XDCam EX Zoom Ratio?
 

I heard Sony's Bob Ott say in an interview on another forum that the new XDCam EX camcorder will only have a 14x zoom. I thought it would be at least 20x. That it not much more than the Z1 or FX1 for that matter. I am getting ready to purchase an FX1 and when this new XDCam EX comes out I may upgrade to it if a few changes and tweaks are made in the future. I can not see paying 7 or 8$k for that camera right now for what it "may" offer.
I am not just being critical about this new cam I just think it should have a longer zoom and the new SxS memory cards are going to be several hundred dollars a piece. The concept of recording to DV tape AND a hard drive makes more since to me. I do alot of wedding and event videography where I would probably need 5 or 6 cards at $500.00 per card? I dont think so.
My 2 cents worth.

Joel

Recording to DV tape is not possible with the data rate of 35 Mbps. With the hot-swap capability of SxS cards, you could get by with 3 cards. When one is full after 40 minutes, swap this one with a spare one, copy the full one to a notebook and continue shooting. Repeat that for all day shoots. Copying a SxS card to disk may only take 20 minutes for a 16 GB card, while the recording time is 40 minutes. Also expect prices to drop rapidly for these cards.

Sony could easily have the zoom ratio to 20X but that’s if the imagers were smaller. So it’s comes down to this: 1/3” imagers with a 20X zoom ratio or ½ imagers with a 14X zoom ratio. I would really love a zoom ratio or 20X but having ½ imagers in a camcorder almost the size of the Z1u is a plus.


Besides being more reliable than tape, the other advantage of having memory cards is that you don’t get that motor noise from the tape mechanism when you’re recording something.

The PDW-U1 might be able to hook up the XDCAM HD to allow transfers from memory card to XDCAM discs without a computer and just incase it doesn’t, I’m sure Sony will develop another version of the PDW-U1 that has memory card slots. I and a few other posters are already begging for Sony to get this right.

There's nothing wrong with a 14x zoom from 1/2-inch chips.

Bob Ott told me it was 60 minutes per 16GB card, not 40 minutes.

We went through a lot of these "unclear on the concept" threads when P2 first came out; no doubt we're going to re-hash the same territory all over again for SXS.

I have read:

I know the info is rather preliminary and subject to change, but the major advantage is that the cards are hot swappable.

The imagers' size may be one reason for "reverting" from the 20x zoom on the V1 back to "only" 14x on the EX. The other reason might be that with interframe compression, anything above 14x looks pretty bad when there is even a slight thermal wave (convection) in the air (see discussion on artefacts in both the Canon A1 and Sony v1 when filming at full tele, with focus at infinity here: http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showpost....&postcount=51).

Not likely Paulo. The U1 has only USB2 for an interface. I didn't see any such interface on the XDCAM EX when it was in my hands.

FWIW, myself and others lobbied for FW interface with the stand alone drive.

-gb-

Consider the fact that if it's only 14x then it could be a much wider lens than the FX1 and Z1. I would rather have a better wide angle lens on the camera than more zoom.

For the type of work these small cameras often get used for, eg intimate documentaries, the wide end is more useful. Also, with large zoom ranges on these small camera, because of size restrains, you tend to get aperture ramping, the Z1 is horrendous in this regard.

A 20:1 zoom on a 1/2" camera would be quite large and could compromise the form factor. Although, personally, I think anything larger than a Z1 should be on your shoulder.

Sony will be regarding this camera a part of the range of their XDCAM products.

XDCam EX Zoom Ratio
 

I agree regarding the quality issue as for as 20x is concerned on the small chip cameras. I am not going to purchase a camcorder with 1/4 inch cmos chips. I rent Fx1 and Z1 cameras frequently and I am planning on purchasing one soon. The 14x zoom on the new sony XDcam EX camera is not bad and the wider end is more important. Century Optics just released a true 16x9 HDV 2x lens extender for the Fx1 and Z1 cameras that will not lose an f-stop. I will probably get one. I love the quality of the Z1 and FX1 cameras and I will probably step up to the XDCam EX at some point when the price drops after market saturation.

Joel Brooks
Moments in Time Video Productions

Wider is better for me
 

I would give up more reach for a wider angle any day in my line (live event). To take the wide angle adapter out of my bag would be a major relief. I am looking forward to a more film like DOF and better low light with the bigger chips.

I really hope we get a nice wide lens on this cam.

Thanks in advance Sony!

Mike
1 HVR-Z1U
3 HVR-A1U

14x 20x 100x it's all relative...

A decent wide-angle is far more important than zoom reach, and given that the further the zoom goes the more likely you are to see CA at each end... give me a shorter zoom and a larger imager any day!

I agree with Alex re: wide angle vs telephoto. Additionally, I do about 50 weddings a year with DVX100's. I do plan to purchase the XDcamEX asap but not for weddings. Frankly, I believe in providing the best quality that is practical for our brides but have yet to shoot a wedding that warrants being shot in XDcam or DigiBeta etc. I also do corporate and indies which is better suited for XDcam I believe. I really can't wait until the XDcamEX is available. The concept of finally no moving parts is very exciting.

Here Here!
 

Lets all toast to no moving parts!!

Hi my name is Mike and I am an upgrade addict.......


I will be using my EX to shoot weddings. We will shoot 10 weddings this weekend. Friday & Saturday. Since I'm the boss I get the coolest camera :)

The Z1 has already gone to the Sony service center. One of the A1's got sent today. Tape issues on both. Both units less than 100 hours operating. SO...

The only question I have is what happens when the card fails and what is the likelyhood of that? That is for another thread I know but.... I really look forward to getting one this fall anyhow. We'll keep the Z1's. Probably sell the A1's

Mike

"The only question I have is what happens when the card fails and what is the likelyhood of that?"

Just make sure your contract says "all care but no responsibility"!!!!LOL!!!!


It's going to be a bit scary for a while though, I agree!

Not knowing anything about solid state, lets hope it it show you thumbnails so you will know everthing is recording O.K.

Cheers Vaughan

more than likely the this cam will feature the same media management as its bigger XDCamHD brothers. (ie thumbnails, tagging, logging etc etc
Consideirng the codec, format and recording media itself, it will more than likely behave pretty much the same as XDCam Discs behave to the point of being accessable through proxy to your NLE etc etc
I dont see why it wouldnt behave this way... its a great workflow (XDCam) and its already been established for over 2-3 years now prolly longer but right now im tired)

In regard to the zoom ratio, to be hoenst, most woudl find a wide angle far more useful than tele reach

IN addition, an OIS would be imperitive ans sony would do well if they take a leaf out of canons book.
My biggest fear for this unit is the lens itself. eng fujinon, we have seen how the JVCHD101's offering has fared over the seasons and to be honest, its far from impressive. heres hoping that the XDCam EX doesnt inherit the HD101's lens downfalls...

The card (like P2) is a solid state device, so the chance of it failing (if handled with reasonable care and not subjected to abuse by extremely hot hand-tools) are fairly low - lower than the chance of having a catastrophic failure of a miniDV tape, and CONSIDERABLY lower than the chance of getting a dropout (I would imagine)

But as Vaughan says it's always good to have a Force Majeure clause in your contract whether you're recording onto Flash Media Cards or Cardboard Punch Cards...

Possibly a little off topic, but for reference, ours Force Majeure clause includes "equipment malfunction" and "defective media" as two things that we cannot be held responsible for.

[not intended as legal advice]

It's the wide end that is more important to me. Has there been any info released on how wide the lens will go? I'd love to dump the wide adaptor too. As far as I'm aware, the HVX200 is the only camera in this price bracket with a reasonable wide end, so fingers crossed Sony will at least match it.

Hi Mike...nice bumping into you here. We plan to cut back on wedding video work for the coming year to start a new IT business here in the Florida Keys. We plan to use the XDcamEX for that. Our Z1U doesn't see much wedding action, but our DVX100's have held up well in this harsh enviroment. They have gotten a bit heat sensitive when used in direct sun with over 95 temp and high humidity. The XDcamEX will be a winner with the Smooth Shooter especially with the new SM arm upgrade.
Talk soon...
Best,
Craig Hollenback, Conch Republic Broadcasting.com

You are probably right
 

Giving it some thought you are probably all correct in saying that solid state would be more reliable than tape.

It great to be here and thanks to all for such a great forum!

My cams get really hot... bieng jet black and in the direct sunlight. I sometiems try to shield the tape area with my hand but it's probably a drop in the bucket heat wise.

I just thought about it when someone mentioned about recording something.... now we will be able to get rid of that rediculous sound isolation thing that takes up the shoe if you use a good shotgun mic...

No tape motor hum :) just keeps getting better! Anyone want to speculate what kind of lifespan one should count one with these units?

I am going to start a new thread on that subject.

Mike

xdcam dot com
 

In regard to the XDCAM EX -
Now due (in Australia at least) December.
The lens will definitely be Fujinon and likley to have the 35mm equivalent of a 30mm lens at the wide end.

MRW