Which cam for less than 5000 bucks
 

Hello,
I used to do shorts and I've made one longer piece with the Canon XH-A1, which I still love, by the way.

I'm now shopping for a camera, any form, to acquire footage more in tune with 2015. I have a budget of $ 5000, for both the body and the lenses.

Which way would you go?
GH4
A7S
Black Magic
Several GoPro Cams?

Thanks so much for your input

Re: Which cam for less than 5000 bucks
 

Larry, have you considered the Canon XF200?

It's today's XH A1 and well within your budget ($3500).

Canon U.S.A. : Professional Imaging Products : XF200

Canon XF200 HD Camcorder at B&H Photo Video

Nothing wrong with any of your other choices, though.

Re: Which cam for less than 5000 bucks
 

Thanks, Chris, I didn't know this cam and I'm going to check it now!

Re: Which cam for less than 5000 bucks
 

Chris, why do you think it's better than the GH4?

Re: Which cam for less than 5000 bucks
 

I'm not saying the XF200 is better than the GH4, nor am I saying that the GH4 is better than the XF200 -- I'm not qualified to make either claim. What I'm saying is: since you still love the XH A1, then you might want to look at the XF200 because it is essentially the XH A1 of today. The XF200 is the modernized, up-to-date version of the old XH A1.

Re: Which cam for less than 5000 bucks
 

I would recommend looking at cameras that are more traditional video cameras. The cameras you list can make good images but the form factor and audio options will be much different in comparison to what you are used to with the A1. The learning curve will be a lot shorter to go with a XF200 or other similar camera.

Re: Which cam for less than 5000 bucks
 

Have you shot with a DSLR before? The biggest difference between a GH4 and a XF200 is in functionality, the xf200 will allow you to do controlled zooms, it has a parfocal lens, it has a inbuild stabiliser, nd filters, separate iris, focus and zoom rings, xlr in just to name a few.

A GH4 can have other advantages if that is what you are looking for like a shallower dof, low light performance - though the GH4 is not a low light king, 4K internal recording, focal length choices from fisheye to tele, small size and weight and the ability to take pictures to name another few.

If you love your xh-a1 the xf200 will not disappoint you if you are used to shooting with a real videocamera, a DSLR is not the easiest tool to work with.

Re: Which cam for less than 5000 bucks
 

Thanks a lot to all of you.
I really see your points.

Now, as a non professional, just an amateur, if I only care about image quality for fiction work, what do you say?

Re: Which cam for less than 5000 bucks
 

Its pretty dangerous to ask about "amateur" things in a group of professionals. ;)

I would still go with a normal video camera and not one of the SLR/Mirrorless cameras. As an amateur having a camera that can help you with focus and audio is going to give you much better videos. Many of the larger imager cameras are challenging to keep focused on your subject and nothing is worse than the "hunting for focus" look that appears in many videos these days. I personally HATE that.

Stick with a real video camera is what I would recommend. Strictly my opinion.

Re: Which cam for less than 5000 bucks
 

Or... with a $5k budget, you could afford the XF200 *and*( have $1500 left over for a DSLR. That might not be enough for a GH4 with lens, but it would be enough for, say, a Canon EOS 70D with a lens.

Re: Which cam for less than 5000 bucks
 

I understand what you're all saying.
I'm surprised nobody wants to talk me into buying a Black Magic Production cam? It's 3000 bucks and I could spend 2000 on lenses.
I do have a tascam and decent mics for sound, so I always synch sound in Vegas anyway.
I understand the advantages of a traditional cam functioning very much like the Canon I have. But I do have the ability, I hope, to learn something else.

Re: Which cam for less than 5000 bucks
 

For amateurs or pros, this is golden advice and more people should abide by it - doubly true for amateurs. Nothing I own makes as beautiful images as my 5DMkII, but I'd rather use my FS-100 any day of the week.

Re: Which cam for less than 5000 bucks
 

If you want to learn something different I would recommend getting the Canon 70D and save the rest of the money till you know whether you really like that kind of camera.

Alternatively you can spend a few hundred on renting some gear and playing around with it.

I'm not a fan of the black magic cameras. I wouldn't recommend them to anyone wanting something other than a curiosity. In my opinion its going to be a while before they fully understand how to make a reliable and functional video camera. Much like what RED has learned over the last 10 years of trying. Building a good camera is much harder than slapping an image sensor in a box.

I have little patience for things that don't just work when I'm trying to get work done.

Re: Which cam for less than 5000 bucks
 

Chris, I'm bumping into more and more people who think like you about the BMC series.

Re: Which cam for less than 5000 bucks
 

$2000 for lenses is actually not a lot if you plan to cover the the same focal length range as your XH-A1 or an XF200.

$2000 gets you a nice pair of zoom lenses (eg Canon 70-200 f/2.8 & 24-70 f/2.8) but with those 2 you'll have no IS and also lose 2/3 of the zoom range compared to what you are used to.

You'd need to be prepared to make some very big changes to your style if you want to move to the Black Magic Production Cam on your budget.

Re: Which cam for less than 5000 bucks
 

I guess if I'd be willing to spend more, but not a lot more and go for this: Sony NEX-FS700R

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1010197-REG/sony_nex_fs700rh_4k_nxcam_super_35mm.html
I'd be all set?

Re: Which cam for less than 5000 bucks
 

That is a lot of camera for the money. I have one and I like using it. Its ergonomics are bizarre but OK once you learn where everything is located.

That lens is a little slow but usable. I'm not a big fan of the servo driven lenses like that one since they have zero feel and the focus is unpredictable because its speed sensitive. I did buy my FS700 with the 18-200mm lens and I do use it some.

There are lens adapters so you can use vintage lenses or other SLR lenses. I mostly use some vintage Canon FD lenses.

The FS700 is in my opinion one of the better options to get a video camera with more traditional features and good reliability. Be sure to get a few extra batteries if you intend to use the high speed mode. The batteries are consumed about 50% faster when shooting at high frame rates.

Re: Which cam for less than 5000 bucks
 

Thanks Chris.
I don't do too much hand held filming, almost exclusively tripod work.
So now that I'm above 6500 bucks, should I look at the URSA?

Re: Which cam for less than 5000 bucks
 

Someone else will have to jump in and talk about the URSA since I'm not a fan of BM cameras. I personally don't think they are ready for prime time based on some limited time with them.

Re: Which cam for less than 5000 bucks
 

I've never used an URSA but I did price up a package recently. Once I added a battery solution and enough media for a full day of shooting, it worked out close to $10,000.

Re: Which cam for less than 5000 bucks
 

I think I'm going to probably go with this Canon: http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1086125-REG/canon_eos_c100_cinema_eos.html

Re: Which cam for less than 5000 bucks
 

That's a great camera -- you won't be disappointed. Just be aware that there is no servo zoom with this set-up.

Correction: there *are* servo zoom lenses available for Cinema EOS but they're rather expensive! What I meant to say is, you'll most likely be using still photo lenses with this camera, which are not motorized nor do they have long zoom ratios... but those factors don't have to be considered as hinderances.

Re: Which cam for less than 5000 bucks
 

Chris, I'm primarily interested in fiction, so no problem for me.
Still debating though, we'll see. But I like that canon.

Re: Which cam for less than 5000 bucks
 

I wonder what the JVC GY-LS300 will end up being like? Price is amazing!
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1096581-REG/jvc_gy_ls300_4kcam_handheld_s35mm.html

Re: Which cam for less than 5000 bucks
 

This decision is exciting to think about but not really a lot of fun to make...

I made the switch to DSLR shooting with the 5dMkII, since then I've purchased the 7D, 70D, and 5D3. I currently shoot stills with the 5D3 and love it and until recently I shot all my video with it as well.

The only reason I'm chiming in now is that if you decide to go the DSLR route, and there are a lot of challenges that have already been mentioned, then you really should take a look at the GH4.

I think the GH4 is as much of a game changer for DSLR video as the 5dMkII was. I was considering the Canon C100 but when the Metabones Speed Booster adapter for Canon lenses became available I decided to try the GH4 and now shoot everything in 4K.

I think for the price its an awesome camera and depending on your lenses you should also consider the Sony A7s.

I shoot a lot of run and gun which is really problematic with a DSLR style camera, however I'm able to be very unobtrusive and shoot in locations that I probably wouldn't be able to with a shoulder mounted camera and the results can be stunning. Also, I rarely have any help so I appreciated the portability and how much easier and efficient it is to deploy a variety of different kinds of camera mounts like jibs, dolly's and gimbals.

Re: Which cam for less than 5000 bucks
 

Chuck,
I'm actually seriously considering the GH4. I do not shoot any run and gun stuff, and if I even need to, it's going to be non professional and I'll use my XH-A1, which is more than adequate for YouTube for Vimeo.

I'm shopping for a cam to do shorts and narrative where everything will be controlled and yes, after considering several cams, including the Sony Sony NEX-FS700R, The coming Sony PXW-FS7 as well as the New Canon C100 and the blackmagic lines, I must say that the GH4 looks better and better, especially that I already have decent sound acquisition equipment. I could probably get two GH4.
I'm wondering, what lens would you recommend for general fiction on the GH4?
Thanks
L.

Re: Which cam for less than 5000 bucks
 

There are plenty of very good lenses for the gh4, a good alround lens is the 12-35mm f2.8 and if you can afford it complete it with a 35-100mm f2.8 lens both stabilised and splash and dustproof. The olympus lenses are also very good, the 12mm f2.0, the 75mm f1.8 are 2 of my favourite ones, all very sharp lenses but not stabilised. The panasonic 25mm f1.4 is also a very good lens. Olympus also has their pro line, where you have got the 12-40 and 40-150mm f2.8, expensive lenses but again very good ones but not stablised.

There is so much choice really, you also could consider Samyang/Rokinon if you don't mind no stabilisation and all manual, they are not as tacksharp as pannasonic or Olympus lenses but they are a joy to manual focus with and have stepless aperturerings and are good value for what they cost. I had all all their lenses but sold them for panny and oly lenses because I prefer autofocus and stabilisation on some lenses.

Re: Which cam for less than 5000 bucks
 

Hi Noa!
What do you mean by stabilization?
Is it relevant if I do everything on a tripod?

Re: Which cam for less than 5000 bucks
 

I mean lenses that have build in image stabilisation so you can shoot handheld, if you only work on a tripod you don't need that, these lenses have a switch to turn of the stabilisation if needed.

Re: Which cam for less than 5000 bucks
 

That's what I thought, thanks!
When you talked about the 12-35mm f2.8 you meant this one?
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/865111-REG/Panasonic_H_HS12035_Lumix_G_X_Vario.html

Re: Which cam for less than 5000 bucks
 

Chuck and Noa,
Any reasons why I should stay clear of the BlackMagic production cam?

Re: Which cam for less than 5000 bucks
 

I have not shot with that camera but from what I have seen and read about it, it's not the easiest camera to work with and it takes some capable hands to get the most from it, if you are feeling adventurous I'd say go for it :)

Re: Which cam for less than 5000 bucks
 

Any experience with the GH4 and recording to the Atomos shotgun? That recorder is indeed 2000 bucks, so when I factor everything I'm wondering if I shouldn't just wait for that new Sony Sony - PXW-FS7 XDCAM Super 35 or maybe just found a a Sony - NEX-FS700R or a Sony - NEX-FS100UK? That thing doesn't have ND filters built in though.