Stage performance audio setup at DVinfo.net

Edward Carlson · February 27th, 2008, 03:13 PM

Soon I will be shooting a stage performance with three cameras. I did the same thing last year, and am looking to improve the audio for this year. Last time I used my DVC30's mixer to mix the on-camera shotgun and the feed from the mixer. In rehearsal the audio sounded good, but on the night of the show I got the wrong output (or something), and the audio peaked (a lot) and got destroyed. Luckily they recorded the musical parts onto a CD, so I ripped that and used it instead. This year I'm looking to set up two mics on either side of the stage for the un-mic'd people and mix those in with the house mixer feed. The DVC30 only has two inputs, I'm looking to run three.
I am going to have to get a mixer of some sort, so my questions are: Should I record audio to the camera, or to a separate recorder? What mixer should I get (something inexpensive.) I would like to get a portable mixer so I can use it for other projects, too. Also, would a hyper-cardioid mic work for the stage mics?
I'm looking to do this inexpensively, so I'm going to try to use stuff I already have or can borrow (besides the mixer, I already checked.) Thanks.

Wayne Brissette · February 27th, 2008, 04:37 PM

So are some people mic'd and others not? It sounds that way from your description. BTW, I hate sound checks and rehearsals. Rarely are the levels really where they will be once the performance starts.

I would recommend you do a double system, that is record to some recording device and also send a signal to your tape. You can use that audio on your camera as the guide track.

I'll explain how I record live music which might help, but realize that I own a ton of gear. Also don't waste your money on a mixer right now. Rent one, if there isn't a rental house in your area, Coffey Sound, Trew Audio, and Location Sound (and I think Gotham Sound) will all do rentals and ship the equipment to you.

So, here is what I tend to do with music (amplified). I run two omni's on the stage (usually at the edge of the stage), those are fed into the house snake, and I pull them out at the sound board area. I put those on two channels, take a matrix mix out of the board, then run two cardioid mics, and two omnis split 1 metre apart from the mixing area. Because I have the luxury of doing so, all mics go on their own channel. I have fed this mix into video cameras multiple times and the results turn out very, very good. I know this is more than you have, but I wanted to just give you some ideas.

I wouldn't run hypers on stage. But, if you're trying to catch some singing that isn't mic'd that is a bit different. Still I would use Omni's first, Cards second on stage.

Also be warned that if you choose to use audience mics AND the sound board audio and you don't put each on it's own track, you will have to figure out the delay (the sound board audio will be ahead of any audio from the speakers - due to the delay of the sound waves from the speakers to your audience microphones).

Maybe if you clued us in a bit more it might help. Is everyone mic'd? Is there just singing, or instruments too?

Wayne

Edward Carlson · February 27th, 2008, 05:06 PM

I'm not sure yet who will be mic'd and who won't be, but I'm pretty sure there will be unmic'd people with speaking parts. The pit is well mic'd, I got a good mix from the recording last time.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wayne Brissette

I run two omni's on the stage (usually at the edge of the stage), those are fed into the house snake, and I pull them out at the sound board area. I put those on two channels, take a matrix mix out of the board, then run two cardioid mics, and two omnis split 1 metre apart from the mixing area.

I get the omnis on stage, but where do you put the other omnis and cardioids, and what are they for?
I did figure out the delay thing last time. I split the board and shotgun to right and left, moved the shotgun's audio to sync, then moved the pan to 0 in FCP so it sounded stereo.

Wayne Brissette · February 27th, 2008, 06:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Edward Carlson

I get the omnis on stage, but where do you put the other omnis and cardioids, and what are they for?

They go on a custom mic tree I built for live music. The purpose is to have a nice mix from the audience only audio, two omnis split 1 metre and a pair of cards in the DIN/ORTF configuration. The stand tends to be in front or next to the sound board.

Wayne

Edward Carlson · February 27th, 2008, 06:47 PM

I see, its a good idea, but beyond the scope of this production. So if I record the audio to an external recorder, what should I look at renting? Also, should I try to match the mics that I'm using? I have an EV 635A, should I look for another, or just get any omni I can? Thanks.

February 27th, 2008, 03:13 PM	#1
Edward Carlson Major Player Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: North Hollywood, CA, United States Posts: 807	Stage performance audio setup Soon I will be shooting a stage performance with three cameras. I did the same thing last year, and am looking to improve the audio for this year. Last time I used my DVC30's mixer to mix the on-camera shotgun and the feed from the mixer. In rehearsal the audio sounded good, but on the night of the show I got the wrong output (or something), and the audio peaked (a lot) and got destroyed. Luckily they recorded the musical parts onto a CD, so I ripped that and used it instead. This year I'm looking to set up two mics on either side of the stage for the un-mic'd people and mix those in with the house mixer feed. The DVC30 only has two inputs, I'm looking to run three. I am going to have to get a mixer of some sort, so my questions are: Should I record audio to the camera, or to a separate recorder? What mixer should I get (something inexpensive.) I would like to get a portable mixer so I can use it for other projects, too. Also, would a hyper-cardioid mic work for the stage mics? I'm looking to do this inexpensively, so I'm going to try to use stuff I already have or can borrow (besides the mixer, I already checked.) Thanks.

February 27th, 2008, 04:37 PM	#2
Wayne Brissette Major Player Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Austin, TX Posts: 383	So are some people mic'd and others not? It sounds that way from your description. BTW, I hate sound checks and rehearsals. Rarely are the levels really where they will be once the performance starts. I would recommend you do a double system, that is record to some recording device and also send a signal to your tape. You can use that audio on your camera as the guide track. I'll explain how I record live music which might help, but realize that I own a ton of gear. Also don't waste your money on a mixer right now. Rent one, if there isn't a rental house in your area, Coffey Sound, Trew Audio, and Location Sound (and I think Gotham Sound) will all do rentals and ship the equipment to you. So, here is what I tend to do with music (amplified). I run two omni's on the stage (usually at the edge of the stage), those are fed into the house snake, and I pull them out at the sound board area. I put those on two channels, take a matrix mix out of the board, then run two cardioid mics, and two omnis split 1 metre apart from the mixing area. Because I have the luxury of doing so, all mics go on their own channel. I have fed this mix into video cameras multiple times and the results turn out very, very good. I know this is more than you have, but I wanted to just give you some ideas. I wouldn't run hypers on stage. But, if you're trying to catch some singing that isn't mic'd that is a bit different. Still I would use Omni's first, Cards second on stage. Also be warned that if you choose to use audience mics AND the sound board audio and you don't put each on it's own track, you will have to figure out the delay (the sound board audio will be ahead of any audio from the speakers - due to the delay of the sound waves from the speakers to your audience microphones). Maybe if you clued us in a bit more it might help. Is everyone mic'd? Is there just singing, or instruments too? Wayne __________________ Mics: KMR 82 i, NTG-1, MKH418S, MKH8040, SR77, QTC1, QTC40, SR30 Recorder: Zaxcom Deva 5.8 & MIX-12. Wireless: TRX900 stereo, Lectro 411

February 27th, 2008, 06:47 PM	#5
Edward Carlson Major Player Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: North Hollywood, CA, United States Posts: 807	I see, its a good idea, but beyond the scope of this production. So if I record the audio to an external recorder, what should I look at renting? Also, should I try to match the mics that I'm using? I have an EV 635A, should I look for another, or just get any omni I can? Thanks.