rechargeable batteries and low volts at DVinfo.net

Wes Thomsen · June 5th, 2003, 10:29 PM

I would like people's opinions on using rechargeable batteries in wireless mic applications. The standards I've been used to are to not use them because they can have a marginally lower voltage which can hinder clean sound in a wireless tx'r and rx'r.

Has anyone had any long term experience using newer Ni-MH rechargeable batteries?

I was reminded of this issue because I've recently bought an Azden 500UDR and on page 7 of the user manual in full caps it says to not use rechargeable batteries.

http://www.azden.com/pdf/500udr-manual.pdf

This manual was also printed in 2001 before Ni-MH batteries were popular so I'm wondering if someone has insight as to whether this is a quality issue or an actual incompatability issue.

Thanks!

wes

Dean Sensui · June 6th, 2003, 12:32 PM

I used NiMh batteries on a few jobs and found they work OK. The producer had them -- they were Radio Shack batteries.

He then bought a set of 200 mAH batteries (Accupower) that supposedly provide a full 9 volts. But the problem was the batteries wouldn't physically fit into the battery compartment of the Lectrosonic transmitters or receivers.

Thomas Distributing also sells Tysonic batteries, and they look like they might fit, but I hadn't received a response to my inquiry about size.

Also, I'm still looking for a charger that will handle eight batteries simultaneously.

Would be nice to use rechargeables and put an end to the growing stack of half-used 9v alkalines.

Dean Sensui
Base Two Productions

Don Bloom · June 6th, 2003, 03:41 PM

I've used them in the past , still do in a small LCD monitor. As for audio equipment, I stick with the good old "Duracell". As for 1/2 used batteries, I give them to my grandson for his toys. He can never have enough batteries!
I definately buy AA and 9V in bulk.
Don

Wes Thomsen · June 7th, 2003, 10:07 AM

Thanks for the info guys!

wes

Bud Kuenzli · June 28th, 2003, 02:04 AM

don't hold me to any of these numbers, but...it's my recollection that rechargeables are 1.2V and Alkalines are 1.4V. I've read advice from more than one person to change out batteries well before they are out because clean audio requires a battery in a high state of charge. If those comments were in regard to Alkalines, then perhaps there is greater potential for audio being adversely affected when using rechargeables that are somewhat old.

Jeff Donald · June 28th, 2003, 09:40 AM

Rechargeable NiMH batteries (AA) are 1.2v and alkaline AA's are 1.5v. I've been using NiMH batteries, both AA and 9v, for over a year with no difficulties or degradation of my audio quality. The 9v are Varta brand batteries and fit my Lectrosonic gear.

Mike Rehmus · June 28th, 2003, 10:57 PM

Jeff,

What type of battery life do you get with the Vartas compared to Alkaline?

Christopher Hughes · July 1st, 2003, 03:01 PM

they have AA NiMH batteries over here that are around 1700 or some 2000mAh. So last a good while....would these not work better than standard AA cells that have a lot lower mAh???
The NiMH cells do produce a little bit of heat...but any possible damage cos of this, or you not noticed a thing with NiMH cells?

Mike Rehmus · July 1st, 2003, 03:40 PM

The problem is that NiMH cells have only about 1.2 volts per cell, quite a bit lower than the alkalines. So the longer power life may be offset by the lower starting voltage.

Jeff Donald · July 1st, 2003, 08:58 PM

The life between NiMH and alkaline are actually about the same. I always change batteries during breaks etc. I don't do weddings, but the occasional speaker, lecture etc. They easily last a couple of hours.

Gints Klimanis · April 25th, 2005, 06:56 PM

I'd like to update this thread. At this point in time, large battery manufacturers such as Energizer and Sanyo are selling NiMH batteries
with the following capacities, although "minor" brands seem to sell
some with a higher capacity.

AAA 800/850 mAh (900 minor brand)
AA 2500 mAh
9v 170 mAh (200-250 minor brand)
C 3000 mAh (4500 minor brand)

Jack Smith · April 25th, 2005, 10:45 PM

Since this has been resurrected I thought I might add that if the manufacture recommends NOT using rechargables you must be careful and I suggest following their recommendations.
There are other differences in batteries that might not be apparent.
Alkalines have a limited CURRENT capacity that some recharables do not.
If the manufactures design uses this limited current flow as a cheat in their design you could damage electronics with the higher current capacity of rechargables.
This isn't to say it will happen only that it could.

Vinny Osborne · October 17th, 2005, 05:53 PM

I have done some extensive testing of NiMH batteries with Sennheiser, AKG & Sony wireless mic's. The results can be viewed on my website at http://www.soundandmusicco.com/nimh.htm

Graeme Fullick · October 19th, 2005, 01:19 AM

Vinny,

This is great. THanks for doing it. From your findings it seems that for AA's the rechargables look the best option - but not so good for 9V. Could also be a considerable difference between brands and transmitters versus receivers.

Great stuff - thanks.

June 5th, 2003, 10:29 PM	#1
Wes Thomsen Tourist Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Minneapolis, MN Posts: 3	rechargeable batteries and low volts I would like people's opinions on using rechargeable batteries in wireless mic applications. The standards I've been used to are to not use them because they can have a marginally lower voltage which can hinder clean sound in a wireless tx'r and rx'r. Has anyone had any long term experience using newer Ni-MH rechargeable batteries? I was reminded of this issue because I've recently bought an Azden 500UDR and on page 7 of the user manual in full caps it says to not use rechargeable batteries. http://www.azden.com/pdf/500udr-manual.pdf This manual was also printed in 2001 before Ni-MH batteries were popular so I'm wondering if someone has insight as to whether this is a quality issue or an actual incompatability issue. Thanks! wes

June 7th, 2003, 10:07 AM	#4
Wes Thomsen Tourist Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Minneapolis, MN Posts: 3	thanks! Thanks for the info guys! wes

June 28th, 2003, 02:04 AM	#5
Bud Kuenzli Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: North Pole, Alaska Posts: 197	voltage differences don't hold me to any of these numbers, but...it's my recollection that rechargeables are 1.2V and Alkalines are 1.4V. I've read advice from more than one person to change out batteries well before they are out because clean audio requires a battery in a high state of charge. If those comments were in regard to Alkalines, then perhaps there is greater potential for audio being adversely affected when using rechargeables that are somewhat old. __________________ on the Internet, when you get where you're going you still don't know where you are

June 28th, 2003, 09:40 AM	#6
Jeff Donald Warden Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Clearwater, FL Posts: 8,287	Rechargeable NiMH batteries (AA) are 1.2v and alkaline AA's are 1.5v. I've been using NiMH batteries, both AA and 9v, for over a year with no difficulties or degradation of my audio quality. The 9v are Varta brand batteries and fit my Lectrosonic gear. __________________ Jeff Donald Carpe Diem Search DVinfo.net for quick answers \| Where to Buy? From the best in the business: DVinfo.net sponsors

June 28th, 2003, 10:57 PM	#7
Mike Rehmus Wrangler Join Date: May 2002 Location: Vallejo, California Posts: 4,049	Jeff, What type of battery life do you get with the Vartas compared to Alkaline? __________________ Mike Rehmus Hey, I can see the carrot at the end of the tunnel!

June 6th, 2003, 12:32 PM	#2
Dean Sensui Inner Circle Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Honolulu, HI Posts: 2,054	I used NiMh batteries on a few jobs and found they work OK. The producer had them -- they were Radio Shack batteries. He then bought a set of 200 mAH batteries (Accupower) that supposedly provide a full 9 volts. But the problem was the batteries wouldn't physically fit into the battery compartment of the Lectrosonic transmitters or receivers. Thomas Distributing also sells Tysonic batteries, and they look like they might fit, but I hadn't received a response to my inquiry about size. Also, I'm still looking for a charger that will handle eight batteries simultaneously. Would be nice to use rechargeables and put an end to the growing stack of half-used 9v alkalines. Dean Sensui Base Two Productions

June 6th, 2003, 03:41 PM	#3
Don Bloom Inner Circle Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 6,609	I've used them in the past , still do in a small LCD monitor. As for audio equipment, I stick with the good old "Duracell". As for 1/2 used batteries, I give them to my grandson for his toys. He can never have enough batteries! I definately buy AA and 9V in bulk. Don

July 1st, 2003, 03:01 PM	#8
Christopher Hughes Major Player Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Sunderland, England (y Merida, Mexico) Posts: 269	they have AA NiMH batteries over here that are around 1700 or some 2000mAh. So last a good while....would these not work better than standard AA cells that have a lot lower mAh??? The NiMH cells do produce a little bit of heat...but any possible damage cos of this, or you not noticed a thing with NiMH cells?

July 1st, 2003, 03:40 PM	#9
Mike Rehmus Wrangler Join Date: May 2002 Location: Vallejo, California Posts: 4,049	The problem is that NiMH cells have only about 1.2 volts per cell, quite a bit lower than the alkalines. So the longer power life may be offset by the lower starting voltage. __________________ Mike Rehmus Hey, I can see the carrot at the end of the tunnel!

July 1st, 2003, 08:58 PM	#10
Jeff Donald Warden Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Clearwater, FL Posts: 8,287	The life between NiMH and alkaline are actually about the same. I always change batteries during breaks etc. I don't do weddings, but the occasional speaker, lecture etc. They easily last a couple of hours. __________________ Jeff Donald Carpe Diem Search DVinfo.net for quick answers \| Where to Buy? From the best in the business: DVinfo.net sponsors

April 25th, 2005, 06:56 PM	#11
Gints Klimanis Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: San Jose, CA Posts: 2,222	I'd like to update this thread. At this point in time, large battery manufacturers such as Energizer and Sanyo are selling NiMH batteries with the following capacities, although "minor" brands seem to sell some with a higher capacity. AAA 800/850 mAh (900 minor brand) AA 2500 mAh 9v 170 mAh (200-250 minor brand) C 3000 mAh (4500 minor brand)

April 25th, 2005, 10:45 PM	#12
Jack Smith Major Player Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: ontario Posts: 445	Since this has been resurrected I thought I might add that if the manufacture recommends NOT using rechargables you must be careful and I suggest following their recommendations. There are other differences in batteries that might not be apparent. Alkalines have a limited CURRENT capacity that some recharables do not. If the manufactures design uses this limited current flow as a cheat in their design you could damage electronics with the higher current capacity of rechargables. This isn't to say it will happen only that it could.

October 17th, 2005, 05:53 PM	#13
Vinny Osborne New Boot Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 8	NiMH & Wireless (radio) microphones I have done some extensive testing of NiMH batteries with Sennheiser, AKG & Sony wireless mic's. The results can be viewed on my website at http://www.soundandmusicco.com/nimh.htm

October 19th, 2005, 01:19 AM	#14
Graeme Fullick Major Player Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Newcastle, Australia Posts: 337	Vinny, This is great. THanks for doing it. From your findings it seems that for AA's the rechargables look the best option - but not so good for 9V. Could also be a considerable difference between brands and transmitters versus receivers. Great stuff - thanks. __________________ Graeme