reverse ripple delete? at DVinfo.net

Denez McAdoo · September 14th, 2012, 07:52 AM

Maybe this is crazy but....

I'm getting getting video that needs to be edited according to notes that reference time code. Well, when I delete anything, specifically ripple deleting anything, it knocks the whole time code out of sync. The work around for this is to do a sort of "reverse ripple delete" where I move UP all the video from the front, keeping everything else down the line in sync.

However, this is a pain in PP CS6. Not only is there no actual "reverse ripple delete" (I wasn't expecting one, but clearly this must be a common scenario), but there is also no "select all going left" as there is in FCP.

Any suggestions, or am I missing something?

Battle Vaughan · September 14th, 2012, 11:25 PM

Sounds like you're cutting your master clip(s) on the timeline. Why not open the clips -- which presumably contain the original timecode, if they are a format like Quicktime that retains that information --- in the source monitor, set in and out points at the timecode you need, and make sub-clips that you then just assemble on the timeline? That way the cuts could be made precisely where you need. (Set handles to provide extra frames for covering transitions.)

The timeline timecode windows will show the timepoints of the timeline assemblage, not the timecode from the original footage.

Harm Millaard · September 15th, 2012, 03:32 AM

The only solution that makes sense is working backwards.

Say you need to adjust clips at timecode X, Y and Z (increasing numbers). The only workable solution is to start at the end, Z and then move to Y and finally X. Otherwise your timecodes will be off.

Denez McAdoo · September 20th, 2012, 09:05 AM

Thanks for the suggestions, but these are both terrible solutions. I make lots of edits - some times just deleting "ums" and "ers", sometime constructing sentences from the beginning of one take and the end of another, other times using video from one take and the audio from another. This should be standard for voice over work or editing down a presentation (which is what I'm doing).

Making 50 different subclips while not being able to see what's going on both camera's, then not being able to readjust the in and out points (adding handles, means I would have to just edit it once in the source monitor, then re-edit each edit again down in the timeline).

Watching it backwards is a non-solution as well. Perhaps if I made all the timed edits going backwards, then re-edited the same footage going forward for non-time critical edits. This is workable, but if I just had a simple "backwards select" I could do both in one pass.

Denez McAdoo · September 20th, 2012, 09:12 AM

for what it's worth, my own work around is the use the marquee select to highlight a few left going clips, then pressing the "\" key to do a full zoom out while still holding down the mouse, then continuing to select all the left going clips, I can press the "\" to re-zoom back in and drag drag the selected clips to where I want them.

Problem, sorta solved, but is it not common for people to get a video that someone else has watched with time codes (not necessarily camera timecodes), saying "at 7:20, cut this sentence," "at 8:30 there is a weird noise, see if you can git rid of it," "at 9:10, the speaker walks off screen and coughs, cut to the slide and delete the silence"? This seems like meat and potatoes work, and Premiere is just like, "good luck?!?"

Kevin Currie · September 21st, 2012, 12:23 AM

I've had a similar situation, and the first time I tried keeping track of how much I was offsetting the original time code and re-adjusting my math after each edit. Really bad idea. Then I tried it again and did what Harm suggested, and it worked out great. I think you might be misreading his suggestion because editing while watching the video in reverse doesn't even make sense. Do your cuts the regular way but just start with the last note the director made and work your way up the list, instead of the other way around. That way the time code will remain the same for the parts of the timeline you haven't gone over yet.

And you probably know this already, but just in case: Don't edit your original. Make a copy and change that one, so if you make a huge mess of it, like I did, you just need to delete it and try again.

Denez McAdoo · September 21st, 2012, 07:41 AM

Yeah, I know, I was a little too harsh on Harm's suggestion. It would work fine. My main problem with it is that not only do I make the timed edits that are on the list, I also make additional tweaks here and there and look for problems that may have been missed. Doing this requires that I watch the sequence from start to finish, which I could be doing at the same time as going the the edit list, but only IF I was watching from start to finish.

I have to admit that either Harm's or my own workaround, makes this process totally doable. It's just the frustration that this kind of editing seems pretty common, and for Premiere to have no proper way of dealing with this is disappointing.

Ron Little · September 21st, 2012, 08:39 AM

What I do is make a copy of the time line and name it copy or final. Then I take the one that is going to be my final cut and start cutting anytime I need to reference the time code I switch to the original time line look at the time code see what I need to do then go back to my final time line and make the cut.

September 14th, 2012, 07:52 AM	#1
Denez McAdoo Regular Crew Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: Cambridge, MA Posts: 89	reverse ripple delete? Maybe this is crazy but.... I'm getting getting video that needs to be edited according to notes that reference time code. Well, when I delete anything, specifically ripple deleting anything, it knocks the whole time code out of sync. The work around for this is to do a sort of "reverse ripple delete" where I move UP all the video from the front, keeping everything else down the line in sync. However, this is a pain in PP CS6. Not only is there no actual "reverse ripple delete" (I wasn't expecting one, but clearly this must be a common scenario), but there is also no "select all going left" as there is in FCP. Any suggestions, or am I missing something?

September 14th, 2012, 11:25 PM	#2
Battle Vaughan Trustee Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Miami, FL USA Posts: 1,505	Re: reverse ripple delete? Sounds like you're cutting your master clip(s) on the timeline. Why not open the clips -- which presumably contain the original timecode, if they are a format like Quicktime that retains that information --- in the source monitor, set in and out points at the timecode you need, and make sub-clips that you then just assemble on the timeline? That way the cuts could be made precisely where you need. (Set handles to provide extra frames for covering transitions.) The timeline timecode windows will show the timepoints of the timeline assemblage, not the timecode from the original footage.

September 15th, 2012, 03:32 AM	#3
Harm Millaard Trustee Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Rotterdam, Netherlands Posts: 1,832	Re: reverse ripple delete? The only solution that makes sense is working backwards. Say you need to adjust clips at timecode X, Y and Z (increasing numbers). The only workable solution is to start at the end, Z and then move to Y and finally X. Otherwise your timecodes will be off.

September 20th, 2012, 09:05 AM	#4
Denez McAdoo Regular Crew Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: Cambridge, MA Posts: 89	Re: reverse ripple delete? Thanks for the suggestions, but these are both terrible solutions. I make lots of edits - some times just deleting "ums" and "ers", sometime constructing sentences from the beginning of one take and the end of another, other times using video from one take and the audio from another. This should be standard for voice over work or editing down a presentation (which is what I'm doing). Making 50 different subclips while not being able to see what's going on both camera's, then not being able to readjust the in and out points (adding handles, means I would have to just edit it once in the source monitor, then re-edit each edit again down in the timeline). Watching it backwards is a non-solution as well. Perhaps if I made all the timed edits going backwards, then re-edited the same footage going forward for non-time critical edits. This is workable, but if I just had a simple "backwards select" I could do both in one pass.

September 20th, 2012, 09:12 AM	#5
Denez McAdoo Regular Crew Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: Cambridge, MA Posts: 89	Re: reverse ripple delete? for what it's worth, my own work around is the use the marquee select to highlight a few left going clips, then pressing the "\" key to do a full zoom out while still holding down the mouse, then continuing to select all the left going clips, I can press the "\" to re-zoom back in and drag drag the selected clips to where I want them. Problem, sorta solved, but is it not common for people to get a video that someone else has watched with time codes (not necessarily camera timecodes), saying "at 7:20, cut this sentence," "at 8:30 there is a weird noise, see if you can git rid of it," "at 9:10, the speaker walks off screen and coughs, cut to the slide and delete the silence"? This seems like meat and potatoes work, and Premiere is just like, "good luck?!?"

September 21st, 2012, 12:23 AM	#6
Kevin Currie Regular Crew Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Calgary, Canada Posts: 85	Re: reverse ripple delete? I've had a similar situation, and the first time I tried keeping track of how much I was offsetting the original time code and re-adjusting my math after each edit. Really bad idea. Then I tried it again and did what Harm suggested, and it worked out great. I think you might be misreading his suggestion because editing while watching the video in reverse doesn't even make sense. Do your cuts the regular way but just start with the last note the director made and work your way up the list, instead of the other way around. That way the time code will remain the same for the parts of the timeline you haven't gone over yet. And you probably know this already, but just in case: Don't edit your original. Make a copy and change that one, so if you make a huge mess of it, like I did, you just need to delete it and try again.

September 21st, 2012, 07:41 AM	#7
Denez McAdoo Regular Crew Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: Cambridge, MA Posts: 89	Re: reverse ripple delete? Yeah, I know, I was a little too harsh on Harm's suggestion. It would work fine. My main problem with it is that not only do I make the timed edits that are on the list, I also make additional tweaks here and there and look for problems that may have been missed. Doing this requires that I watch the sequence from start to finish, which I could be doing at the same time as going the the edit list, but only IF I was watching from start to finish. I have to admit that either Harm's or my own workaround, makes this process totally doable. It's just the frustration that this kind of editing seems pretty common, and for Premiere to have no proper way of dealing with this is disappointing.

September 21st, 2012, 08:39 AM	#8
Ron Little Major Player Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Pensacola Fl. Posts: 627	Re: reverse ripple delete? What I do is make a copy of the time line and name it copy or final. Then I take the one that is going to be my final cut and start cutting anytime I need to reference the time code I switch to the original time line look at the time code see what I need to do then go back to my final time line and make the cut.