Adobe Premiere Pro 7.0 Released - Decisions, Decisions!

Craig Jones · July 9th, 2003, 08:27 AM

Michael, do you use the 3Prong color tools? I tried to talk them into an AE version but they weren't biting.

I covet the full-time vectorscope/waveform monitor that Avid and VV both have. Thankfully Premiere will recieve that shortly.

Ronnie Grahn · July 9th, 2003, 08:39 AM

I changed from Premiere 6 to Avid Xpress DV 3.5 and I never looked back.
The learning curve was pretty steep but I liked pretty much everything better.

One thing annoys me tough; you can't export to a QT reference file in Avid XPD and then import it with sound in After Effects (on the PC, om Mac this works with a plug-in).

This fall is very, very interesting;
Premiere Pro, Avid Xpress Pro, Final Cut Pro 4 looks so good I'm contemplating buying a used Mac just for my editing.
All I know is, I'm gonna be poor this fall :)

Scott Silverman · July 9th, 2003, 06:55 PM

<<<-- Originally posted by Michael Chen : I have avid.
I think most users here are not using avid, not because it stinks, but rather, its expensive. -->>>

But Avid is the same price as Final Cut Pro, and plenty of people use that. Why is this?

So, price aside, would Avid and Premiere Pro be about equal? They both have color correction and real-time previews. Plus there isn't really much of a learning curve for me in Premiere because I already use Premiere 6.

Thanks!

K. Forman · July 9th, 2003, 07:07 PM

I guess it would all depend on where you want to go. Avid is one of the 3 NLEs I see listed in Edit jobs consistantly, along with FCP and Media 100. Notice that Premiere and Vegas aren't there? However, I do occasionally see Premiere experience wanted, but have yet to see Vegas in a Proffessional setting.

Scott Silverman · July 9th, 2003, 07:40 PM

Ok, I understand all that. But as far as features and options go as purely a NLE and its integration with other software, would you say they are about the same? For example can I do everything in Premiere Pro that I can in Avid and vice versa? Also does Avid work closely with a still image or After Effects type program? (Such as Photoshop, Premiere, and After Effects do) Thanks for your help!

Michael Chen · July 9th, 2003, 07:48 PM

<<<-- Originally posted by Craig Jones : Michael, do you use the 3Prong color tools? I tried to talk them into an AE version but they weren't biting.

I covet the full-time vectorscope/waveform monitor that Avid and VV both have. Thankfully Premiere will recieve that shortly. -->>>

I don't use the 3Prong color tools. Just the basic colour correction tools in avid which allows u to adjust 3 levels of colour correction. Its pretty advanced as it is similar to the CC in avid symphony from what i read.

K. Forman · July 9th, 2003, 08:37 PM

"For example can I do everything in Premiere Pro that I can in Avid and vice versa?"

I guess that will be a question only time will tell. I haven't used Avid yet, and the new Premiere hasn't hit the shelves yet. I have thought about downloading the Avid trial, but don't know how that would compare to the Pro versions.

Scott Silverman · July 10th, 2003, 12:46 AM

Where can I download the Avid trial? I have looked on the Avid site and see no trial! Thanks!

Chris Hurd · July 10th, 2003, 01:12 AM

Note, I've pruned this thread a bit by removing some one-line meta-discussions and as few minor ambers of almost-borderline nastiness. Thanks to all for keeping this civil... in the long run, these are all tools, each with their good points and bad. What's right for you may not be right for others and often there can be no clear cut case of one being better than the other, because it's such a personal, individual decision. Thanks again for a very fair and cordial discussion which in any other forum outside of DV Info would have devolved into a flame war. As it is, with only minor culling of a few bits of off taste, we're back on track here. Hope this helps,

John Threat · July 10th, 2003, 07:26 AM

I use Avid Xpress DV. it's a really strong and robust NLE. It's stable and it has strong media management abilities, and the best playback and realtime rendering in the field right now.

It has some solid transitions and titling tools, but it doesn't have any fancy compositiing tools, you'll have to use a 3rd party program for that (such as AE). It excells at long form cutting as it also has the best media management. You dont have to worry about virtual clips because all of that is handled internally. You can have multiple instances of any given asset and make changes to it that are seperate from the parent.

You can also easily migrate your product up and down the Avid family of products if your production needs higher end assistant.

Richard Alvarez · July 10th, 2003, 08:07 AM

Okay, as an AVID user, I will weigh in.

First of all, most AVID users seeem to hang out on the avid forum. www.avid.com if you want to talk to a lot of folks.

Second, most NLE's will allow you to do what you want... after a fashion. Some directly, some indirectly. It's a matter of understanding the interface and it's limitations.

Third, price point. AVID costs the same as FCP right now. It's poised for the release of AVID PRO coming out... in August I think. It will include some options that were previously only on the high end systems, and will interface with the MOJO Digital Nonlinnear Accelerator (if you want to pony up the extra bucks) for an awesome realtime machine capabale of editing uncompressed sdi.

AVID comes with a "third party" effects program... BORIS that fully integrates with the system.

Search the form for the phrase "learning curve" and you will find someone, somewhere complaining that "X" nle has a steep learning curve for THEM.

AVID ships a MAC and PC copy with every purchase, so at the moment... it is the most "portable" nle when it come to cross platform capability.

And finally, the most compelling reason to go with AVID... the reason I chose it to begin with... it is still the MOST USED interface in the industry, and still the best one for cutting film. IF you intend to actually cut film, or work within the industry, or transfer offline edits to higher end systems, AVID is the best choice for you.

IF you think you will NEVER need a frame accurate EDL for negative matchback, Doubt that you will ever have to work on or with a Symphony System, and are more comfortable with a different interface you have already mastered... Then it's probably not your best choice.

Regards

Scott Silverman · July 10th, 2003, 10:04 PM

John & Richard,
Thanks for your replys. That has helped me a lot. I do have one other question though. How does Avid work with multiple-camera shoots? I know with Premiere there is a plugin called "Multi-cam". Is there any such thing with Avid that you know of? Or, even better yet, does Avid have something already in it that can be used for multi-camera projects? Thanks so much for your help!

July 9th, 2003, 08:39 AM	#47
Ronnie Grahn Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Helsingborg, Sweden Posts: 77	I changed from Premiere 6 to Avid Xpress DV 3.5 and I never looked back. The learning curve was pretty steep but I liked pretty much everything better. One thing annoys me tough; you can't export to a QT reference file in Avid XPD and then import it with sound in After Effects (on the PC, om Mac this works with a plug-in). This fall is very, very interesting; Premiere Pro, Avid Xpress Pro, Final Cut Pro 4 looks so good I'm contemplating buying a used Mac just for my editing. All I know is, I'm gonna be poor this fall :) __________________ www.ninjafury.com \| www.ronniegrahn.com

July 9th, 2003, 06:55 PM	#48
Scott Silverman Major Player Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Cupertino, California, USA Posts: 301	<<<-- Originally posted by Michael Chen : I have avid. I think most users here are not using avid, not because it stinks, but rather, its expensive. -->>> But Avid is the same price as Final Cut Pro, and plenty of people use that. Why is this? So, price aside, would Avid and Premiere Pro be about equal? They both have color correction and real-time previews. Plus there isn't really much of a learning curve for me in Premiere because I already use Premiere 6. Thanks! __________________ Scott Silverman Shining Star Digital Video Productions Bay Area, CA

July 9th, 2003, 07:40 PM	#50
Scott Silverman Major Player Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Cupertino, California, USA Posts: 301	Ok, I understand all that. But as far as features and options go as purely a NLE and its integration with other software, would you say they are about the same? For example can I do everything in Premiere Pro that I can in Avid and vice versa? Also does Avid work closely with a still image or After Effects type program? (Such as Photoshop, Premiere, and After Effects do) Thanks for your help! __________________ Scott Silverman Shining Star Digital Video Productions Bay Area, CA

July 10th, 2003, 12:46 AM	#53
Scott Silverman Major Player Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Cupertino, California, USA Posts: 301	Where can I download the Avid trial? I have looked on the Avid site and see no trial! Thanks! __________________ Scott Silverman Shining Star Digital Video Productions Bay Area, CA

July 10th, 2003, 01:12 AM	#54
Chris Hurd Obstreperous Rex Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: San Marcos, TX Posts: 27,368 Images: 513	Note, I've pruned this thread a bit by removing some one-line meta-discussions and as few minor ambers of almost-borderline nastiness. Thanks to all for keeping this civil... in the long run, these are all tools, each with their good points and bad. What's right for you may not be right for others and often there can be no clear cut case of one being better than the other, because it's such a personal, individual decision. Thanks again for a very fair and cordial discussion which in any other forum outside of DV Info would have devolved into a flame war. As it is, with only minor culling of a few bits of off taste, we're back on track here. Hope this helps, __________________ CH Search DV Info Net \| 20 years of DVi \| ...Tuesday is Soylent Green Day!

July 9th, 2003, 08:27 AM	#46
Craig Jones Regular Crew Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Austin, TX Posts: 105	Michael, do you use the 3Prong color tools? I tried to talk them into an AE version but they weren't biting. I covet the full-time vectorscope/waveform monitor that Avid and VV both have. Thankfully Premiere will recieve that shortly.

July 9th, 2003, 07:07 PM	#49
K. Forman Capt. Quirk Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Middle of the woods in Georgia Posts: 3,596	I guess it would all depend on where you want to go. Avid is one of the 3 NLEs I see listed in Edit jobs consistantly, along with FCP and Media 100. Notice that Premiere and Vegas aren't there? However, I do occasionally see Premiere experience wanted, but have yet to see Vegas in a Proffessional setting.

July 9th, 2003, 07:48 PM	#51
Michael Chen Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Singapore Posts: 163	<<<-- Originally posted by Craig Jones : Michael, do you use the 3Prong color tools? I tried to talk them into an AE version but they weren't biting. I covet the full-time vectorscope/waveform monitor that Avid and VV both have. Thankfully Premiere will recieve that shortly. -->>> I don't use the 3Prong color tools. Just the basic colour correction tools in avid which allows u to adjust 3 levels of colour correction. Its pretty advanced as it is similar to the CC in avid symphony from what i read.

July 9th, 2003, 08:37 PM	#52
K. Forman Capt. Quirk Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Middle of the woods in Georgia Posts: 3,596	"For example can I do everything in Premiere Pro that I can in Avid and vice versa?" I guess that will be a question only time will tell. I haven't used Avid yet, and the new Premiere hasn't hit the shelves yet. I have thought about downloading the Avid trial, but don't know how that would compare to the Pro versions.

July 10th, 2003, 07:26 AM	#55
John Threat Major Player Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: New York Posts: 322	I use Avid Xpress DV. it's a really strong and robust NLE. It's stable and it has strong media management abilities, and the best playback and realtime rendering in the field right now. It has some solid transitions and titling tools, but it doesn't have any fancy compositiing tools, you'll have to use a 3rd party program for that (such as AE). It excells at long form cutting as it also has the best media management. You dont have to worry about virtual clips because all of that is handled internally. You can have multiple instances of any given asset and make changes to it that are seperate from the parent. You can also easily migrate your product up and down the Avid family of products if your production needs higher end assistant.

July 10th, 2003, 08:07 AM	#56
Richard Alvarez Inner Circle Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: San Mateo, CA Posts: 3,840	Okay, as an AVID user, I will weigh in. First of all, most AVID users seeem to hang out on the avid forum. www.avid.com if you want to talk to a lot of folks. Second, most NLE's will allow you to do what you want... after a fashion. Some directly, some indirectly. It's a matter of understanding the interface and it's limitations. Third, price point. AVID costs the same as FCP right now. It's poised for the release of AVID PRO coming out... in August I think. It will include some options that were previously only on the high end systems, and will interface with the MOJO Digital Nonlinnear Accelerator (if you want to pony up the extra bucks) for an awesome realtime machine capabale of editing uncompressed sdi. AVID comes with a "third party" effects program... BORIS that fully integrates with the system. Search the form for the phrase "learning curve" and you will find someone, somewhere complaining that "X" nle has a steep learning curve for THEM. AVID ships a MAC and PC copy with every purchase, so at the moment... it is the most "portable" nle when it come to cross platform capability. And finally, the most compelling reason to go with AVID... the reason I chose it to begin with... it is still the MOST USED interface in the industry, and still the best one for cutting film. IF you intend to actually cut film, or work within the industry, or transfer offline edits to higher end systems, AVID is the best choice for you. IF you think you will NEVER need a frame accurate EDL for negative matchback, Doubt that you will ever have to work on or with a Symphony System, and are more comfortable with a different interface you have already mastered... Then it's probably not your best choice. Regards

July 10th, 2003, 10:04 PM	#57
Scott Silverman Major Player Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Cupertino, California, USA Posts: 301	John & Richard, Thanks for your replys. That has helped me a lot. I do have one other question though. How does Avid work with multiple-camera shoots? I know with Premiere there is a plugin called "Multi-cam". Is there any such thing with Avid that you know of? Or, even better yet, does Avid have something already in it that can be used for multi-camera projects? Thanks so much for your help! __________________ Scott Silverman Shining Star Digital Video Productions Bay Area, CA