DV Rack with HDV

Shawn Redford · July 5th, 2005, 03:50 PM

Can HDV Rack record audio from a separate/secondary firewire audio source, such as a Presonus Firebox, while simultaneosly recording the transport stream of the FX1/Z1 (all on the same PC)?

Similary, can HDV Rack record the transport stream for TWO FX1/Z1 cameras at the same time on a single PC? The FAQ at SeriousMagic mentions that only one firewire signal can be monitored at a time, but it's not clear if only one signal can be recorded at a time.

http://www.seriousmagic.com/help/faq...ck&faqid=1#q37

Douglas Spotted Eagle · July 5th, 2005, 04:00 PM

1 camera requires 1 laptop
2 cameras require 2 laptops
etc. Windows cannot split the m2t streams intelligently, therefore HDV Rack can't know which camera to get what signal from.

I've not tried recording to a disk drive AND to Rack at the same time in the HDV world, I don't believe it would be possible, but...even though Serious Magic says you can't record to a Firestore and to Rack at the same time (in DV) I've done it. They also say you can't stack a 1394 drive and DV Rack at the same time, but I've done that too. I think they're looking to reduce tech support calls; that's what I'd do.

Mark Mapes · July 5th, 2005, 04:06 PM

No on both counts. We've had several requests for the ability to record a separate audio stream, so that will be a strong candidate to be among the features in the next major version we release.

While DV Rack does allow you to switch among as many cameras as you can connect to your computer (each on its own FireWire bus), you can record only one at a time, and you cannot switch sources while recording. We're looking into the feasibility of recording multiple video streams simultaneously, but from what I understand there are hardware limitations that make it impracticle with current hardware.

Ed Szarleta · July 6th, 2005, 08:14 PM

A very informative thread. DSE and Mark...as always, you guys rock. A quick question if I may. I was wondering what main differences between the HDV and SD versions as far as color correction goes? I monitor most of my HDV footage on location with my Sony SD PVM series monitors and I find that it's really accurate.

I downloaded the trial of DVRack and used the SD output while recording HDV to tape, and it also performed well for my purposes. I would only use Rack for monitor purposes, so I was curious as to the benefit of the HDV Power Pack for my specific use. If I don't have to deal with the latency issue, I would prefer not to. Thanks in advance.

Mark Mapes · July 7th, 2005, 12:26 PM

Ed,
What do you mean by "color correction"? I normally think of color correction as affecting the recorded content or the output of an NLE, compositing program, etc. (But then I'm still a relative novice in the video field, so my concept of the term may be too narrow.) In any case, let's be clear that
DV Rack doesn't do anything that affects the recorded content.

I'm guessing that your question pertains to calibrating the Field Monitor to get accurate color representation & brightness. I don't have the experience with "real" hardware monitors to offer an opinion on how DV Rack compares, but I will point out that if you're hardware monitor is taking its feed from the camera's S-Video output, then it's showing you the uncompressed image; in this regard DV Rack is superior because it's showing you how the image looks after being compressed and decompressed just as it will be regardless of whether you're recording to tape or direct to disk.

Again, I'll leave it to others to assess the accuracy of color representation, and I'll be interested in their opinions.

Douglas Spotted Eagle · July 7th, 2005, 12:36 PM

Having seen HDVRack on a properly set up laptop, and having seen it next to a Sony Luma monitor which is essentially the same image, they're so close that it would be a little silly to say anything about it. Close enough that the video card in the laptop could easily be blamed for any gamma diffs.

Bruce Quayle · January 17th, 2006, 01:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ed Szarleta

I downloaded the trial of DVRack and used the SD output while recording HDV to tape, and it also performed well for my purposes. I would only use Rack for monitor purposes, so I was curious as to the benefit of the HDV Power Pack for my specific use. If I don't have to deal with the latency issue, I would prefer not to.

I have a similar situation and would really appreciate a qualified answer to Ed's question.
Cheers,
Bruce

Abel Vang · January 17th, 2006, 03:46 AM

does the HDV Rack support the JVC GY-HD100U at 720p/24p???

Douglas Spotted Eagle · January 17th, 2006, 08:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bruce Quayle

I have a similar situation and would really appreciate a qualified answer to Ed's question.
Cheers,
Bruce

I'm not sure I understand the question, which is why it wasn't answered (I assume) by either Mark or I.
HDV powerPak allows you to plug an HDV camcorder into the laptop and monitor it. Without the plugin, you can't monitor HDV.
The latency is a byproduct of the compressed format, as it reads off the camera, your laptop has to decode the stream. Therefore, you'll have latency of up to .5 seconds, depending on the speed of your laptop.
And yes, DVRack with HDV PowerPak supports the JVC format.

Shawn Alyasiri · January 17th, 2006, 03:08 PM

Mark,

I have the HDV rack and have just started to use it with the HD100 and the Sony Z1. So far so good, with a lot of testing to go.

Do you know if it will work with the new Canon H1 (another camera I'm very close to purchasing). I'm guessing that it will work very well in 1080/60i mode, similar to the Z1. The wildcard is their 24F format. It has me guessing to know if your stuff will jive with it, and record it with their intended 24p emulation.

Please advise and thanks much,

Shawn

Karl Soule · January 26th, 2006, 07:39 PM

Hi Guys,

As of today, the 24-frame recording modes on the newer JVC HD-100 and the new Canon XLH-1 have not been officially tested and qualified with the HDV PowerPak. The HDV PowerPak was designed to meet all specifications used in the HDV format, and the 24-frame modes were added later (JVC calls it "Pro-HD".)

Jerry Matese · February 12th, 2006, 11:51 AM

Is Serious Magic seriously looking into DV50 and DV100 capture for camcorders like the HVX-200 as a alternative to P2/FS-100 or even FCP on Powerbooks?

Mark Mapes · February 12th, 2006, 12:00 PM

Absolutely. I'd say it's not a matter of if but when. In fact, at Serious Magic we're currently in the process of evaluating all of our product lines towards the end of mapping out our R&D course & schedule. As one of the proponents for putting DV50/DV100 support at the top of the list, I'd encourage all of you who are eager for that to make yourselves heard by dropping a note to me at mmapes@seriousmagic.com. The more the merrier.

Heath Vinyard · February 12th, 2006, 02:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Karl Soule

Hi Guys,

As of today, the 24-frame recording modes on the newer JVC HD-100 and the new Canon XLH-1 have not been officially tested and qualified with the HDV PowerPak. The HDV PowerPak was designed to meet all specifications used in the HDV format, and the 24-frame modes were added later (JVC calls it "Pro-HD".)

Hello.
Any idea when this will happen and what the upgrade process will be? I just bought a JVC HD100 and will be purchasing DV Rack/HD add on tomorrow.

Thank you.

Jay Lee · February 12th, 2006, 07:14 PM

I'm also wondering about compatibility with the JVC HD100 in 24P mode (HD of course). What works, what doesn't and what is the timeline for full functionality?

July 5th, 2005, 04:00 PM	#17
Douglas Spotted Eagle VASST Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Stockton, UT Posts: 5,648	1 camera requires 1 laptop 2 cameras require 2 laptops etc. Windows cannot split the m2t streams intelligently, therefore HDV Rack can't know which camera to get what signal from. I've not tried recording to a disk drive AND to Rack at the same time in the HDV world, I don't believe it would be possible, but...even though Serious Magic says you can't record to a Firestore and to Rack at the same time (in DV) I've done it. They also say you can't stack a 1394 drive and DV Rack at the same time, but I've done that too. I think they're looking to reduce tech support calls; that's what I'd do. __________________ Douglas Spotted Eagle/Spot Author, producer, composer Certified Sony Vegas Trainer http://www.vasst.com

July 5th, 2005, 04:06 PM	#18
Mark Mapes Serious Magic Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Sacramento, CA Posts: 68	No on both counts. We've had several requests for the ability to record a separate audio stream, so that will be a strong candidate to be among the features in the next major version we release. While DV Rack does allow you to switch among as many cameras as you can connect to your computer (each on its own FireWire bus), you can record only one at a time, and you cannot switch sources while recording. We're looking into the feasibility of recording multiple video streams simultaneously, but from what I understand there are hardware limitations that make it impracticle with current hardware. __________________ Mark Mapes OnLocation QA Manager, Adobe Systems

July 7th, 2005, 12:26 PM	#20
Mark Mapes Serious Magic Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Sacramento, CA Posts: 68	Ed, What do you mean by "color correction"? I normally think of color correction as affecting the recorded content or the output of an NLE, compositing program, etc. (But then I'm still a relative novice in the video field, so my concept of the term may be too narrow.) In any case, let's be clear that DV Rack doesn't do anything that affects the recorded content. I'm guessing that your question pertains to calibrating the Field Monitor to get accurate color representation & brightness. I don't have the experience with "real" hardware monitors to offer an opinion on how DV Rack compares, but I will point out that if you're hardware monitor is taking its feed from the camera's S-Video output, then it's showing you the uncompressed image; in this regard DV Rack is superior because it's showing you how the image looks after being compressed and decompressed just as it will be regardless of whether you're recording to tape or direct to disk. Again, I'll leave it to others to assess the accuracy of color representation, and I'll be interested in their opinions. __________________ Mark Mapes OnLocation QA Manager, Adobe Systems

July 7th, 2005, 12:36 PM	#21
Douglas Spotted Eagle VASST Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Stockton, UT Posts: 5,648	Having seen HDVRack on a properly set up laptop, and having seen it next to a Sony Luma monitor which is essentially the same image, they're so close that it would be a little silly to say anything about it. Close enough that the video card in the laptop could easily be blamed for any gamma diffs. __________________ Douglas Spotted Eagle/Spot Author, producer, composer Certified Sony Vegas Trainer http://www.vasst.com

January 26th, 2006, 07:39 PM	#26
Karl Soule Serious Magic Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Folsom, CA Posts: 106	24p modes and HDV PowerPak Hi Guys, As of today, the 24-frame recording modes on the newer JVC HD-100 and the new Canon XLH-1 have not been officially tested and qualified with the HDV PowerPak. The HDV PowerPak was designed to meet all specifications used in the HDV format, and the 24-frame modes were added later (JVC calls it "Pro-HD".) __________________ Karl Soule' Product Marketing Manager, Serious Magic Professional Products Group. ksoule@seriousmagic.com

July 5th, 2005, 03:50 PM	#16
Shawn Redford Regular Crew Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 158	Can HDV Rack record audio from a separate/secondary firewire audio source, such as a Presonus Firebox, while simultaneosly recording the transport stream of the FX1/Z1 (all on the same PC)? Similary, can HDV Rack record the transport stream for TWO FX1/Z1 cameras at the same time on a single PC? The FAQ at SeriousMagic mentions that only one firewire signal can be monitored at a time, but it's not clear if only one signal can be recorded at a time. http://www.seriousmagic.com/help/faq...ck&faqid=1#q37

July 6th, 2005, 08:14 PM	#19
Ed Szarleta Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Florida Posts: 156	A very informative thread. DSE and Mark...as always, you guys rock. A quick question if I may. I was wondering what main differences between the HDV and SD versions as far as color correction goes? I monitor most of my HDV footage on location with my Sony SD PVM series monitors and I find that it's really accurate. I downloaded the trial of DVRack and used the SD output while recording HDV to tape, and it also performed well for my purposes. I would only use Rack for monitor purposes, so I was curious as to the benefit of the HDV Power Pack for my specific use. If I don't have to deal with the latency issue, I would prefer not to. Thanks in advance.

January 17th, 2006, 03:46 AM	#23
Abel Vang Regular Crew Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 49	does the HDV Rack support the JVC GY-HD100U at 720p/24p???

January 17th, 2006, 03:08 PM	#25
Shawn Alyasiri Major Player Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Bloomington, IL Posts: 256	Mark, I have the HDV rack and have just started to use it with the HD100 and the Sony Z1. So far so good, with a lot of testing to go. Do you know if it will work with the new Canon H1 (another camera I'm very close to purchasing). I'm guessing that it will work very well in 1080/60i mode, similar to the Z1. The wildcard is their 24F format. It has me guessing to know if your stuff will jive with it, and record it with their intended 24p emulation. Please advise and thanks much, Shawn

February 12th, 2006, 11:51 AM	#27
Jerry Matese Regular Crew Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Stroudsburg, PA Posts: 72	Is Serious Magic seriously looking into DV50 and DV100 capture for camcorders like the HVX-200 as a alternative to P2/FS-100 or even FCP on Powerbooks?

February 12th, 2006, 12:00 PM	#28
Mark Mapes Serious Magic Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Sacramento, CA Posts: 68	Absolutely. I'd say it's not a matter of if but when. In fact, at Serious Magic we're currently in the process of evaluating all of our product lines towards the end of mapping out our R&D course & schedule. As one of the proponents for putting DV50/DV100 support at the top of the list, I'd encourage all of you who are eager for that to make yourselves heard by dropping a note to me at mmapes@seriousmagic.com. The more the merrier. __________________ Mark Mapes OnLocation QA Manager, Adobe Systems

February 12th, 2006, 07:14 PM	#30
Jay Lee Regular Crew Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 57	I'm also wondering about compatibility with the JVC HD100 in 24P mode (HD of course). What works, what doesn't and what is the timeline for full functionality?