Wireless Audio problem at DVinfo.net

Jerry Pollock · November 26th, 2007, 06:16 PM

I have the Azden 500UDR wireless system and am using a Sony VX2100 camcorder. The button on the camera and on the wireless system is set to "mic" and I have no problem using the wireless system and it recording. When it is in the computer you can hear the sound really good. The problem is that after you complete the video and render it and try to put it on a tape or dvd, the sound made by the wireless is not there and I have no idea what to do. Does anyone have any suggestions?

Don Bloom · November 26th, 2007, 07:11 PM

I used 2 500UDR systems for about 6 years with PD150s, PD170s, DSR250s and JVC5000Us.
Since you can hear the audio in your NLE timeline but not on the finished tape or DVD it sounds like a problem with your authoring program OR a setting in your NLE if thats where you render the project to MPEG for DVD.
It doesn't sound like any sort of problem with either the audio unit or camera.
So in order to better help you how about a bit info like the NLE you're using, the DVD authoring program and as importantly your workflow. This is very important because then we can possible figure out if the problem is in the program or something that you're doing or not.
BTW if you need anoter 500UDR with transmitter let me know, I've got 2 for sale (I switched brands) ;-)
Don

Jerry Pollock · November 26th, 2007, 07:35 PM

I am using Vegas Pro 8 and DVD Architect 4.5 and I am not sure what you mean by the workflow.

Jerry Jesion · November 26th, 2007, 08:28 PM

Jerry,
Make sure that you do not have "DVD Architect NTSC video stream" selected as the template when you render. This encodes the video only w/o any audio. If you choose this template the audio must be rendered separately as an AC3 file for it to show up in DVDA.

No idea why there is a problem with tape tho.

Regards,
Jerry

Don Bloom · November 26th, 2007, 08:28 PM

When you cut the videoand get ready to make the DVD are you rendering to MPEG in Vegas or DVDA? If rendering in Vegas what are you rendering th audio as? AC3,WAV,PCM or...?
Ideally you would be rendering the video in Vegas using the proper bitrate of course (Vegas gives you more control over things, such as 1 or 2 pass, CBR or VBR) and the audio in Vegas would be rendered to AC3 as DVDA prefers that and would re-render your audio to AC3 anyway so you might as well beat it to the punch. Name them the same except for suffix, I.E. mymovie.mpg/mymovie.ac3 and when you drag them into DVDA the audio will follow the video and be there in all it's glory.
HTHs
Don

Jerry Pollock · November 26th, 2007, 08:35 PM

I am rendering in Vegas in MPEG and the audio is AC3. I don't have any problem with all the other audio that has been recorded, it's just the audio from the wireless system that I have a problem with.

Gerry Gallegos · November 26th, 2007, 08:40 PM

In Vegas 8 you have to render the audio and video separately. and then tell DVD architect where the 2 files are at. then youll get the sound. this is where you have to read the manual to get the jist of operations. if youre using Vegas I would highly recommend the VASST training videos, they explain it all. well worth the money. (i got the first 3 and number 8 when i purchased my Veg8). a must for non manual readers. (like me)

Ty Ford · November 26th, 2007, 09:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jerry Pollock

I am rendering in Vegas in MPEG and the audio is AC3. I don't have any problem with all the other audio that has been recorded, it's just the audio from the wireless system that I have a problem with.

An chance you recorded with a TRS plug from the receiver into a stereo input of the camera?

Regards,

Ty Ford

Jerry Pollock · November 26th, 2007, 09:25 PM

Actually my problems come from Vegas 4 and 7, these are the ones I have been using and I have just updated to Vegas 8 and haven't used it yet. I will be using it next weekend for a wedding I will be videoing. I didn't realize that the audio and video would have to be rendered separately in Vegas 8. That might be a future problem. I haven't as yet purchased any Vaast training manuels but I might have to. In response to the other reply, I don't know what a TRS plug is.

Seth Bloombaum · November 26th, 2007, 09:34 PM

Vegas 4, 7 and 8 are the same as far as rendering from the timeline goes.

You have the same choices - Render to MPEG and AC3 separately from the timeline, or, render to DV25 AVI and let DVD Architect do the render to MPEG/AC3.

Something is not clear - if you hear the audio during editing, there should be no issues "upstream" with tapes, camcorders, wireless.

You need to look more carefully "downstream" at rendering from Vegas and import into DVDA. Suggest you post in the Vegas forum.

Jerry Pollock · November 26th, 2007, 10:04 PM

Thanks for all the response. I will post in Vegas to see what happens.

Steve House · November 27th, 2007, 05:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jerry Pollock

Thanks for all the response. I will post in Vegas to see what happens.

I think Ty is on to something, Jerry. The clue that something might be wrong with the original recording rather than rendering etc is your statement that the only problem is with the portion of the audio recorded from the wireless and the rest of the audio in the Vegas project is fine on the tape or DVD.

A TRS plug is a stereo plug, either 1/8 mini or 1/4, with a tip, ring, and sleeve connector. That's what your camera's external mic connector is, a stereo mini TRS. Your wireless receiver outputs a mono signal on a balanced XLR connector so you must be using some sort of adapter and there's the rub - if the adapter isn't wired properly you can get phase issues that might not appear until late in the workflow. A lot of music store adapters are intended to convert a mono balanced XLR with a mono balanced TRS and connect XLR-2 to tip, XLR-3 to ring, and XLR-1 to sleeve. If you use this to send the mono mic signal into a stereo mic input, you end up with the same signal recorded on both left and right channels but with their phase inverted with respect to each other. Listening on phones or stereo speakers they may sound fine but if they are mixed to mono later, say when you render your project, they will cancel each other out with silence as the result. The proper adapter to use would connect the XLR-2 pin to both the tip and ring connectors, XLR-3 to the sleeve, XLR-1 either left unconnected or also connected to the sleeve.

The fix now for your shoot depends on how you've setup your mix in Vegas. If the left and right channels are on their own tracks in the timeline, try selecting ONE of them and inverting its phase and see if that fixes your disaapearing dialog issue.

Jerry Pollock · November 27th, 2007, 05:47 PM

Thanks Steve for your response. I am using an adapter from the XLR cord to the camera. That must have been the problem. I did what you suggested and chose the left channel and then inverted the phase as you suggested and rendered it in Vegas and then using DVDA4.5 put it on a DVD and it worked. My problem now is that I didn't understand all that you were talking about concerning the adapter etc. so I don't really know what I need to do to solve the problem without having to choose one channel and always inverting that part on the timeline.

Ty Ford · November 27th, 2007, 06:39 PM

Jerry,

Simply use the proper cable between the receiver and the camera.

You'll be fine.

Regards,

Ty Ford

Hsien Yong · November 27th, 2007, 07:31 PM

I'll have a go.

Hi Jerry,
What Steve and Ty mean, is that you have to get a cable like this.
http://www.hosatech.com/hosa/products/XVM-100.html

This cable applies the same signal to both left and right contacts of the 1/8 mini connector.

November 26th, 2007, 06:16 PM	#1
Jerry Pollock New Boot Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Bainbridge, Ga Posts: 11	Wireless Audio problem I have the Azden 500UDR wireless system and am using a Sony VX2100 camcorder. The button on the camera and on the wireless system is set to "mic" and I have no problem using the wireless system and it recording. When it is in the computer you can hear the sound really good. The problem is that after you complete the video and render it and try to put it on a tape or dvd, the sound made by the wireless is not there and I have no idea what to do. Does anyone have any suggestions?

November 26th, 2007, 07:35 PM	#3
Jerry Pollock New Boot Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Bainbridge, Ga Posts: 11	Wireless Audio Problem I am using Vegas Pro 8 and DVD Architect 4.5 and I am not sure what you mean by the workflow.

November 26th, 2007, 08:28 PM	#4
Jerry Jesion Regular Crew Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Woodhaven Mi Posts: 105	Jerry, Make sure that you do not have "DVD Architect NTSC video stream" selected as the template when you render. This encodes the video only w/o any audio. If you choose this template the audio must be rendered separately as an AC3 file for it to show up in DVDA. No idea why there is a problem with tape tho. Regards, Jerry Last edited by Jerry Jesion; November 26th, 2007 at 08:29 PM. Reason: typo

November 26th, 2007, 08:35 PM	#6
Jerry Pollock New Boot Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Bainbridge, Ga Posts: 11	Wireless Audio Problem I am rendering in Vegas in MPEG and the audio is AC3. I don't have any problem with all the other audio that has been recorded, it's just the audio from the wireless system that I have a problem with.

November 26th, 2007, 08:40 PM	#7
Gerry Gallegos Major Player Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Houston, Texas Posts: 262	no audio In Vegas 8 you have to render the audio and video separately. and then tell DVD architect where the 2 files are at. then youll get the sound. this is where you have to read the manual to get the jist of operations. if youre using Vegas I would highly recommend the VASST training videos, they explain it all. well worth the money. (i got the first 3 and number 8 when i purchased my Veg8). a must for non manual readers. (like me)

November 26th, 2007, 07:11 PM	#2
Don Bloom Inner Circle Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 6,609	I used 2 500UDR systems for about 6 years with PD150s, PD170s, DSR250s and JVC5000Us. Since you can hear the audio in your NLE timeline but not on the finished tape or DVD it sounds like a problem with your authoring program OR a setting in your NLE if thats where you render the project to MPEG for DVD. It doesn't sound like any sort of problem with either the audio unit or camera. So in order to better help you how about a bit info like the NLE you're using, the DVD authoring program and as importantly your workflow. This is very important because then we can possible figure out if the problem is in the program or something that you're doing or not. BTW if you need anoter 500UDR with transmitter let me know, I've got 2 for sale (I switched brands) ;-) Don

November 26th, 2007, 09:25 PM	#9
Jerry Pollock New Boot Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Bainbridge, Ga Posts: 11	Wireless Audio Problem Actually my problems come from Vegas 4 and 7, these are the ones I have been using and I have just updated to Vegas 8 and haven't used it yet. I will be using it next weekend for a wedding I will be videoing. I didn't realize that the audio and video would have to be rendered separately in Vegas 8. That might be a future problem. I haven't as yet purchased any Vaast training manuels but I might have to. In response to the other reply, I don't know what a TRS plug is.

November 26th, 2007, 09:34 PM	#10
Seth Bloombaum Inner Circle Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Portland, Oregon Posts: 3,420	Vegas 4, 7 and 8 are the same as far as rendering from the timeline goes. You have the same choices - Render to MPEG and AC3 separately from the timeline, or, render to DV25 AVI and let DVD Architect do the render to MPEG/AC3. Something is not clear - if you hear the audio during editing, there should be no issues "upstream" with tapes, camcorders, wireless. You need to look more carefully "downstream" at rendering from Vegas and import into DVDA. Suggest you post in the Vegas forum.

November 26th, 2007, 10:04 PM	#11
Jerry Pollock New Boot Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Bainbridge, Ga Posts: 11	Wireless Audio Problem Thanks for all the response. I will post in Vegas to see what happens.

November 27th, 2007, 05:47 PM	#13
Jerry Pollock New Boot Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Bainbridge, Ga Posts: 11	Wireless Audio Problem Thanks Steve for your response. I am using an adapter from the XLR cord to the camera. That must have been the problem. I did what you suggested and chose the left channel and then inverted the phase as you suggested and rendered it in Vegas and then using DVDA4.5 put it on a DVD and it worked. My problem now is that I didn't understand all that you were talking about concerning the adapter etc. so I don't really know what I need to do to solve the problem without having to choose one channel and always inverting that part on the timeline.

November 27th, 2007, 06:39 PM	#14
Ty Ford Inner Circle Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Baltimore, MD USA Posts: 2,337	Jerry, Simply use the proper cable between the receiver and the camera. You'll be fine. Regards, Ty Ford __________________ Ty Ford's Audio Bootcamp Field Guide Ty Ford's Audio Video Blog

November 27th, 2007, 07:31 PM	#15
Hsien Yong Regular Crew Join Date: May 2004 Location: Singapore Posts: 111	I'll have a go. Hi Jerry, What Steve and Ty mean, is that you have to get a cable like this. http://www.hosatech.com/hosa/products/XVM-100.html This cable applies the same signal to both left and right contacts of the 1/8 mini connector.