Which RODE VideoMic is good to record Classical guitar

[John Tran]

I have a Sony HDR-HC7 and would like to buy the RODE VideoMic to record Classical guitar. I hear good thing about RODE VideoMic but don't know which one to buy. Could you please help?
TIA,
--JT

[Guy Cochran]

Listen to the RODE NT3 demo of acoustic guitar recorded

http://rodemic.com/?pagename=Media_P...3-Acoustic.mov

It's an XLR based mic, however, you could use an XLR to 1/8" mini cable or a BeachTek XLR adapter. No phantom power needed as it can be self powered by a 9V battery.

Works great for indoor dialogue too.

I recall hearing Ty Ford playing acoustic in a video on YouTube, maybe he can chime in on what mic he used.

[John Tran]

Thanks for quick reply. Will it fit on HC7?

[Guy Cochran]

On camera is a bad place for a mic unless you absolutely have to. On a stand would be best.
It does weigh about the same as a can of soda so I think it'd be a little overwhelming. I've done it though. You just need a RODE SM3 shock mount. http://dvcreators.net/rode-microphones

[Jimmy Tuffrey]

"I recall hearing Ty Ford playing acoustic in a video on YouTube, maybe he can chime in on what mic he used."

Don't think it'll be the Rode then...

My moneys on the Schoeps 41


It's the placement that matters most with classical guitar. I usually point it at the neck/soundhole 22 fret (never directly at the hole), area at about 60 degrees to the neck and from above slightly pointing down to avoid breath and about 12 inches from the target.

Always try moving it about whilst wearing the cans.

That is the close sound though and you can of course go for an open sound with a different mic placement.

[Anna Harmon]

You don't need your cans to find the spot. Just put your ear close to the guitar and move around while someone's playing. When you hear the tone you're looking for place the mic there.

I'm curious about your recording scenario though. Why a Rode video mic?

[John Tran]

I would like to video the live classical guitar recital which my friend will be played. I had hear good thing about RODE product that's why I want to try.
Sorry, I did not make myseld clear that I will VIDEO the live recital with Sony HDR-HC7 not RECORD.
HAPPY THANKSGIVING TO ALL.
--JT

[Dave Robinson]

As far as I'm aware the Rode NT3 isn't a video mic. It's a straight up condenser.

I have one and have used it a few times in recording studios. It is exceptional at recording acousic guitars considering it's low price.

However, if you can afford it grab a Neumann, apparently the "bottle" mics are very good too, but both of these have hideous price tags attached.

[Andy Wilkinson]

I have both Rode Videomic and StereoVideoMic. The SVM gives more ambience to the recording but you need to be very close in (just a few feet away max.) The VM is of course mono but will cope with being a little further away as it has better side/rear rejection than the SVM. Both are excellent at the price point/market segment the're aimed at.

I think in this instance if you are set on leaving the mic on the camera (and it'll need a shoe adapter as per the other recent thread on Sony Prosumer HD camera's and their non-standard shoe fitting) then just how close you can comfortably get on the day will really dictate your choice. If you're going to be in the front row but still 5 or more feet away it will have to be a VideoMic.

Don't forget to tripod it either! I'm no expert/still learning/having fun with all this stuff but the're my comments for you!

Andy

[John Tran]

Hi Andy, the distance will be at least 10 feet to the front row. So I guess the Mono RodeVicMic is the choice.
BTW, you had mentioned about the non standard shoe adapterfor the mic, is this a COLD SHOE only, meaning it does not have electrical involve in this non standard adapter. So does it still work well with the Rode VicMic?
--JT

[Andy Wilkinson]

Yes, for the benefit of others reading this thread now/in the future the Sony shoe adapter available from B Hague, Nottingham, UK provides you with a standard cold shoe. Works well with Rode Videomics (either!) as these of course have their own battery power on board and then simply plug into the 3.5mm minijack socket that my Sony HC1 has.

Andy

[Steve House]

Originally Posted by John Tran

Hi Andy, the distance will be at least 10 feet to the front row. So I guess the Mono RodeVicMic is the choice.
BTW, you had mentioned about the non standard shoe adapterfor the mic, is this a COLD SHOE only, meaning it does not have electrical involve in this non standard adapter. So does it still work well with the Rode VicMic?
--JT

10 feet is far too far away to record the best quality sound ... a shotgun mic like the Videomic IS NOT the audio equivalent of a telephoto lens - such things don't exist. You'll get something on tape, of course, a record of the performance, but it's very unlikely that it will sound like the concert footage you see on broadcast television. Whether you're shooting a video or recording a CD, the mic techniques that capture the best sound will be the same - in the case of acoustic guitar solo, up close and intimate. A cardioid or hypercardioid on a stand a foot or so away and aimed toward the soundhole is one technique, a lav clipped directly on the edge of the soundhole is another. Take a look at these video clips of Rodrigo y Gabriela for example - http://rodgab.com/watch.htm - if you look closely you'll they are mic'ed with lavs mounted to the base of the fretboard right at the sound hole in most of the clips. There are a couple where they've used pencil mics on stands about 1 foot away and aimed at the lower strings.

[John Tran]

Wow, Thanks Steve and Andy for your response and it is really helpful.
So which mic should I acquire now?
BTW, in Janurary 2008, I, myself, will also need to send in a video classical guitar audition for judge to see if I qualify for the master class.
So back to basic is, which mic should I purchase so I can use in both situation: video recording in the live guitar concert AND use for my classical guitar audition master class.
Again, thanks in advance for all inputs,
--JT

[Steve House]

Originally Posted by John Tran

Wow, Thanks Steve and Andy for your response and it is really helpful.
So which mic should I acquire now?
BTW, in Janurary 2008, I, myself, will also need to send in a video classical guitar audition for judge to see if I qualify for the master class.
So back to basic is, which mic should I purchase so I can use in both situation: video recording in the live guitar concert AND use for my classical guitar audition master class.
Again, thanks in advance for all inputs,
--JT

That's a hard one to answer because I glanced over the thread and you haven't said much about budget or what other equipment you have except for the Sony camera. One I'd suggest considering (I have a pair of them) is the Audio Technica 3031 cardioid condenser mic. Their MSRP is about US$ 275 as I recall so that's in the same ballpark of the Rodes discussed earlier. Rode's NT5 or NT55 would also be worth looking at, Audix is also a brand that is gaining some attention as good quality on a budget. Now these are all pro studio mics and as such have XLR outputs and require phantom power so you'll need some sort of mixer to both provide power and to properly feed your camera's inputs. You can get an adequate mixer from someone like Behringer for about $100, maybe less. From here the sky's the limit. For example, Ty's guitar clip referred to earlier I believe was recorded using a Schoeps CMC641 - only about $1500. Or you could get a DPA 4011 for about 2 kilobucks. Or maybe one of Neumann's "if you have to ask how much it is you can't afford it" <grin>. But in reality, proper mic'ing technique is far more important than the price of the mic - a $200 mic in the right place is going to give you better sound than a $2000 mic in the wrong place (within reason - you're going to be hard pressed to get good sound from a $20 Radio Snak mic no matter where you put it). And with rare exceptions, the right place is close to the source.

[Ty Ford]

BING!

Back from a tryptophan coma.

Jimmy wins; a Schoeps cmc641. If you look at the YouTube clip, you can see the mic on the couch arm. And remember YouTube uses a LOT of compression. The clip sounds a lot better uncompressed.

Ten feet is impossible, even for a Schoeps.

Try this little trick. Gaffers tape an omni lav to the guitar face. Try the upper bout, in the edge where the fingerboard and top join. Right in that little right angle, experiment with how close to the sound hole to give you the best frequency response balance.

I'm about to dive into an experiment with some Countryman lavs, mounting them inside the guitar, but they just got here yesterday.

The K&K pure western mini* I have in the Martin now does a nice job for playing out, but it still lacks a bit of mic warmth. I have samples in my online archive in a folder called Pure Western Mini.

I also have a clip of the Martin and a Sanken COS-11 lav with an Audio Ltd. wireless system. It's in the Audio folder, then inside the AudioLtd2040 folder.


Regards,

Ty Ford