics that are on my short list are CS-1, CS-3, AT4073 and MKH 416

Alessandro Machi · March 19th, 2004, 04:36 PM

Does that mean you'll be selling your ME-66?

Barry Rivadue · March 19th, 2004, 05:21 PM

BB, what have you found the Oktavas most useful for?

Bryan Beasleigh · March 19th, 2004, 07:14 PM

I've used the Oktava hyper as a boomed dialog mic. I've experimented with a pair of cardoids in a coincident stereo as well as an XY.

I'll trying them outdoors as soon as the weather warms up. I had plans to use them to record an hour and a half ceremony later this spring. I've bought 2 Baby Ball Gags for them already.

The Oktava makes a great VO mic. Martin Garrison did an amazing VO comparison with a Neuman large diaphram and the Oktava cardoid.

Martin has an excellent sound as well as style. I was very impressed.

Barry Rivadue · March 19th, 2004, 07:38 PM

Great. Interesting stuff.

March 18th, 2004, 08:59 PM	#32
Alessandro Machi Major Player Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Los Angeles, Ca USA Posts: 553	Re: What do you do with one good mic? <<<-- Originally posted by Bryan Beasleigh : This week, my VX2000 has been modified do the audio in is input directly into the cameras analog to digital converter, through the VTR RCA input terminals. It's on it's way back to me as of monday. Now i have a really fine audio chain and one really good mic, I could use the Oktavas with it but never the ME66. (shudder)-->>> Could explain what you are talking about? What mod did you do and why can't you use the ME66? <<<-- Originally posted by Bryan Beasleigh : For the time being, that's the way it will work but i'll need either a short shotgun or another Schoeps to round out the system. Any thoughts from the group, I'm all ears. I'm mainly into dialog between 2 to 4 people in a documentary setting. I also get involved with social events and military reneactment and cerimony. -->>> When two people are being interviewed and they are both on camera, go with one mike if you can. Otherwise you have to constantly ride the mikes up and down depending on who's talking. You usually can find a "sweet spot" where both will sound good. If one person is off camera asking the questions, then definitely go with two mikes, one for each person. You can devote a whole forum on the strategies of miking 3 & 4 people. __________________ https://alexlogic.blogspot.com/ Los Angeles Emmy Winner (yes, used a video edit controller and loved doing so.)

March 18th, 2004, 11:21 PM	#35
Alessandro Machi Major Player Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Los Angeles, Ca USA Posts: 553	Harsh? What an interesting word to use. I've found it spectacular for doing Voiceover work, Live Video Opera recording either as the floor mikes or on camera, Interviews, and for mounting on camera in general. Perhaps if you padded it down you'd get better results. The Mike is way too sensitive. __________________ https://alexlogic.blogspot.com/ Los Angeles Emmy Winner (yes, used a video edit controller and loved doing so.)

March 19th, 2004, 12:01 AM	#37
Alessandro Machi Major Player Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Los Angeles, Ca USA Posts: 553	When you say passive Beach, do you mean Beachtek? I'm not saying the ME-66 is the best mike out there, but when combined with the built in power supply it is incredibly versatile. You haven't experienced the ME-66's total potential if you don't pad it at least 10 DB for normal sounds and between 15-20 DB for loud environments. __________________ https://alexlogic.blogspot.com/ Los Angeles Emmy Winner (yes, used a video edit controller and loved doing so.)

March 19th, 2004, 02:37 AM	#40
Alessandro Machi Major Player Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Los Angeles, Ca USA Posts: 553	<<<-- Originally posted by Alessandro Machi : When you say passive Beach, do you mean Beachtek? I'm not saying the ME-66 is the best mike out there, but when combined with the built in power supply it is incredibly versatile. You haven't experienced the ME-66's total potential if you don't pad it at least 10 DB for normal sounds and between 15-20 DB for loud environments. -->>> I clearly stated up above that the ME-66 is not necessarily the best mike out there. If you did not like the ME-66 based on your overall set-up, then you may have made a wise decision, for you. But if you extrapolate that position and claim the ME-66 is not a good microphone in general because of a specific camera limitation you aren't effectively helping others or being fair to the ME-66 product. __________________ https://alexlogic.blogspot.com/ Los Angeles Emmy Winner (yes, used a video edit controller and loved doing so.)

March 19th, 2004, 04:36 PM	#42
Alessandro Machi Major Player Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Los Angeles, Ca USA Posts: 553	Does that mean you'll be selling your ME-66? __________________ https://alexlogic.blogspot.com/ Los Angeles Emmy Winner (yes, used a video edit controller and loved doing so.)

March 18th, 2004, 07:59 AM	#31
Barry Rivadue Major Player Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 508	Thanks for the "light stand" advice; I can see that handling stereo is an inherently different proposition than booming for dialogue. :D

March 18th, 2004, 11:13 PM	#34
Bryan Beasleigh Trustee Join Date: May 2002 Location: Barrie, Ontario, Canada Posts: 1,922	Well the mod I did is all over this forum, as a matter of fact the gist of the mod was in the quotes you posted. It shouldn't take much effort to find the whole storey and links. The ME66 is a very harsh mic and has horrible off axis coloration. I don't like it at all. So far as two mics, it's very easily done. One on the main group and one on the single person away from the first mics pattern. Quite often I'll speak from behind the camera Record each mic on it's own track and cut the best audio in for each scene. I could use lavoliers but I don't want to. It's also possible to use a stereo configuration and sum to mono. that way you wind up with an irregular or oval pattern I was asking an equipment question and not about technique.

March 18th, 2004, 11:49 PM	#36
Bryan Beasleigh Trustee Join Date: May 2002 Location: Barrie, Ontario, Canada Posts: 1,922	Could you assume that I may not like the mic. A pad is not the answer to everything although I do aggree the mic is far too hot. I used to run it through a passive beach, which is amongst other things an adjustable pad. I listen to loud machine rooms with everything from recip to screw compressors every day and enjoy decent audio when I'm not being subjected to high levels of noise polution. Like everything else we grow and keep progressing up the audio chain. I'm older than dirt and deserve it ;-) Read the links about the modification, I hope you'll understand. Listen to Kens comparison of an ME66 and an MKH416.

March 19th, 2004, 12:15 AM	#39
Bryan Beasleigh Trustee Join Date: May 2002 Location: Barrie, Ontario, Canada Posts: 1,922	Alessandro There are better mics out there. The Beach has a fixed 50 db pad as well as 2 10 db adjustable pads. The pre modified VX2000 needed the hot output of the K6/ME66 to get a high enough input so the lousy preamps would get noisy. Please leave it alone. You aren't the only person in the world to use an ME66 or pads My Oktavas have a 10 db pad in the kit, that fits between the capsule and mic preamp. My 302 and PMD670 have pads in the input stages before the preamps. Be happy, Let me be happy with what floats my boast.

March 19th, 2004, 03:39 PM	#41
Bryan Beasleigh Trustee Join Date: May 2002 Location: Barrie, Ontario, Canada Posts: 1,922	To get back on topic, I'm thinking of either getting a short shotgun for those times when i don't want to or can't use the schoeps. The Mics that are on my short list are CS-1, CS-3, AT4073 and MKH 416

March 19th, 2004, 05:21 PM	#43
Barry Rivadue Major Player Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 508	BB, what have you found the Oktavas most useful for?

March 19th, 2004, 07:14 PM	#44
Bryan Beasleigh Trustee Join Date: May 2002 Location: Barrie, Ontario, Canada Posts: 1,922	I've used the Oktava hyper as a boomed dialog mic. I've experimented with a pair of cardoids in a coincident stereo as well as an XY. I'll trying them outdoors as soon as the weather warms up. I had plans to use them to record an hour and a half ceremony later this spring. I've bought 2 Baby Ball Gags for them already. The Oktava makes a great VO mic. Martin Garrison did an amazing VO comparison with a Neuman large diaphram and the Oktava cardoid. Martin has an excellent sound as well as style. I was very impressed.

March 19th, 2004, 07:38 PM	#45
Barry Rivadue Major Player Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 508	Great. Interesting stuff.