Linking Audio at DVinfo.net

Jared Isham · March 5th, 2007, 03:12 PM

I have a film I shot where Audio and Video were run seperately. I want to be able to link the synced audio and video in a subclip but don't know if this is possible. I can't find much help in the help files. I am running Premiere Pro 2.0.

Ervin Farkas · March 5th, 2007, 09:00 PM

Jared, welcome to DVi!

It is not only possible, it's fairly simple. Just import the audio as an asset, then put it on a separate track under your video, and move it left-right until it's perfectly synced. It'll take a while, but if you look for a point on the video where a specific sound/noise has been made, that will help.

If you do have audio on the tape (even if it's low level or noisy) then you can do it in Audition, that's how I like doing it because I can do more complex audio editing/corrections, but it's a bit more complicated.

Matthew Pugerude · March 5th, 2007, 09:57 PM

Jared Ervin is right in how to get it synced but then you should highlight the Video and Audio Track and right click and go to link audio and video (I believe this is the option I can not open Premiere right now to check for sure) then the two will be like one clip that you can move and edit as one instead of two separate clips.

Jared Isham · March 5th, 2007, 10:51 PM

I'm having no problem syncing the audio on the timeline. But I have 15 days worth of material and don't want to be forced to leave it all on the timeline. I would like to be able to make subclips of the synced audio that I can store in the bins and access when I begin to cut the footage.

It is a pain to be limited to only having seperate audio and video files linked on the timeline.

All the stuff is there - slates for syncing, footage and audio - only problem is they are two seperate files. Just need the linked and stored that way in the bin.

Wes Coughlin · March 5th, 2007, 11:48 PM

You could just create a new sequence for each clip, and then store those sequences with the link audio in a separate bin. And then just hide all you other files in separate audio and video bins.

Jared Isham · March 6th, 2007, 01:01 AM

I thought of that, do you think it would slow the playback down? I guess I could always try and see what happens.

Jared Isham · September 18th, 2007, 05:04 PM

Well I've managed to cut an entire 100min feature in premiere where video and audio were recorded separately. Premiere does not make it easy for this to be done.

I had to create a new sequence for every take we did. Totaling well over 200 sequences. We did this because there was no other way for us to link the video and audio while allowing us to remove the full clip from the timeline.

At first we thought this was going to work fine, but nested sequences require extra rendering to be played back. Another annoyance is when you double clip a clip it opens in your source monitor window. You double click a sequence it opens the sequence, whether it is in the bin or on the timeline. We had to drag our sequences into the source window to be able to view it there.

Aside from those little annoyances we found even more difficulty when we got into our post audio and color correction. We were trying to work with Universal Studios but they use Pro Tools, as any established post house uses. We needed to export an OMF or an AAF file for them to be able to read it. Automatic Duck made an OMF export plug-in for Premiere but that was discontinued, so we went with AAF export. Unfortunately AAFs do not support nested sequences (keep in mind our entire film is nested sequences).

Another thing is we shot with the HVX200. It could just be me or could actually be the camera, but the timecode starts from zero each time the card is switched, the reel number stays the same which makes the timecode worthless because the EDL is now unusable and we can not even reassemble the audio in Pro Tools via the EDL.

The next thought was we need to do our color correction. I open my project in After Effects and choose to open my timeline...wait, what's this? After Effects does not support nested sequences from Premiere either? I can't even open the timeline.

Now it is taking me forever to unnest every single clip.

Please tell me that CS3 allows you to do real subclipping. (i.e. Sync up audio and video on the timeline, drag it to the bin and have those files connected. Final Cut Pro does this and this one feature made me seriously consider scraping premiere all together.) - Anyone know anything about this?

Also, we finally got the AAF file to export somewhat correctly but Pro Tools only sees one channel of audio to import out of the 7. What's up with that?

Bert Smyth · September 20th, 2007, 01:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jared Isham

Final Cut Pro does this and this one feature made me seriously consider scraping premiere all together.

It sounds like you went through a bit of hell. You're absolutely right though, Final Cut does offer a very simple solution to this problem. I'm a Premiere Pro fan, but I definitely think this is one of those things that justifies Final Cut as a more professional platform. I'm surprised that Premiere Pro can't do this. Sorry to hear you had such difficulties, but I've found this discussion very enlightening, not that it helps you any!

Ray Bell · September 20th, 2007, 02:18 PM

Jared, Not sure this method will help or not, but you can also use the
Export, to movie, output video and audio and have it all come back into the
project automatic....

This way you can have the sequence with linked video and audio...on the time line.

If after the fact you need to change the audio on this linked sequence then
you just right click on the video on the timeline, un link the video/audio,
left click any were in the timeline window where you wont select any material so it un selects the selection, then left click on the audio track for further editing...

It sounds convoluted, but try it, its much easier to actually do than set here and type out the instruction...... :-)

Jared Isham · September 22nd, 2007, 05:19 PM

That is an idea - only problem is you begin to double your file size or the HDD and it takes even longer (waiting for the files to export), especially when you get into the 3 - 5 min long takes and especially if you are working with HD.

Bert Smyth · September 23rd, 2007, 12:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jared Isham

That is an idea - only problem is you begin to double your file size or the HDD and it takes even longer (waiting for the files to export), especially when you get into the 3 - 5 min long takes and especially if you are working with HD.

Some good suggestions for a work-around, but I'm with Jared on this one. I use Premiere Pro, but have access to a Final Cut system as well. It is very easy to merge media in Final Cut, and it doesn't increase your file size at all. The newly "merged" media clips appear in your project panel, and you can even delete the non-linked media from your project so that only the merged clips remain. I usually cringe when people start saying that Final Cut is the more "professional" application, but for anyone who is going to be working with film or audio recorded separately from the video, it holds true. Wish Adobe would take note.

Jared Isham · September 24th, 2007, 05:34 PM

I did finally notice the ever obvious option to remove unused content from your project. Project > Remove Unused. I had just spent an evening talking about how Avid has this option, then I found it. So I guess that is a bonus.

Now I would love to be able to tell Premiere which audio files I wanted it to conform first.

March 5th, 2007, 03:12 PM	#1
Jared Isham New Boot Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Pasadena, CA Posts: 11	Linking Audio I have a film I shot where Audio and Video were run seperately. I want to be able to link the synced audio and video in a subclip but don't know if this is possible. I can't find much help in the help files. I am running Premiere Pro 2.0.

March 5th, 2007, 09:00 PM	#2
Ervin Farkas Inner Circle Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Atlanta/USA Posts: 2,515	Jared, welcome to DVi! It is not only possible, it's fairly simple. Just import the audio as an asset, then put it on a separate track under your video, and move it left-right until it's perfectly synced. It'll take a while, but if you look for a point on the video where a specific sound/noise has been made, that will help. If you do have audio on the tape (even if it's low level or noisy) then you can do it in Audition, that's how I like doing it because I can do more complex audio editing/corrections, but it's a bit more complicated. __________________ Ervin Farkas www.AtlantaLegalVideo.com

March 5th, 2007, 09:57 PM	#3
Matthew Pugerude Regular Crew Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Redmond, Oregon Posts: 173	linking audio Jared Ervin is right in how to get it synced but then you should highlight the Video and Audio Track and right click and go to link audio and video (I believe this is the option I can not open Premiere right now to check for sure) then the two will be like one clip that you can move and edit as one instead of two separate clips.

March 5th, 2007, 11:48 PM	#5
Wes Coughlin Major Player Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Bend, Oregon Posts: 206	You could just create a new sequence for each clip, and then store those sequences with the link audio in a separate bin. And then just hide all you other files in separate audio and video bins. __________________ http://wildlookout.com

March 5th, 2007, 10:51 PM	#4
Jared Isham New Boot Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Pasadena, CA Posts: 11	I'm having no problem syncing the audio on the timeline. But I have 15 days worth of material and don't want to be forced to leave it all on the timeline. I would like to be able to make subclips of the synced audio that I can store in the bins and access when I begin to cut the footage. It is a pain to be limited to only having seperate audio and video files linked on the timeline. All the stuff is there - slates for syncing, footage and audio - only problem is they are two seperate files. Just need the linked and stored that way in the bin.

March 6th, 2007, 01:01 AM	#6
Jared Isham New Boot Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Pasadena, CA Posts: 11	I thought of that, do you think it would slow the playback down? I guess I could always try and see what happens.

September 18th, 2007, 05:04 PM	#7
Jared Isham New Boot Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Pasadena, CA Posts: 11	Well I've managed to cut an entire 100min feature in premiere where video and audio were recorded separately. Premiere does not make it easy for this to be done. I had to create a new sequence for every take we did. Totaling well over 200 sequences. We did this because there was no other way for us to link the video and audio while allowing us to remove the full clip from the timeline. At first we thought this was going to work fine, but nested sequences require extra rendering to be played back. Another annoyance is when you double clip a clip it opens in your source monitor window. You double click a sequence it opens the sequence, whether it is in the bin or on the timeline. We had to drag our sequences into the source window to be able to view it there. Aside from those little annoyances we found even more difficulty when we got into our post audio and color correction. We were trying to work with Universal Studios but they use Pro Tools, as any established post house uses. We needed to export an OMF or an AAF file for them to be able to read it. Automatic Duck made an OMF export plug-in for Premiere but that was discontinued, so we went with AAF export. Unfortunately AAFs do not support nested sequences (keep in mind our entire film is nested sequences). Another thing is we shot with the HVX200. It could just be me or could actually be the camera, but the timecode starts from zero each time the card is switched, the reel number stays the same which makes the timecode worthless because the EDL is now unusable and we can not even reassemble the audio in Pro Tools via the EDL. The next thought was we need to do our color correction. I open my project in After Effects and choose to open my timeline...wait, what's this? After Effects does not support nested sequences from Premiere either? I can't even open the timeline. Now it is taking me forever to unnest every single clip. Please tell me that CS3 allows you to do real subclipping. (i.e. Sync up audio and video on the timeline, drag it to the bin and have those files connected. Final Cut Pro does this and this one feature made me seriously consider scraping premiere all together.) - Anyone know anything about this? Also, we finally got the AAF file to export somewhat correctly but Pro Tools only sees one channel of audio to import out of the 7. What's up with that?

September 20th, 2007, 02:18 PM	#9
Ray Bell Regular Crew Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 1,414	Jared, Not sure this method will help or not, but you can also use the Export, to movie, output video and audio and have it all come back into the project automatic.... This way you can have the sequence with linked video and audio...on the time line. If after the fact you need to change the audio on this linked sequence then you just right click on the video on the timeline, un link the video/audio, left click any were in the timeline window where you wont select any material so it un selects the selection, then left click on the audio track for further editing... It sounds convoluted, but try it, its much easier to actually do than set here and type out the instruction...... :-)

September 22nd, 2007, 05:19 PM	#10
Jared Isham New Boot Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Pasadena, CA Posts: 11	That is an idea - only problem is you begin to double your file size or the HDD and it takes even longer (waiting for the files to export), especially when you get into the 3 - 5 min long takes and especially if you are working with HD.

September 24th, 2007, 05:34 PM	#12
Jared Isham New Boot Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Pasadena, CA Posts: 11	I did finally notice the ever obvious option to remove unused content from your project. Project > Remove Unused. I had just spent an evening talking about how Avid has this option, then I found it. So I guess that is a bonus. Now I would love to be able to tell Premiere which audio files I wanted it to conform first.